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Hey again, I was thumbing through my codex some more and I found a few select areas that I would very much appreciate some clarification!

My first question series is concerning grenades--the 5th Edition Codex is very very vague at how these work, and I was hoping some light could be shed on how they work. Frag grenades for example, it says, loosely, "keeps your enemies heads down"...i'm not quite sure how to interpret that, haha. Do they do damage, like krak grenades or meltabombs, or something else...? Also...when may a unit use these grenades, and, how many times may they be used? (Once per turn use? Once per the entire game?) And talking about about such things as melta bombs and krak grenades..when may they be used? Can they be used in the assault phase..? Shooting phase? Do you get to attack a unit, then use a grenade, so long as you're 1" within the vehicle?

My second little series of questions is much shorter, i'm just a bit confused as to how in close combat, units may assault "at the same time". If a two squads each, all members of each with 5 initiate engage in close combat, how would they all attack at once?

Thanks again for reading my questions, I look forward to any help on the issue . Sorry again for being noob at the rules ><. At least i'm a lore geek .

The grenade rules are quite clear.
Try re-reading BRB pg 36 "GRENADES" section.

For example the assault grenade rules are the last three sentences only.

To you're second question look up BRB pg 33 ASSAULT PHASE SUMMARY

Clarification: Identical initative models attack at the same time in every combat. Both friendlies and enemies.

Frag grenades are used when an assaulting unit assaults through cover (anything that causes a difficult terrain test). The frag grenades allow you to avoid striking at Init 1 (the penalty for assaulting through cover). You can use them as many times as you want during the game (barring a special rule in your codex that says otherwise).

Grenades can also be used when assaulting a vehicle to determine armor penetration instead of using your models S+d6. I don't have my book in front of me, but when you look at the rules for grenades in there, there's a little box that tells you what to roll vs the vehicle. You must be in base contact with the vehicle to use grenades.

I believe the assault rules cover assaults "at the same time." Basically, just let one side roll first (for simplicity), but remember that any casualties taken on the defending side still get to strike back if they were close enough to begin with.

Let's expand on your example, Tac Squad A assaults Tac Squad B. Everyone ends up in base to base contact. Both squads have the same init, so will strike at the same time. So, the players decide to let Tac Squad A make his attack rolls first. Let's say that Tac Squad A kills 3 members from Tac Squad B. Now, since they're at the same init, those 3 "dead" guys get to attack b/c they haven't died yet. So, Tac Squad B makes their attacks and kill 1 member from Tac Squad A. Casualties are then removed and Tac Squad B loses by 2.

VxKhamulxV wrote:Hey again, I was thumbing through my codex some more and I found a few select areas that I would very much appreciate some clarification!

My first question series is concerning grenades--the 5th Edition Codex is very very vague at how these work, and I was hoping some light could be shed on how they work. Frag grenades for example, it says, loosely, "keeps your enemies heads down"...i'm not quite sure how to interpret that, haha. Do they do damage, like krak grenades or meltabombs, or something else...? Also...when may a unit use these grenades, and, how many times may they be used? (Once per turn use? Once per the entire game?) And talking about about such things as melta bombs and krak grenades..when may they be used? Can they be used in the assault phase..? Shooting phase? Do you get to attack a unit, then use a grenade, so long as you're 1" within the vehicle?

Not sure what you mean when you say the 5th Edition Codex, do you mean the main rulebook?

Either way Assault and Defensive grenades are outlined on page 36 of the Main Rulebook, and using grenades on vehicles (this is the only way to use krak grenades and melta grenades etc.) is covered on page 63. You can use grenades as many times as you want, they don't run out, you can also use them more than once per turn, although you can't use them to do the same thing more than once per turn, so you could use Frag grenades when assaulting a Walker so that you don't suffer the Initiative penalty and then use them again in the assault for a single attack at 4+D6, but could not use multiple grenades to attack a vehicle, or make multiple grenade attacks in a single assault phase in any way.

VxKhamulxV wrote:My second little series of questions is much shorter, i'm just a bit confused as to how in close combat, units may assault "at the same time". If a two squads each, all members of each with 5 initiate engage in close combat, how would they all attack at once?

I'm not exactly sure what you are asking here, only one unit may make an assault move at a time, if you mean resolving attacks at the same time, Every model with the same initiative attacks at once. All that means is that, if a model is killed by someone with the same initiative as it, it will still get it's attacks.

If you re-word this question I might be able to help more.

zatchmo wrote:Frag grenades are used when an assaulting unit assaults through cover (anything that causes a difficult terrain test). The frag grenades allow you to avoid striking at Init 1 (the penalty for assaulting through cover). You can use them as many times as you want during the game (barring a special rule in your codex that says otherwise).

Grenades can also be used when assaulting a vehicle to determine armor penetration instead of using your models S+d6. I don't have my book in front of me, but when you look at the rules for grenades in there, there's a little box that tells you what to roll vs the vehicle. You must be in base contact with the vehicle to use grenades.

I believe the assault rules cover assaults "at the same time." Basically, just let one side roll first (for simplicity), but remember that any casualties taken on the defending side still get to strike back if they were close enough to begin with.

Let's expand on your example, Tac Squad A assaults Tac Squad B. Everyone ends up in base to base contact. Both squads have the same init, so will strike at the same time. So, the players decide to let Tac Squad A make his attack rolls first. Let's say that Tac Squad A kills 3 members from Tac Squad B. Now, since they're at the same init, those 3 "dead" guys get to attack b/c they haven't died yet. So, Tac Squad B makes their attacks and kill 1 member from Tac Squad A. Casualties are then removed and Tac Squad B loses by 2.

This cleared it up for me, thanks! I had read all of this but I guess some of it slipped while trying to take it all in. See, i've yet to actually play a game (I'm still in the process of painting my models) so my experience is pretty non existent. Thank you and thanks to everyone else for helping with the replies! Also, I was getting a bit confused because I had read some forums elsewhere where they had said defending units were given 10 initiative...I suppose this might have been a 4th Edition rule.
Edit: @Drunkspleen yeah, I had meant the main rulebook..a few things slipped by me, but everyones answers have helped clarify things a ton for me

Defending units haviong their initiative raised is a 4th edition of 40k rule - now the attacker has their initiative lowered.

Which is a wonderful and much needed change that breaks Banshee Masks

Gwar! wrote:Which is a wonderful and much needed change that breaks Banshee Masks

*grumble grumble* i'll just take harlequins instead...

I don't think I've ever seen it played that Banshees don't strike first.

MasterSlowPoke wrote:I don't think I've ever seen it played that Banshees don't strike first.

That's because you don't play by the rules RABBLE RABBLE RABBLE!

MasterSlowPoke wrote:I don't think I've ever seen it played that Banshees don't strike first.

Banshees strike at I=10
Banshees ignore bonus's for cover and grenades.
So Banshees (as it sadly is now) still receive the negative effects when charging through cover.

But most people agree in my FLGS that they are always I=10 in first round of combat as that was what the RAI were in the last edition.

Simple change to Banshees ignore *modifiers* for cover and grenades.
Either that or count Banshee masks as frag grenades also (so strike at normal I, which in the first round, is 10)

It's also not a stretch to say that defending units still get a bonus for being in terrain - the modifier affects the attacker but the defenders clearly benefit.