Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

Dracon
Agoniser
Combat Drugs
Shadowfield
Plasma Grendes

Whyches x 7
Succubus
Agoniser
Whyche Weapons
Plasma Grenades
Raider

Warrior x 5
Dark Lance x 1
Raider

Warrior x 5
Dark Lance x 1
Raider

Warrior x 10
Dark Lance x 2

Warrior x 10
Splinter Cannon x 2
Blaster x 2

Warrior x 8
Sybarite
Agoniser
Raider

Ravager
2x Disintegrators

Total 990

I need some ideas for the last 10 points, changes can be made to the existing list. The Dracon should join with the Warrior Squad with Sybarite. I haven't tried this particular combination before as I tend to play larger games with Incubi. I only have access to 8 wyches and one ravager, other than those restrictions though I have a ton more warriors, Lord with Punisher, Incubi, Talos, Reavers. Haemy etc.

C/C Cheers.

edit: removed individual points values as per regulations.

Please don't post individual pt costs, its GW's intellectual property.
I'd give the Dracon a splinter pistol for an extra cc attack
and the Succubus a trophy rack.
The rest looks quite good.

Looking good, nicely varied list. You might want to consider giving the wyches blasters, its cheap and adds a good shot. Personally i prefer an archon over a dracon, i think the extra points are worth the extra stats.

Thanks for the responses.

Definitely need the Splinter Pistol, can't believe I forgot that. I'm not sure about an Archon in smaller games since for the extra 25 points you could have an Incubi which is 2 extra attacks (3 charging) an extra wound before shadowfield rolls with a 3+ save. I worked out if I drop 2 wyches, I can add a whole 'nother Cannon/blaster squad and a decent retinue 2x Incubi 4x Warrior. So the new list would be.

Dracon
Splinter Pistol
Agoniser
Combat Drugs
Shadowfield
Incubi x 2
Warriors x 4


Whyches x 5
Succubus
Agoniser
Whyche Weapons
Plasma Grenades
Raider

Warrior x 5
Dark Lance x 1
Raider

Warrior x 5
Dark Lance x 1
Raider

Warrior x 10
Dark Lance x 2

Warrior x 10
Splinter Cannon x 2
Blaster x 2

Warrior x 10
Splinter Cannon x 2
Blaster x 2

Ravager
2x Disintegrators

Total: 1000

Just wondering where the Dracon + retinue are going to be placed now? They probably need a raider of their own. I would probably drop one of the static warrior squads and get another 5 x Warrior raider squad too.

unbeliever has a good point - your Dracon needs a Raider. Clearly if you're dropping one of the footsloggin' squads you have to debate between the sniper or giving up one of your super gunboats.

I'd advocate dropping the sniper squad and trimming off the excess warrior in the retinue, which will give you the points to afford an additional mini sniper boat which will leave you with the same total number of lances on the field, but will be lances that can target different foes and will also mech up your Dracon.

Your Wyches could certainly benefit from getting some blasters on them. I would probably seriously consider dropping the plasma grenades off of them in order to get at least the one blaster as it will serve them better on a couple fronts - most importantly making them better able to multitask if you need some more anti-mech firepower. Plus, prior to a charge it's always nice to have a some blaster shots whittle down the opposing squad a bit.

Dracon
Splinter Pistol
Agoniser
Combat Drugs
Shadowfield
Warriors x 5
Raider

Whyches x 5
Succubus
Agoniser
Whyche Weapons
Plasma Grenades
Raider

Warrior x 5
Dark Lance x 1
Raider

Warrior x 5
Dark Lance x 1
Raider

Warrior x 5
Dark Lance x 1
Raider

Warrior x 10
Dark Lance x 2

Warrior x 10
Splinter Canon x 2

Ravager
2x Disintegrators

Total: 996

Right you are Unbeliever! Okay so I trimmed off the Incubi, and lost one Splinter Cannon squad and added a mini-sniper squad, and a Raider for the Dracon. Unfortunately I don't have any blasters for WYSIWYG wyches but I'm still considering dropping their plasma grenades (6 points) and using the spare 4 points to add Blasters to the Splinter Cannon squad. I'm just not sure how well anti-tank/MEQ weapons synergise with an anti-horde/infantry squad. Also Plasma Grenades have been very useful for assaulting into cover in the past.

Thoughts?

Mitch wrote:Unfortunately I don't have any blasters for WYSIWYG wyches but I'm still considering dropping their plasma grenades (6 points) and using the spare 4 points to add Blasters to the Splinter Cannon squad. I'm just not sure how well anti-tank/MEQ weapons synergise with an anti-horde/infantry squad. Also Plasma Grenades have been very useful for assaulting into cover in the past.

Thoughts?

To address your blaster/S.Cannon combo question. I run this particular combo quite often and swear by it. First off, you are correct, it's a bit of anti-mech in a unit meant to kill infantry. To a certain degree that's good because it allows the unit a wonderful thing known as options. Lances and blasters are equally amazing and terrible at killing vehicles and sometimes you just need the ability to shoot that Land Raider one more time to hopefully destroy it. Secondly, in addition to being anti-mech the Blaster is also anti-heavy armored infantry that operates with the same range as your gunboat. The optimal range for a gunboat is 12" because it allows the squad inside to rapid fire the target. You always want to be moving with your Raider so you don't often get to use/need the 24" range. What else has a 12" range? A blaster of course - and a blaster has something all the other weapons in your gunboat lack - the ability to eat through MEQ armor. Since the infantry you're shooting at will often have aa 3+ armor save the blaster is a good option to get a near guaranteed kill on the squad as long as you hit

Gunboat vs. MEQ (squad of 10 on gunboat - 2 S.Cannons 2 Blasters)

S.Cannons - 5.3 hit - 2.66 wound - .888 wound after armor save = 1 dead Marine
S.Rifles - 8 hit - 2.6 wound - .888 wound after armor save = 1 dead Marine
Blasters - 1.3 hit - 1.11 wound = 1 dead Marine

Gunboat vs. MEQ (squad of 10 on gunboat - 2 S.Cannons)

S.Cannons - 5.3 hit - 2.66 wound - .888 wound after armor save = 1 dead Marine
S.Rifles - 10.6 hit - 3.5 wound - 1.18 wound after armor save = 1 dead Marine

2 Blasters is better at killing marines then the 2 Splinter cannons or 6 splinter rifles (8 of them barely edges it out statistically) raising their kill ratio from 2.06 to 2.88 (basically one additional dead marine with every round of shooting) and also gives the squad the ability to threaten everything from Rhinos to Leman Russes to Landraiders. The squad also only becomes *slightly* less effective at killing GEQ. I think the advantages far outweigh the negatives and that's why I always use blasters.

As to your current list - the Dracon's boat is weak. Those warriors are serving no purpose other then to allow easy kills to help your opponent in combat resolution. That said, the extra Raider is very nice for you. At the very least I would take the 5 Warriors not as a retinue but as a Raider squad. This will make them scoring and will allow your Dracon to separate from them prior to assault which will make him more dangerous (or you could just put him in with the Wyches - though that is very all your eggs in one basket). I'd also probably switch him to a T.Helm and Punisher if you're going to run him like this to allow him to deal with squads of infantry - you probably have enough lances to deal with MCs.