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Does anyone here have experience using the Imperial Guard Colossus? I've been thinking about it, and it seems like an incredibly powerful vehicle, but I really don't see people using it that much. Is that just because the FW model costs 90 dollars and isn't called a Colossus, or is there some other reason that these don't come out to play more often?

colossus Range 24"-240" Str6 AP 3 Ordance Barrage 1, Large blast.,ignores cover@ 140pts (cannot direct fire)
vs
Basilisk Range 36"-240" Str9 AP 3 Ordance Barrage 1, Large blast@ 125pts (can direct fire)
or
Medusa Range 36" str10 AP 2 Ordance 1, Large blast@ 135pts

in short you can get better cheaper.

It seems to me that Ignores Cover would make up for it. Ignoring cover is *huge* in 5th edition, especially when it's coupled with AP 3.

Yeah but Minimum Range 24" means that they'll soon be too close to shoot, forcing you to re-deploy and lost valueble shots.

yes and no ... ignoring cover saves is great but you can get a similar effect with barrage weapons (like basilisk) ...
But what the others do better is that they can be used against high AV targets and Instant Death T4.

I guess its just multi functionality that wins people over to the others. Colossus is only really useful at killing MEQ ... its not like guard are lacking in MEQ killing weapons.

Depends on the game and mission. On a "normal" table the limitations on range and shooting can cause serious problems. But on games using a larger table ( Planetstrike/Apocalypse/own special scenario) the Colossus can shine. AP3 + Ignores Cover= lots of dead enemies. It is the perfect long range MEQ killer.

Our group used two of them on a recent 3 vs 3 scenario game. They "payed their points back" so to speak by sitting way back ( outside the Marines Lascannons range ) and lobbing a nonstop barrage on their positions. The opponents finally had enough and solved the problem by sending a teleporting Terminator squad and two SW Scout squads to eliminate them .

Tri wrote:yes and no ... ignoring cover saves is great but you can get a similar effect with barrage weapons (like basilisk) ...
But what the others do better is that they can be used against high AV targets and Instant Death T4.

In practice, I find that probably 85% of terrain is considered area terrain and provides protection from normal barrage weapons. While barrages are good for negating intervening units, most battlefields I've been on predominantly use ruins, forests, and similar terrain features.

Tri wrote:I guess its just multi functionality that wins people over to the others. Colossus is only really useful at killing MEQ ... its not like guard are lacking in MEQ killing weapons.

In point of fact I find that this is not the case. In my Space Marine army, I frequently have Combat Squads with heavy weapons standing in the backfield to claim "home objectives" and engage the enemy at range. These squads are rarely if ever destroyed by enemy firepower. In practice, the 3+ cover granted by Bolster Defenses and the (incorrect) perception of these units as "unthreatening" prevents most "MEQ-killing weapons" from engaging them effectively. If the opponent does decide to focus-fire on these squads, they can always go to ground for 2+ cover saves. While many weapons *can* wound them on 2+, their strong cover saves prevent these weapons from being particularly efficient.

A Colossus, would be extremely efficient against these units and similar "objective campers," killing all models hit on a straight 2+ regardless of cover. The minimum range is not a huge issue when one focuses on knocking squads off distant objectives, and can be compensated for with proper deployment anyway. Further, the Colossus isn't even particularly bad against vehicles-- 6+2d6 pick highest against side armor is better than one might think, with a 5/9 chance of damaging a Rhino/Razorback/Vindicator/Whirlwind/Predator and a 3/4 chance of damaging a Chimera-chassis vehicle, Land Speeder, Trukk, etc. The Colossus also pierces KFFs thanks to Ignores Cover. Overall, I think that Ignores Cover is so powerful that it makes up for any other deficiencies the Colossus may have.

Fetterkey as i said ignoring cover is good but every way i look at it basilisk is better, It gives you a more versatile weapon...

you can wound all Nids on a 2+
you can Pen AV12-14 (at best Str 6 glances av12)
you can fire directly
you can instant death T4

... Now you asked why you don't see it much and that it. I recommend you proxy a list with them and then try it with basilisks. Then you might understand.

The Basilisk is half or less than half as good as the Colossus against enemies hiding in area terrain. IG has other tools for dealing with vehicles, Tyranid monsters, and inflicting Instant Death on T4. What else is going to reliably kill Marines in area terrain?

Fetterkey wrote:The Basilisk is half or less than half as good as the Colossus against enemies hiding in area terrain. IG has other tools for dealing with vehicles, Tyranid monsters, and inflicting Instant Death on T4. What else is going to reliably kill Marines in area terrain?

Lots of multilasers.

3+ save is not invincible.

The Guard codex has tons of transport-destroying weaponry in the troop and FA slots, so it's not like Collosi won't have a chance to do their job effectively, but I think the min range and "cannot fire directly" really hurts it.

If my opponent really wants to move their transports slowly while in midfield so that each one can kill less than half of a Marine (even less if I go to ground), that's fine with me.

I'd rather have two Hydras hosing backfield combat squads (with the added bonus of cracking rhinos) than the Colossus. Greater versatility in target selection and still quite capable of plinking 2 Marines a turn, which is about what you'll average on the Colossus after figuring in scatters.

The problem with the colossus is the meta. There is simply not that many MEQ armies with folks standing outside at long range in most places. There is just so many armies where all the points is used to squeeze in extra Raiders, THSS, landspeeders, oblits, and so on. The thing is that with the end of 5man las/plas type units, most MEQ just don't do long range shooting that well to be used as a cost effective firebase so they are not taken for that.

If Wolves LF missile spam lists become common, the colossus would be very handy to have....

Even then I don't think so, not really. That sort of list has so many heavy weapons that they don't lose much by putting the Colossus as their number one priority.

The Colossus can deploy out of sight or out of range, though, which is also an advantage it has over the Hydra. It's possible that the meta or whatever just doesn't reward taking a Colossus. All I know is that my army would be more afraid of it than almost any other Imperial Guard vehicle out there.

I think the Colossus is a specialized artillery piece, and so it comes at a cost (in price, minimum range, and no direct fire). While their are more versatile pieces for less, it's the only pieplate in our codex that ignores area cover, if memory serves, and that counts for something. Probably better the higher the points, and like was said, the bigger the board.

murdog wrote:
I think the Colossus is a specialized artillery piece, and so it comes at a cost (in price, minimum range, and no direct fire). While their are more versatile pieces for less, it's the only pieplate in our codex that ignores area cover, if memory serves, and that counts for something. Probably better the higher the points, and like was said, the bigger the board.

The eradicator nova cannon also is a large blast that ignores cover and is s6, although its only ap4.

Sounds like a Cities of Death kinda vehicle.

IDK, Its pretty hard to beat the basilisks, plus the range of that weapon is just too close for comfort with all the meltaguns floating around in the game.


Looks fun to model and paint though.

Volkan wrote:

murdog wrote:
I think the Colossus is a specialized artillery piece, and so it comes at a cost (in price, minimum range, and no direct fire). While their are more versatile pieces for less, it's the only pieplate in our codex that ignores area cover, if memory serves, and that counts for something. Probably better the higher the points, and like was said, the bigger the board.

The eradicator nova cannon also is a large blast that ignores cover and is s6, although its only ap4.

I think that eradicators are better overall.

Fetterkey wrote:The Colossus can deploy out of sight or out of range, though, which is also an advantage it has over the Hydra.

Hydras have a pretty easy time deploying out of range.

sourclams wrote:

Fetterkey wrote:The Colossus can deploy out of sight or out of range, though, which is also an advantage it has over the Hydra.

Hydras have a pretty easy time deploying out of range.

Not in my experience, except perhaps for Spearhead missions.

Fetterkey wrote:

sourclams wrote:

Fetterkey wrote:The Colossus can deploy out of sight or out of range, though, which is also an advantage it has over the Hydra.

Hydras have a pretty easy time deploying out of range.

Not in my experience, except perhaps for Spearhead missions.

But Hydras can also be reserved and fire at full effect the turn they enter play.

To the best of my knowledge, Hydras that move fire at slightly less than half effectiveness.

Fetterkey wrote:To the best of my knowledge, Hydras that move fire at slightly less than half effectiveness.

How come?

Edit: NVM because they have two weapon systems. It wouldn't be "slightly less than half" it would be exactly half effectiveness.

willydstyle wrote:

Fetterkey wrote:To the best of my knowledge, Hydras that move fire at slightly less than half effectiveness.

How come?

Edit: NVM because they have two weapon systems. It wouldn't be "slightly less than half" it would be exactly half effectiveness.

You miss out on one set of autocannons and the heavy bolter. The heavy bolter is often out of range or unlikely to hurt your target, however, which is why it's only slightly less than half as effective.