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I want to start Khador, but I am being slightly turned off by the huge money investment.

It seems that if you really dont like the look of the caster in the starter box you are sort of boned.

Also I feel if I buy the starter box, I am getting a crapp old metal jack, when there is a new shiny plastic one out there that seems better in every way.
Does anyone have any suggestions, or am I basically bonned?

it doesn't help that the catser who appealed most to me is Karchev the Terrible, who retails for the same cost as the starter box :(

If the starter box had any other caster that that terrible girl model....sigh

Well if the only real issue is just the caster then you aren't looking at a huge investment. To be honest, Sorscha is a solid choice as far as gameplay and as far as a being a nice model. I say the only 'real' issue because the metal 'jacks in the starter box are fine models and easy to build(looking back I wish I'd bought the Khador starter set and not avoided the metal jacks). When I started my WM collection I chose to avoid the starter box and get two plastic 'jack sets because I was afraid the metal kits would be too fiddly to build. I bought the Cygnar starter box though I can tell you that the plastic models are no better than the metal ones. Privateer Press metals are well-casted, have almost no flash and fit together nicely. A little ball of green stuff and some super glue and your model is made in no time.

As far as wanting the $40 caster, what can I say- it's your choice. Almost every other Khador caster is around $10 or less, but if your heart is set on the most expensive one(by far) I don't think you have a right to be 'put off' by the investment imho. That's like saying: "I just turned 16, I want a car but I am not going to buy one because the price of the Ferrari put me off, so I am not going to invest at all". I mean, let's take Warhammer 40K, 'that other game'. If you were going to get started by buying a battleforce you'd be throwing down about $90 for an army that, in most cases, isn't even big enough to field in most games. I think WM is a far better investment from just about every angle.

In a short time I have invested a lot of money in WM, but I don't regret a single dollar spent. The quality of Privateer Press' miniatures is superb, the rules system is the best I've played in my 30 yrs. of gaming and the support materials(rulebooks, faction books, card decks) are lovingly made with lavish detail and care. As someone who used to be a 40K player, I think the game has everything that GW products don't.

Have to agree with gareson on this one...

Start with a battlebox and maybe vlad or butcher. play some games and see if you like the system and what you feel is missing from you list. Then add a 6man unit and solo's, to keep the cost down a bit. Eventually you will invest in the bigger stuff in no time...

Good luck...

I am actually in the same boat as Roleplayer. I want an all jack army with Karchev as the jackcaster. Getting the battle box and the plastic jack kit pretty much cuts the effective use of the plastic jack in half. Having the option of fielding either of the 4 configurations for the price of one is truly the best bang for your buck. The same way the battle box gets you the best value for your money as you are esentially paying for one jack at the same price and you get a warcaster and another jack for free. You might also look at the Grind Jacks and from the Warmachine forums, your contry has the only paint that will stick to those models as they are made of PVC and are flexible which would cause the normal acrylic paints to chip.

I appreciate your candor, and I think you raise a lot of good points!

Sadly, I likely wont be able to play any games until December, at the earliest. So whether or not the caster has a fun playstyle, or whether I like the mechanics of the game aren't really relevant to me.
I was mostly going to start a Khador force for the purpose of modelling.
I really liked their theme, and the look of the Iron Kingdoms universe.
I like the Cygnar the warcaster in the starter box, but the Cygnar Jacks just seem to turn me off.

I do appreciate your candor! I guess its just my own bad luck for being more of a modeller/painter than a gamer.
Looks and theme are far more important to me than any form of battlefield performance, which i guess is what is turning me off that female caster. Since I wont be playing any games until December/early next year (if I can convince my friends to play at all when I get back in Australia) its mostly down to what I'd be motivated to paint.
What drew me to Khador right away was the look of their jacks, which is why i sort of want an all jack army, and why that jack/warcaster pulled me in, so hard!
The plastic warjack in the end just looks better, I think. I'm not too concerned with fiddlyness, I've put together my fair share of metal GW kits now using greenstuff.
I was just concerned the orginal jacks seem to lack a lot of detail and size compared to the new plastic ones.
Is there no size/quality of mold, difference?

What I was considering to start with was the Beheamoth ($50), a plastic heavy jack($35), and the warjack caster ($45).

Oh well, guess I'll just have to suck it up

Roleplayer wrote:Is there no size/quality of mold, difference?

The old metal jacks are a bit smaller than the new plastic hotness. In addition at least the original molds for the khador jacks had what is called khador gap in the top of the carapace, which had to be fixed with putty. Otherwise the old ones are ok quality figs.

theres really nothing special about the starter set other than a different mold of a caster you dont seem to even like. i see no reason you cant just buy the plastic jacks and warcasters you like the appearance of. you wont get a discount but if you dont like the starter models its not a good deal for you anyway. buy the models you like!
also, the new rulebook showed a brand new sculpt for that caster that looks amazing in my opinion so if you ever do want her there will be a better version of her soon too.

Dais wrote:theres really nothing special about the starter set other than a different mold of a caster you dont seem to even like. i see no reason you cant just buy the plastic jacks and warcasters you like the appearance of. you wont get a discount but if you dont like the starter models its not a good deal for you anyway. buy the models you like!
also, the new rulebook showed a brand new sculpt for that caster that looks amazing in my opinion so if you ever do want her there will be a better version of her soon too.

Yeah, I've pretty much committed myself to buying them.

I'd love to get that extreme juggernaught, but the shipping PP charges to japan is quite insane, 33 dollars :(

On a different note, I have no idea about points costs.

Say i was to get a Plastic Heavy Jack, a Beheamoth and the warcaster, What points would that be around?

Not sure if these are the latest points but it should be within a point or two. Somewhere around 17 points depending on what jack you use from the plastic kit (Karchev +5, Beh - 13, heavies around 9)

On the modelling note, PPs metals are pretty nice, as said before, and I was actually unimpressed with the technical quality of the plastic helljack I just did. A weird plastic that plastic cement doesn't work on... bad mould lines that were in obvious spots instead of trying to work with the model. They come 'off the sprue' with some nubs left over from vents (I think) but where they broke off the sprue, there was some damaged plastic (ie white and rough area from breaking instead of cutting) that went below the level of everything else and couldn't be filed smooth. More conversion opportunity and I did a simple repositioning of a hard joint but a little annoying 'cause of the superglue. Even though they are a multipart plastic kit, they don't have a lot of parts. For me that kind of took away from some of the fun of plastics as there wasn't much more play in positioning then with the metal ones.

Well, buy what you want is most important...

check out this site:

http://www.maelstromgames.co.uk/

They do not charge shipping over 10 pounds. You will have to check if they ship to japan, but It might be worth it...

the extreme juggernaut:
http://www.maelstromgames.co.uk/index.php?act=pro&pre=prp_wmc_kdr_wjk_242_000
and destroyer:
http://www.maelstromgames.co.uk/index.php?act=pro&pre=prp_wmc_kdr_wjk_212_000

Yeah, ordering direct will get you a t-shirt and retail prices but if you order from discount places like maelstrom games (UK) or the war store (US), you get the product discounted but without the t-shirt. Maybe there is a local Japan distributor that gives cool discounts.

Warlord Imp wrote:Yeah, ordering direct will get you a t-shirt and retail prices but if you order from discount places like maelstrom games (UK) or the war store (US), you get the product discounted but without the t-shirt. Maybe there is a local Japan distributor that gives cool discounts.

Oh, the other stuff is going to be coming from Wayland Games for sure, but they dont currently stock the 'extreme' juggernaut.

For the list building and point amount checking take a look at this Forward Kommander. It is a nice model collection composition application for WM/ Hordes.

LordRavurion wrote:Well, buy what you want is most important...

check out this site:

http://www.maelstromgames.co.uk/

They do not charge shipping over 10 pounds. You will have to check if they ship to japan, but It might be worth it...

the extreme juggernaut:
http://www.maelstromgames.co.uk/index.php?act=pro&pre=prp_wmc_kdr_wjk_242_000
and destroyer:
http://www.maelstromgames.co.uk/index.php?act=pro&pre=prp_wmc_kdr_wjk_212_000

They do ship japan

Wow...I am soo outdated, PP went plastic?! Did the whole range of WM are plastic (eg-like the solos and units)?- or just the warjacks?

Just some stuff. (Warjacks and medium based infantry)

Most of it is still metal.

thats' a relief ..at least not all is plastic...was hoping to add more units to my khador again now i've got more free time to play. Reason I started was the metal minis..heheh

The Battle College recommends some alternative battle boxes. Really, to start out, all you're talking about is a couple of 'jacks and a 'caster.

The Juggernaut and the Destroyer really are two of the most solid 'jacks in the game and the Khador battle box was known as being heads above most of the others (even with getting hit by the nerfbat twice, Sorscha is still a fantastic warcaster). I find that I field those two, followed by the Kodiak, Berzerker and Behemoth, in that order. Not that the other Khador 'jacks aren't good--most of them really are (I'm curious to try the Marauder and the new buzzsaw-guy out now that the plastics are out) but those original two are so good you could play with them a lot against lots of multiple opponents and never need a second.

For starting casters, I would look at Vlad and the Butcher. Both very different, but also different from Sorscha (and Butcher has a sweet new sculpt out now). If you knew you wanted to go infantry heavy at some point I would suggest Irusk (my favorite) but if you're just starting out and trying things out I'd start small.

If you're comfortable as a hobbyist, pick up two of the plastic sets, some rare-earth magnets, and a 'caster of your choice (or two) and just go to town. That would give you, essentially, 8 warjacks (4 variations per box) and would allow you to explore the game pretty fully before deciding to invest in the game and go up to 25 or 35+ points.

I manged to trade/offer comission painting skills and have aquired the following in a trade, got it at a pretty decent rate for 40k stuff I didnt want/use anymore at all

Vlad.
The Butcher.
1 Juggernaught
2 Destroyers.
Kodiak.
Sprigan.
Berserker
Draco.

Demolition Sqaud.
Widowmakers.

I also ordered for myself, Karchev and a Beheamoth and the rulebook from Wayland Games.

So I think I'm all set for now

Tho still want an extreme juggernaught eventually!

Wow the was fast. So far, I have Plastic jack kit, pButcher and widowmaker marksman. Looking to get Karchev, Widowmaker unit box and another plastic jack kit with in the next month.

Yah, I was just talking to someone and he mentioned he was getting ride of his Khador, and was interested in the old 40k stuff I wasn't using and having me paint up a squad for him.

So it just sort of worked out, if I was buying them I'd just have gone with the starter box, probably

A 35 pt list of the models I have.

How does it look to people?


Karchev the Terrible

Behemoth.
Destroyer.
Drago

Demoliton Squad. (Leader, 2 grunts)
Widowmakers. (Leader, 3 grunts)

The infantry I have are limited to just this in my model collection atm, sadly.


However my other jacks I *can choose from include, a juggernaught, another destroyer, a regular berserker, a spriggan and a kodiak.

the list looks good but i will warn you that starting with character jacks can make things confusing, they have so many special rules its hard to understand and remember all of them. still, they are very nice models and that much destructive power is hard to resist so if you have fun with the list its worth a little extra challenge.
if anything i would suggest substituting Drago for a juggernaut and adding some mechanics if you can get them. karchev likes mechanics.
the list is certainly solid enough to play with a bit.

Dais wrote:the list looks good but i will warn you that starting with character jacks can make things confusing, they have so many special rules its hard to understand and remember all of them. still, they are very nice models and that much destructive power is hard to resist so if you have fun with the list its worth a little extra challenge.
if anything i would suggest substituting Drago for a juggernaut and adding some mechanics if you can get them. karchev likes mechanics.
the list is certainly solid enough to play with a bit.

I def intend to buy some mechaniks once next payday rolls around!