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edit: revised the list.

So Ima be playing against new nids in a few days and i tryed to make a list that isnt super tailored to bug squashing, but able to deal with the threats presented by a lot of the new nid stuff. Lil bit of tactica after the list.

Eldrad 210

8x fire dragons in a wave serpent with tl scatterlaser & spirit stones. 253
8x fire dragons in a wave serpent with tl scatterlaser & spirit stones. 263

9x guardian jetbikes /w 3 shuricannons, + 1x jetlock with conceal 288
6x guardian jetbikes /w 2 shuricannons, + 1x jetlock with conceal 212
9x dire avengers /w exarch /w bladestorm and twincatapaults in wave serpent with tl scatter, shuricannon and spirit stones 275
9x dire avengers /w exarch /w bladestorm and twincatapaults in wave serpent with tl shuricannon and spirit stones 260

fire prism with spirit stones 125
fire prism with spirit stones 125

Basically eldrad will be hitching a ride in one of the fire dragons wave serpents, both of the dragon serpents will be going to lay the smack down on one of those annoying 6 wound mcs, usually there will be 2 within 24" of one of the serpents, So eldrad will be casting doom on both of the mcs, and guide on whatever, probably his group of fire dragons or wave serpent. Bteween the 2 groups of 8 bs4 meltaguns, one of which being miss reroll, all rerolling to wound, they should both defninitely kill a mc each without fail, itd take a insanely slowed amount of 1s to save the mc.


c&c please. its 1 point over as well ... i need to deal with that but heh thats really irksome.

Haven't seen the new Nids dex so just going off of conjecture.

Not enough anti swarm in the list. Fire dragons will get out and pop off their shots if they get in range... then die a terrible CC death. Eldrad attacted to the fire dragons will mean that your 8 dragons die and now you have a Ldr 2 to pass or Eldrad runs off the board or worse yet gets swept

Howling banshees looks good except warshout, passing ldr isn't hard.

Pathfinders I fear will get overrun pretty dang fast.

Storm guardians in this situation will actually prob be pretty good.

Falcon, not sure why you took this one. DA in a serpent seems better unless your hitting the Falcon with guide.

A single Fire Prism is always a sure fire fail. Take 2 Warwalkers with 2 Scatters per if your want anti swarm fire. If you do take the prism, take the SS off as they should serve no purpose if you playing your prism well.

What is the T on a warrior? Is it 4 or 5? If it's 5 then your banshees ain't killing squat. If it's 4... you are insane trying to go toe-to-toe with multi-wound HTH monsters with your banshees that will only wound 55% of the time.

Don't hit hitty things. Shoot the hitty things.

Banshees strike me as not a great choice against nids. Not good at all. I think you'll find DA at range with doom/guide bladestorm more effective vs. T4 warriors and any of the gaunts....

Against T5 i'd suggest ANY T6 weapon. Shuricannons are good while scatters are better (longer range). If you are going to fight in HTH think seer council. Wounding on a 2+ is sweet. Or include Yriel.

ender502

well, first of all eldrads attached to one of the dragons squads yea ... but why would you think id get him out with the dragons? no lol ... he stays in the serpent when the dragons bail out to their sure death, but that 130 points dying to 100% kill some 200+ point creature is a fair trade.

also the banshees will be charging into a unit thats been doomed, thats why they have a farseer with doom and RoWi tagging aliong, for the explicit purpose of making them kill a bunch of warriors. thats 6-8 wounds on the warriors before they got to attack on average~

Eldrad has to be attached to the unit and disembark with them I think?? I would check that, as for the list, NIdzilla may stomp the crap out of it, 1850 I can fit 5 MC's in a standard 1850 list, while takeing 4 troop choices. To many Hi str. Against a horde list, not near enough shots.

no he doesnt, hes an IC as long as he ends more than 2" away from the unit he was attached to in the movement phase he detaches, no need for ics to disembark with their unit.

Also, if youre taking 5 mcs in 1850 youre not a horde list, youre nidzilla, and 2 of your tervigons will die in my second shooting phase, or hive tyrant+ whatever else i send the fire dragons at. Heck it would be sweet if you take a tyrannofex, ill trade 120 points for 300 lol ...

Tyranids own fire dragons. A double wall of gaunts pretty much means you are getting now where near a MC... Much less clearing them so you can shoot at a MC. Oh, you do have the fire power to clean a large gaunt wall but it will involve 3 units (including your dragons)... I'm sorry to say the other nids will not be waiting idly by while you take them apart piece-meal.

Eldar work through combined arms..you need two units to really kill anything entirely...and you have to kill things entirely. The eldar do not win battles of numbers. But if you ar eusing 3 or more units just to crack an MC you are pretty much in trouble.

No, I don't think you rush out to get the nids...you wait for them to come to you. Your most mobile units will be counter charge versus outflanking genestealers and your own outflanking scatter laser walkers.

I'd be thinking about a second fireprism rather than the falcon.

As to the banshees. Well, there is a tactic for making them work as assaulters from a serpent but it really isn't all that good. Considering you need 2 turns to make your assault and you ar eup against an army with many expendable light troops..I doubt you will be getting off many (any?) charges against a competent player.

If eldrad wants to fire off his powers he will need to get out of the serpent.

I think you need to rethink your strategies and ask yourself...how could he mess me up? Counter than and you'llbe halfway to beating him.

Personally, i'd go radical and off the wall...vibrocannons....3 of em. Try something he REALLY isn't expecting.

ender502

How about

1 x Eldrad
2 x 10 Harlequins w/ kisses & shadow seer
1 x 9 Harlequins w/ kisses & shadow seer
2 x 1 Waveserpent w/ Spirit Stones & Shuriken Cannon
2 x 1 Waveserpent w/ Shuriken Cannon
3 x 10 Storm guardians w/ 2x flamers
3 x Wraithlord w/ Brightlance & Elm and 2 x flamers

12 flamers, 3 template weapons, not a ton of AT, just 6 str 8 shots, but nids don't have too many tanks :p And harlequins have so much combat juice, that with fortune and you have little to fear, provided you can outplay your opponent.

Eldrad does not need to get out to fire his powers, only to fire mind war and eldritch storm, the powers that are psychic shooting attacks.

Also a gaunt screen wont give a MC a cover save, i dont care if the dragons unit dies, if 120 points dies to kill a tervigon and then a bunch of gaunts nearby thats fine by me ...

You are thinking about screening units the wrong way, a proper Gaunt screen will make it difficult to get the Dragons into range, not give a cover save. With the right balance of Gaunts and MCs (particularly with more Gaunts spawning every turn) you can just make a wall of models which prevent the Fire Dragons from getting close enough to actually shoot the MCs (even if they tank shock).

However Fire Dragons are still the best Eldar elites slot option for most builds. I would be using them against the medium sized nids (Warriors, Zoanthropes etc) which they can instant kill now rather than the big bugs which you should be focusing on taking out from the start with longer range stuff.

Banshees are simply not worth it, the combination of not being able to assault out of the Serpent when it moves and the only access point being at the rear means that the Serpent will be close enough to assault if you expect to charge (disembark/fleet/assault is going to get you a bit more than 6" in front of the Serpent, well with potential charge range from the turn before). Against enemy units with fleet it becomes even harder as you can easily mess up your distances and end up with the access point blocked and you have to move and try again next turn. Also using them against Warriors of all things is really really not a good plan, 6-8 wounds is going to kill at most 2 warriors, maybe less if they properly equipped to spread the wounds around. As Warriors are most likely going to be running in 5+ man units, thats still at least 3 Warriors hitting back, you will lose a few Banshees yourself, they are fearless, might lose a wound to extra saves and then next turn you will die even without the Nid player sending something in to help as you don't have enough attacks to do enough damage.

Pathfinders are definitely not a good option, your chances of taking down one of the big bugs is not good, particularly if you factor in that you will get 2-3 turns of shooting with them before they are hit by the Gaunts and overrun or shot off the table (silly number of shots on some of the nid stuff means you will lose models as they are the only target for anything without anti tank weapons). I would swap both units out to take another Storm Guardian squad with the same loadout as the current one, you are mobile to keep away from the Gaunts, can still fire effectively against MCs, can fire more effectively against the Gaunts and when you choose to disembark will roast a Gaunt squad in one go.

Despite many people favoring the DAVU unit, I much prefer taking squads of 9 or 10 in a Serpent. Being this size means that they are actually large enough to be helpful if the transport is destroyed or they choose to disembark. Against nids this kind of unit will really help with thinning down the Gaunts.

Always take Prisms in pairs (or threes), they become exponentially more effective against any opponent. S10, even if its a small blast which can scatter off (unlikely with T/L BS4 though), is now really helpful against nids, as you can instant kill some of the bigger bugs pretty well and ignore any FNP rolls. At 2000pts I would be taking 3 to get a S8 AP2 Large Blast which is going to cause Warrior squads to hide in fear.

As an aside, relying on psychic powers against Nids is not a good idea as they have pretty good anti-psychic units.

Powerguy.... shred my list... let me know what you think. I'm not sold either way on 3 wraithlords or 3 fire prisms, both have plenty of Str8 shots. Or... 3 falcons come to think of it... except that falcons are more expensive than the rest. In any event I would run 3 of the same heavy slot.

I don't know the tyranids stas very well, but I'd use warp spiders. Heavy str 6 short range firepower. Ability to teleport out from close combat, shoot and charge.

Anti swarm... Uh, war walkers with 2 scatter lasers? Fire prism might be the best though. Support heavy weapons platforms maybe. They can hit very hard.

Sazzlefrats' army is really interesting.

In view of the posted army, I'd drop the Banshees and add another unit of Storm Guardians (with flamers) or Dire Avengers (with bladestorm) in a Serpent.
Banshees have a hard time in cc vs. Nids since the bugs have lots of attacks.
Starcannons are not a must-have. I'd replace them by scatter lasers or shuricannons. Multiply high-strength shots should decimate bugs (with weaker armor) quickly.
Another Fire Prism would be nice.

Sazzlefrats wrote:How about

1 x Eldrad
2 x 10 Harlequins w/ kisses & shadow seer
1 x 9 Harlequins w/ kisses & shadow seer
2 x 1 Waveserpent w/ Spirit Stones & Shuriken Cannon
2 x 1 Waveserpent w/ Shuriken Cannon
3 x 10 Storm guardians w/ 2x flamers
3 x Wraithlord w/ Brightlance & Elm and 2 x flamers

12 flamers, 3 template weapons, not a ton of AT, just 6 str 8 shots, but nids don't have too many tanks :p And harlequins have so much combat juice, that with fortune and you have little to fear, provided you can outplay your opponent.

I see 4 Wave Serpents, and only 3 squads that can actually buy one?

i have a 3k eldar force at home, and whenever i verse a nid army i always bring at least 1-2 squads of swooping hawks with exarch with a sun rifle, wall walkers are a good opp with twin linked scatterlasters 2 fire prisms are REALLY good, if not a MUST as for troops try jetbikes, and no fire dragons, and no templates in general, cus as you all know nids are almost entirely a cc race therefore you MUST take them from range, this is perfect as eldar have acess to scatterlasters. as for troops again, jetbikes and Avengers are a great choice especially avengers with bladestorm as for transporsts, unluess the board you are playing on boarders 150 inches you wont have much room to run, because again as you all know nids are a swarming race, so moove up quickly and drop back slowly. Hope this helps

if you dont take fire dragons you will NOT kill any of their mcs .... dire avengers guide and doomed bladestorming a 3+ t6 6 wound mc will mabye put 1-2 wounds on him, compared to one group of fire dragons nuking his face off 100% guaranteed killing that mc every time.

I think ima add a second fire prism and turn the banshees into a third group of fire dragons ...

In fact, a third unit of FD's in a Serpent (instead of the Banshees)
and a 2nd Fire Prism would improve the behavior of the army
at the battle field tremendously.
I'd think about giving the 2nd Farseer guide instead of doom,
just in case the FD's need to get the job done.
Remember that some of the new bug MC's have 6 wounds.

I like some of the list.

The howling banshees are fail against nids tho, our dedicated CC will get mauled by nids, dont even bother. Shoot the nids to death is how you will win, not in CC.

Star cannons are semi unnecessary. I see why you are taking them, to negate the 2+ save. but, im not sure its worth the points. and id probably take lances for a better strength, and the fact that when your not playing nids you can nuke heavy armor.

anyways, I like a lot of the suggestions above

ive revised the list and editted it into the first post.

the range of the fire pisms and their power can pretty much deal with the MC's however those MC's will be protected and you will need to dedicate troops to deal with them you must use range to your advantage, especially since eldar WILL get mauled in CC, may i suggest if anything 2 squads of deep striking warpies, and drop the dragons, draw his troops out then deep strike behind and deal with the buggers, that is why i also say take a squad of swooping hawks, as they have the mobility.
anyway remember his MC's have 3-4+ invulnerable saves, so the AP of your wepons arnt going to help, use wepons like the sun rifle fom memory assult 6 to inflict many shots and make him save as many wounds as possible, 2nd, fire dragons get too clost to the enemy, if they somehow fail, there gone :(

er ... no a zoanthrope has a 3++ save, ervigons/mawlocs/trygons dont get an invul.

9x guardian jetbikes /w 3 shuricannons, + 1x jetlock with conceal 288
6x guardian jetbikes /w 2 shuricannons, + 1x jetlock with conceal 212

Nids do not have many shooting weapons with AP 3 or better.
Therefore, I'd give the Jetlock embolden or destructor.

If you were to go all shooty you would need units with a range greater than the enemy movement and charge range. It doesn't do good to have to get into their charge range just so you can shoot. That helps them more than it helps you.

I don't know enough about the new tyranids to suggest specific strategys. Warp spiders maybe. move into the 12" shooting range and teleport back out in the assault phase. Rangers maybe? They have great range, not sure how much damage they could do though.

Warp Spiders are sweet.
I said it elsewhere: Once I battled Nids and when the first wave was close,
my Spiders moved 12'' into the swarm, shot a Warrior brood,
and then moved (2D6'') behind the Nids army into a building.
My opponent got nuts.

Yeah good catch, originally I was looking at 10 banshees with all the toys in place of the 9 harlequins. Banshees aren't bad, with doom you'll do 4-5 wounds on a t6 MC, mostly I was thinking they go first on the charge, and have enough attacks to quiet even large units of cheap bugs. For instance 30 termoguants attacking a fortuned unit of banshees, the math says I lose 2-3 girls, after I kill 10 of them.. if they were doomed, well I killl 15, and lose 2 girls in the process. And banshees can take a wave serpent.

The actual typo is there are 3 wave serpents, not 4.

Nivoglibina wrote:

Sazzlefrats wrote:How about

1 x Eldrad
2 x 10 Harlequins w/ kisses & shadow seer
1 x 9 Harlequins w/ kisses & shadow seer
2 x 1 Waveserpent w/ Spirit Stones & Shuriken Cannon
2 x 1 Waveserpent w/ Shuriken Cannon
3 x 10 Storm guardians w/ 2x flamers
3 x Wraithlord w/ Brightlance & Elm and 2 x flamers

12 flamers, 3 template weapons, not a ton of AT, just 6 str 8 shots, but nids don't have too many tanks :p And harlequins have so much combat juice, that with fortune and you have little to fear, provided you can outplay your opponent.

I see 4 Wave Serpents, and only 3 squads that can actually buy one?

I like the second list better. I'll second destructor or even embolden over conceal. I'd also consider splitting the 9 man squad into 2 or 3 smaller units. This way you can split your fire and take/contest multiple objectives.

Would that save you some points? If so consider an exarch for the dragons...even naked the extra WS is worth it.

ender502