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ok i just played a game today agains space wolfes and a moment came up that im unsure about. here goes.

his men behind 2 rinos, and my leman russ battle tank is on a hill raised up, his rinos have there side armor facing my tank. now can i fire at the men behide the rinos? he said that i couldnt as the tanks were the same hight, but as im on a hill and raised up cant i hit the men behind?

munkeey wrote:ok i just played a game today agains space wolfes and a moment came up that im unsure about. here goes.

his men behind 2 rinos, and my leman russ battle tank is on a hill raised up, his rinos have there side armor facing my tank. now can i fire at the men behide the rinos? he said that i couldnt as the tanks were the same hight, but as im on a hill and raised up cant i hit the men behind?

If the tank can see the men, it can fire.

If it can't, it can't.

If you can draw LOS to them, you can shoot them.

If they are partially obscured, they get a cover save.


I would recommend having a read of the LOS rules starting on page 16 of the rulebook.

im awear of the LOS rule but when he said about the tanks being the same hight it threw me off

To elaborate on the two previous posts, you have to get down and look from behind your tank. If any part of the guys behind the Rhino are visible when you trace a line from the weapon mount on the Leman Russ you can target them.

If they are not fully visible they will get a cover save per the rulebook. I believe a vehicle offers a 4+ cover save but check the chart in the book.

But as a general rule in 5th Edition, if you can see it you can shoot it.

okies thanks, i did think it was a bit odd that i couldnt shoot, i wont be such a push over next time

Pick up a cheap laser pointer somewhere. It eliminates all the "You can't see me so you can't shoot me" problems. Aim it from your weapon or your model. If you light up the enemy, you own him.

Also of note is that you have to be able to see the actual body of the guys. A chainsword sticking up over a tank, a gun barrel, or the backpack doesnt count.

I grappled the shoggoth wrote:Also of note is that you have to be able to see the actual body of the guys. A chainsword sticking up over a tank, a gun barrel, or the backpack doesnt count.

This is very true. Ive seen some people get incredibly pissed because they SWEAR they can shoot at a unit, simply because a back banner is sticking up over some ruble.

I had a guy claim cover save on a rhino. My lazerback (tm) was shooting it, and his sergeant was holding a chainsword up high. that chainsword was in the way.

KingCracker wrote:

I grappled the shoggoth wrote:Also of note is that you have to be able to see the actual body of the guys. A chainsword sticking up over a tank, a gun barrel, or the backpack doesnt count.

This is very true. Ive seen some people get incredibly pissed because they SWEAR they can shoot at a unit, simply because a back banner is sticking up over some ruble.

Or when my little spikey bit on my defiler is protruding above a building.

"Ok, but I get a cover save and next turn I can fire from that point b/c I'll be Merry Poppins my gf's with a in the before I let you my Defiler over b/c of a Spikey bit. "

I grappled the shoggoth wrote:I had a guy claim cover save on a rhino. My lazerback (tm) was shooting it, and his sergeant was holding a chainsword up high. that chainsword was in the way.

If the chainsword covered 50% of it, he would be right, same with a back banner, the things that can't be targetted can still interfere with LOS, which allows for wierd situations such as "what happens when a model is wrapped intirely inside it's own wings?".

If someone really wanted they could model a SM sergeant with a 1 foot high by 3 foot wide back banner to shield his whole army.

I grappled the shoggoth wrote:Also of note is that you have to be able to see the actual body of the guys. A chainsword sticking up over a tank, a gun barrel, or the backpack doesnt count.

The book says head, torso, arms and legs are all valid targets. It also says I only need to see one of the unit to fire at them. A chainsword sticking up over a tank could also mean the arm holding that chainsword is visible... and thus a valid target.

I'm with you on the banner and gun barrels though.

KingCracker wrote:This is very true. Ive seen some people get incredibly pissed because they SWEAR they can shoot at a unit, simply because a back banner is sticking up over some ruble.

Of course you can!

Gwar! wrote:

KingCracker wrote:This is very true. Ive seen some people get incredibly pissed because they SWEAR they can shoot at a unit, simply because a back banner is sticking up over some ruble.

Of course you can!

I was waiting for someone to link that comic...