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I know that you still function as though you were inside a unit during a challenge - if your unit flees during a challenge, your challenger goes with it. However, do you count as being within base-to-base with your unit?

I want to say "No", as when you declare a challenge the models are separated from their units and put aside - your character in base-to-base with their character - and any models that could only attack due to being in base-to-base with your character are discounted this round of combat. However, it is not a sure thing - some people (I am not sure if this is due to simplicity, or due to not actually needing to make the move) do not remove their models from their units during a challenge, and just roll it out separately before the rest of the unit fights.

I'm curious to DakkaDakka's stance on the matter: Does a Challenge separate you from contact with your own unit, when it comes to base-to-base purposes?

IIRC moving the models aside is only for reference purposes so it can be easily assertained that the models are in a challenge.
I do not believe it has any other affect, and the models should be treated as being in contact with their own units.

It is only for reference purposes, you are replaced (if you moved) where you left the unit, and flee with them

Minsc wrote:I'm curious to DakkaDakka's stance on the matter: Does a Challenge separate you from contact with your own unit, when it comes to base-to-base purposes?

No.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

Minsc wrote:I want to say "No", as when you declare a challenge the models are separated from their units and put aside - your character in base-to-base with their character

This statement is not supported by the rules. See p.77, Fighting a Challenge: "...the character that accepted the challenge is moved in the ranks so that the two protagonists are opposite one another. If this is not possible, then the challenger is moved in the ranks to a position where he is in base contact with the character who accepted the challenge." (Italics mine.)

I know that we used to remove the character models from the units for convenience's sake, as a reminder that a challenge was underway. I think one of the previous editions of the rules even recommended doing so, in the interest of clarity. But the current rules make no mention of it at all- I confess I was surprised. Even in the old days though, the models were still 'in the ranks'; moving them around was for the benefit of the players, and did not represent actual changes on the battlefield. The minute the challenge was resolved, the victor was replaced in the position he started from.

Pulling the challengee over into base contact is a tactic in its own right, as it can deny the rest of the unit attaks, put the enemy character into a position they don't necessary want to be in, etc. AND do note that challengers with magic items or abilities that affect all enemy in base contact with them do not only hit the other model in the challenge, but all enemy actually in base contact within the unit, as if the challenge were not happening. For just two examples, see the Destroyer of Eternities or the Bloodskull Pendant.

I do have a question about challenges in a multi-unit combat. Where does the challengee move if it cannot physically move into base-to-base with the challenger?

Situation 1:


Let's pretend that somehow blue gets to challenge first (there are other ways to set this situation up, probably better than this one!) Here the challengee (red) cannot itself move into contact with the challenger (blue), but is the challenger actually under any compulsion by the rules to move into base? It seems only sensible that the challenger would move over to fight, but in doing so it loses its place on the end of the unit - a tactical hit if the character is especially tougher than the rest of the unit, but a boon if the character is more vulnerable to being assassinated by future flank charges.

Situation 2:


Here there is no physical way for the challengers to come into contact. Does a challenge even occur? Both characters are fighting in combat and so are legitimate challengers, but I have no idea where to proceed from that. This hasn't come up in game for me yet, but it's been in the back of my mind, particularly after picking up challenge-happy WoC

- Salvage

If the challenged model cannot move you move the challenger. BRB FAQ if memory serves.

If neeither can move neither move, but the challenge continues.

Ahhhh, FAQ indeed! Thanks Nosferatu. I didn't find the FAQ for the first situation, but I agree that one is pretty obvious that the challenger moves over. They're specific about the second one though:

Q. The rules for Challenges state that characters are
moved in the ranks so that the two protagonists are
opposite each other. In a large combat involving multiple
units on both sides, can a Challenge be fought between
characters which can't physically move into base to base
contact with the each other? If yes, how is this handled?

A. If such a rare case was to happen, we suggest using a
more abstract approach to resolving the challenge. Do
not move the characters at all, and just imagine they are
in base contact with each other.

()

- Salvage

The first situation is covered in the rules. If the challengee cannot move, move the challenger. See my post above, or p. 77 of the BRB.

*facepalm*

Thanks Fell, reading fail for the dreadnought I managed to misread that second line every time I came across it ...

- Salvage