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As per title!

Yes and No

It may be intended to stack but without clearly stating it doesn't. Eldar autarch get a stack but IG don't.

No, it doesn't.

See my Tyranid FAQ for more details

Hmmm well lets say you take 2 tyrants with hive commander, 2 units would get outflank wouldn't they no questions asked. If the half the ability works twice then shouldn't the other one? I know the Eldar Aurtach does actually say it doesn't stack.

Thanks for the FAQ Gwar! I've been on your site and had a a look at a few. However, no offense but I'll wait until GW comes up with it or can be definate in rules. Your FAQ's are just a matter of opinion with good logic lol.

mercer wrote:Hmmm well lets say you take 2 tyrants with hive commander, 2 units would get outflank wouldn't they no questions asked. If the half the ability works twice then shouldn't the other one? I know the Eldar Aurtach does actually say it doesn't stack.

Thanks for the FAQ Gwar! I've been on your site and had a a look at a few. However, no offense but I'll wait until GW comes up with it or can be definate in rules. Your FAQ's are just a matter of opinion with good logic lol.

I'm firmly in the 'shrug your shoulders and guess' camp. GW swung the pendulum to each extreme with regards to Eldar Autarchs and IG Fleet officers that I've no idea how they'll rule here. This is one of the very few times where I'd either dice for it, or take the less 'advantageous' route and wait for an official FAQ.

-Yad

mercer wrote:Hmmm well lets say you take 2 tyrants with hive commander, 2 units would get outflank wouldn't they no questions asked. If the half the ability works twice then shouldn't the other one? I know the Eldar Aurtach does actually say it doesn't stack.

Thanks for the FAQ Gwar! I've been on your site and had a a look at a few. However, no offense but I'll wait until GW comes up with it or can be definate in rules. Your FAQ's are just a matter of opinion with good logic lol.

Because the rules are different? The Outflank part says "if A Hive tyrant", while the Reserve part states "If THE Hive Tyrant".

For the reserve rolls, it's like this:
Roll Reserve Dice
Hive Tyrant 1 says "Add 1 to reserves"
Hive Tyrant 2 Says "Add 1 to reserves"
You add 1 to reserves
Hive Tyrant 1 asks "Have you added 1 to reserves? Yes? Good."
Hive Tyrant 1 asks "Have you added 1 to reserves? Yes? Good."

It says if A hive tyrant has hive commander.....both my tyrants have hive commander. Its not saying two seperate rules, its saying if the hive tyrant has this, then it can do x and in addition do y also.

Using the example you said tyrant 1 adds +1 reserves, then tyrant 2.

I guess we'll wait and see what G.W says in a few months time.

Thanks!

I would guess it doesn't stack, but GW could say it does in an FAQ and I wouldn't be surprised.

Gwar! wrote:For the reserve rolls, it's like this:
Roll Reserve Dice
Hive Tyrant 1 says "Add 1 to reserves"
Hive Tyrant 2 Says "Add 1 to reserves"
You add 1 to reserves
Hive Tyrant 1 asks "Have you added 1 to reserves? Yes? Good."
Hive Tyrant 1 asks "Have you added 1 to reserves? Yes? Good."

If you followed this the following could happen:
Roll Reserve Dice.
Hive Tyrant says "Add 1 to the reserve roll".
Officer of the Fleet says "Subtract 1 from the reserve roll".
You add 0 to reserve roll.
Hive Tyrant asks "Have you added 1 to reserves? No? Fail."
Officer of the Fleet asks "Have you subtracted 1 from reserves? No? Fail."

All modifiers are cumulative unless you are told otherwise. Two Hive Tyrants with Hive Commander are two separate entities and each add one to the reserve rolls.
This is much more correct:
Roll Reserve Dice.
Hive Tyrant 1 says "Add 1 to the reserve roll".
Hive Tyrant 2 says "Add 1 to the reserve roll".
You add 1 to the reserve roll for each Hive Tyrant adding up to a total modifier of +2.
Hive Tyrant 1 asks "Have you added 1 to the reserve roll for my Hive Commander special rule? Yes? Good."
Hive Tyrant 2 asks "Have you added 1 to the reserve roll for my Hive Commander special rule? Yes? Good."

Exactly how I thought it was. It would be the same combination if you had a lictor and hive commander, though lictor wouldn't take affect until turn 3 (if it can one turn 2) and with hive commander would be 2+ anyway.

No difference between 2 hive tyrants and a tyrant and a lictor.

As i said both yes and no. We have a near identical version in IG where they don't stack and In the eldar codex we have a near identical version where they do. The only difference is the Autarch specifically mentions that it stacks if you have 2.

does he have to be on the board? Can he be kept in reserve and still get the +1? The lictor can so i am assuming he can also. All it states is he need be alive.

Arrrgh not that again!

--Cries as the memories of the IG Clusternuggets come flooding back--

Webbe wrote:
If you followed this the following could happen:
Roll Reserve Dice.
Hive Tyrant says "Add 1 to the reserve roll".
Officer of the Fleet says "Subtract 1 from the reserve roll".
You add 0 to reserve roll.
Hive Tyrant asks "Have you added 1 to reserves? No? Fail."
Officer of the Fleet asks "Have you subtracted 1 from reserves? No? Fail."

The game doesn't tell you to add zero, it tells you to add 1 and then subtract 1.

Let me fix this for you.

If you followed this the following could happen:
Roll Reserve Dice.
Hive Tyrant says "Add 1 to the reserve roll".
Officer of the Fleet says "Subtract 1 from the reserve roll".
You add 1 to reserve roll.
You subtract 1 to reserve roll.
Hive Tyrant asks "Have you added 1 to reserves? Yes."
Officer of the Fleet asks "Have you subtracted 1 from reserves? Yes."

Yes you are correct, that's the way to do it. But that doesn't follow the reasoning procedure I quoted. That's why I disputed it.

The modifiers come from different Tyrant models and are therefore different modifiers and each need to be satisfied on their own.

A different analogy would be Ragnar Blackmane assaulting (using War Howl which gives Furious Charge) and only get Strength 5 as both modifiers from Furious Charge and Frost blade are satisfied by a single +1.
This is of course equally wrong.

Webbe wrote:Yes you are correct, that's the way to do it. But that doesn't follow the reasoning procedure I quoted. That's why I disputed it.

The modifiers come from different Tyrant models and are therefore different modifiers and each need to be satisfied on their own.

A different analogy would be Ragnar Blackmane assaulting (using War Howl which gives Furious Charge) and only get Strength 5 as both modifiers from Furious Charge and Frost blade are satisfied by a single +1.
This is of course equally wrong.

while i agree completely with the logic ... Games workshop makes the rules and in the case of reserve rolls the answer is yes for eldar and no for IG ... i would be amazed if Tyranids din't get ruled the same way as IG ... if only becuase the to codexs are only a few months apart.


... Then again GW make the rules and they are never one for consitency ... maybe nids wont be answer at all

Webbe wrote:Yes you are correct, that's the way to do it. But that doesn't follow the reasoning procedure I quoted. That's why I disputed it.

The modifiers come from different Tyrant models and are therefore different modifiers and each need to be satisfied on their own.

A different analogy would be Ragnar Blackmane assaulting (using War Howl which gives Furious Charge) and only get Strength 5 as both modifiers from Furious Charge and Frost blade are satisfied by a single +1.
This is of course equally wrong.

Errm... because Furious Charge and Frost Blades are different modifiers, while Hive Commander is the same as Hive Commander? By your logic, a Unit that has Furious Charge Twice somehow gets +2 S on the charge.

Gwar! wrote:

Webbe wrote:Yes you are correct, that's the way to do it. But that doesn't follow the reasoning procedure I quoted. That's why I disputed it.

The modifiers come from different Tyrant models and are therefore different modifiers and each need to be satisfied on their own.

A different analogy would be Ragnar Blackmane assaulting (using War Howl which gives Furious Charge) and only get Strength 5 as both modifiers from Furious Charge and Frost blade are satisfied by a single +1.
This is of course equally wrong.

Errm... because Furious Charge and Frost Blades are different modifiers, while Hive Commander is the same as Hive Commander? By your logic, a Unit that has Furious Charge Twice somehow gets +2 S on the charge.

Give a unit Adrenal Glands, then have Swarmlord use his ability to give it Furious Charge.

Tri wrote:

Webbe wrote:Yes you are correct, that's the way to do it. But that doesn't follow the reasoning procedure I quoted. That's why I disputed it.

The modifiers come from different Tyrant models and are therefore different modifiers and each need to be satisfied on their own.

A different analogy would be Ragnar Blackmane assaulting (using War Howl which gives Furious Charge) and only get Strength 5 as both modifiers from Furious Charge and Frost blade are satisfied by a single +1.
This is of course equally wrong.

while i agree completely with the logic ... Games workshop makes the rules and in the case of reserve rolls the answer is yes for eldar and no for IG ... i would be amazed if Tyranids din't get ruled the same way as IG ... if only becuase the to codexs are only a few months apart.


... Then again GW make the rules and they are never one for consitency ... maybe nids wont be answer at all

Well, the actual reason why it doesn't stack for IG according to the FAQ is "The confusion created by having so many advisors simultaneously vying for a Commander’s attention negates any potential benefit."

Duuh of course we should have known this. The eldar autarch's who don't have any advisors and are just using their innate intelligence, obviously they aren't going to suffer from this confusion.

I mean sheesh its pretty obvious right?

So we can easily solve this issue but you'll need two people at least, so grab a friend. Everybody close your eyes and imagine you are a hive tyrant, now your friend should also do the same, if you have a third friend he can be a lictor. The best way to really get into the shoes (hooves?) of the hive tyrant is to start making sounds. Try for something bestial at first, throw your voice around, up down, squeaky, grunty. Now start slobbering a bit, throw some drool around.

Eventually you will find yourself in the zone, I don't know how, but you will know it when it happens. You won't be pretending to be the hive tyrant anymore you will BE the hive tyrant. At this point its time to get to work. You and your friends need to start thinking about strategy, think about the best strategies you can! Write them down on some paper with a crayon. Once everyone is done, swap pieces of paper with everyone.

Did it work? Were your strategies complementary with each other?

Heh.

Or you could roll a dice. Whatever floats your boat...

I believe that multiple tryants don't stack, let me explain.

The Astropath:Whilst that astropath is alive, you add 1 to any of your reserve rolls.in addition, if any of your units arrive by the out flank rule, you can reroll the dice to determine which board edge the these squads arrive from(P31)

The Tryant: if a hive tryant has the hive commander upgrade, a single unit of troops may outflank. whilst the hive tryant is alive you add 1 to your reserve rolls.(P34)

the only defernce between the two sentences is the word hive tryant and astropath, so as it stands since the astropath doesnt add 1 then i would expect the tryant not to add one. I may be wrong if the autarch has the same exact wording as these (i dont know since i dont own a eldar codex).

The thing im wondering is what exactly is a "troop", does it mean a troop choice? or does it "troops" refer to a single non vechicle unit?

tacooo wrote:The thing im wondering is what exactly is a "troop", does it mean a troop choice? or does it "troops" refer to a single non vechicle unit?

It Refers to a unit that occupies a Troops FoC Selection.

The actual rule, letter for letter, says:
If a Hive Tyrant has the Hive Commander upgrade, a single unit of Troops may outflank.

Note that Troops is Capitalised.

tacooo wrote:I believe that multiple tryants don't stack, let me explain.

The Astropath:Whilst that astropath is alive, you add 1 to any of your reserve rolls.in addition, if any of your units arrive by the out flank rule, you can reroll the dice to determine which board edge the these squads arrive from(P31)

The Tryant: if a hive tryant has the hive commander upgrade, a single unit of troops may outflank. whilst the hive tryant is alive you add 1 to your reserve rolls.(P34)

the only defernce between the two sentences is the word hive tryant and astropath, so as it stands since the astropath doesnt add 1 then i would expect the tryant not to add one. I may be wrong if the autarch has the same exact wording as these (i dont know since i dont own a eldar codex).

The Autarch has exactly the same wording, but in their FAQ it says they stack. I would assume that they won't stack until the FAQ comes out.

This is a situation similar to "always hit on 3+ in combat" wargear when attacking vehicles - every time they make one they end up errataing it when the FAQ comes out. Why they don't learn their lesson and make it clear to begin with I have no idea.

You can still get a +3 anyway. Hive Tyrant's, The Swarmlord and Lictors/Deathleaper all have different abilities that add +1 to rolls.

You don't need Lictors, unless one of your Tyrants dies before turn three. You can't get the Lictor bonus on turn two, and by turn three the +2 from a Tyrant and Swarmlord give bring in reserves on a 1+.

Aduro wrote:You don't need Lictors, unless one of your Tyrants dies before turn three. You can't get the Lictor bonus on turn two, and by turn three the +2 from a Tyrant and Swarmlord give bring in reserves on a 1+.

i had been wondering about that myself the only way it would be any use is if you got +1 the turn it came in meaning that it was more likely your army arrive with it.

Additional Q for Hive Commander:

Do you get the bonus if you hold your Hive Tyrant in reserve?

Cheers,

-FW

FoolWhip wrote:Additional Q for Hive Commander:

Do you get the bonus if you hold your Hive Tyrant in reserve?

Cheers,

-FW

yes it only stops working when he's dead

Just remember that this is different to the Lictor, which only works if the Lictor is on the board.

Of course. But this means my massively expensive flying hive tyrant of doom can DS in with bonus to his reserves roll.