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What would the 40k Universe look like if...

Horus had beaten the Emperor in combat and taken control of the Imperium.

The renegade space marine legions would never have had to flee to the eye of terror, they may never have suffered the level of mutation they subsequently underwent.

It's documented that at least one of the renegade legions, the Thousand Sons, despised the idea of mutation and wanted to keep themselves clean and pure of it... this lead to the disastrous/spectularly successful Rubric of Ahriman which both saved and condemned them... but this was cast under duress, what if it had worked?

How would this have affected the ordinary citizens of the Imperium? Most of them may have been treated as though they were lesser mortals and I'm sure many would live a life of misery and slavery. Oh wait, they're already living a life of fear and misery.. would the renegade victory have made THAT much of a difference?

Some of the benefits mankind could have basked in from a renegade victory -

Victory at Terra would have put the renegades into a position to take the rest of the galaxy. With no eye of terror to flee to, and no Emperor to fight for, the remaining loyalist legions would surely have accepted defeat and turned (or faced annihilation). This would have left mankind with a united front of ferocious unbroken Astartes legions, and the might of the Imperial Navy & Army, to conquer the rest of the galaxy and face down all Xeno threats.

Of course, there's always the risk that the human race could have faces extinction from a storm of daemon, poxes and mutations, but who knows the true intent of Chaos or even the iron will a victorious renegade Primarch?

I actually find a few ideas you have wrong. For starters, Horus would have probably been stronger than anyone could have hoped to slay after beating the Emperor, thus would have been an absolute dictator and easily achieved galactic unity.

Also, the citizens would have DEFINITELY not been effected as much as we think. For one, they'd be leading the same lives but worshipping the Gods of Chaos, not Imperial Doctrine. This alone means we'd be running rampant with mutants and other sick things. But Slavery? No.

I also think that the 'Imperium' would easily be fending off Tyranid invasions. With Mars now being allowed to experiment freely, the weaponry would be improved and astonishingly powerful. The 'Nids wouldn't stand a chance.

Trillons, not billions, of lives would be wasted, as the Chaos gods, their foothold in the real world strengthened, would fight against each other for supremacy unfettered due to the fact no one can hold them back. The traitor legions would each fight each other for power and Horus, no doubt seeing what he had wrought would hide away or totally give in to chaos and find himself as a true puppet spouting Chaos even more crazy and destructive ideas than before.

Mars would use its warped technologies for its own use and the Mechanicus would eventually attack terra and other systems in pursuit of forbidden knowledge and power.

The astronomican would fall apart and with no warp travel available whole sectors would be once again lost to darkness. Loyalist Legions would carve out their own small empires and would even fight amongst themselves over resources and how best to honour the dead emperors name, without materiel and man power they would soon become myth and legend. The imperial armies and navies would fall to chaos or be destroyed in the ensuing carnage. Nowhere would be safe.

If Horus had only crippled and not killed Sanguinius, I think killing the Emperor would have allowed Horus to turn him. Either way, the Blood Angels would very likely have fallen.

The Dark Angels certainly would have.

I don't think any of the others would have turned, and several could well have been exterminated.

I believe the loyalist Space Marines would have chosen death before dishonor, or at least many would have.

Chaos has never been able to maintain an Undivided Status or alliance of opposing deities for long. You would not have a long term united Empire, just an endless 'warring states' breakdown.

I am not an expert on the warp, but don't you think that open worship of Chaos increasing on a universal level would affect Warp Space? I suspect warp storms and expansion of the Eye of Terror...

'The house divided against itself cannot stand'. Chaos is forever divided. If Horus won, likely, as in History, his empire would last as long as he lived. Inferior successors, traitors, and civil war would eat his Empire alive after his death...

Praise the Emperor, our God Messiah lives!
---Frankie

P.S. In the old Realm of Chaos material there were insights into what happens when Chaos Lords take a planet. It is -not- life as usual. From the seizing of all the maidens on the planet for the use of the Slaanesh legions to mindless butchery until all life is extinguished under Khorne, no, it would be hell on a million earths...

I agree with that. In the aftermath of the victory i think any planet with Traitor legions would suddenly find itself a few billions people short...then some other few billions claimed for sacrifice to the Dark Gods, and so on...they would've died way faster than children were being born...

Ultimately there would be no one left except the Legions who start fighting each other for supremacy. And if any Loyalists survive, for them it's now or never, even if there's no one to fight for.

And with all the bloodshed and death the Gods find themselves incredibly powerful and wipe out humanity and all of the galaxy with one incredibly loud BANG! Lights out.

I think i prefer the Imperium's Status quo. Horus winning would make the grimdark pitchblack

Interesting idea.

What I would think has already been said. Horus would basically be the new Emperor. The Primarchs would probably each be given their own dominion of worlds in which they would rule with a iron fist.

I also love the idea of the Dark Mechanicum being freely able to upgrade tech. See I hate the Imperium because all it does is hamper itself. Could you imagine a Leman Russ with a rail gun or Marines armed with gauss technology? I'd also like to see how the Chaos Guardsmen would be layed out and etc. I know Horus would reorganize things.

The Human worlds honestly would not be all that different besides Chaos corruption and the free flow of daemons.

The farseeing from Legion is to be believed, then Horus would have realized what he'd done and scoured human life from the stars. Of course, that farseeing had been corrupted by the Dark Powers long ago...

What Nurglitch said. I don't think that the farseeing had been corrupted by chaos, that would mean that all eldar farseeing would be corrupted right? Also, we don't really ever realize what produced the vision, eldar or something else, IIRC.

There was only one eldar on that council, and it was mentioned he happened to be a very powerful farseer. It was also mentioned that 'The Emperor would be the only human they would recognise as an equal' so it suggests they all had strong psykic powers and an advanced view. Makes me lean towards a vision granted by combining all their powers together not something related to any particular one.

I think the Eldar was an Autarch named Slau-Da (sp?), rather than a Farseer, and the divinitory device was described as being an innovation based on Eldar Farseeing.

Personally I'd imagine Eldar Farseeing is compromised by the Dark Powers, Slaanesh in particular. I like to believe it was the job of the Keepers of Secrets to keep the alliance of the Dark Powers against the Emperor secret during the Great Crusade so that the Emperor would over-extend himself and his lieutenants would become complacent, while they worked their efforts both subtle and overt to corrupt His works.

I also like to believe that Eldar Farseeing is accurate insofar as it prolongs the death and suffering of the Eldar, making their extinction a long and drawn-out process in which the maximum suffering can be experienced. Likewise all attempts at prophecy, necessarily looking beyond the veil of time and using the power of the warp to determine events are necessarily tainted by the Chaos Gods since they are the Realm of Chaos.

As manipulators and schemers, Tzeentch (the Architect of Fate, Master of the Mutable Time-Stream) has no finer followers than the Farseers of the Eldar. They've already been corrupted: they just don't know it yet.

Yea I thought what was meant to happen if Horus won was he would see what he had done (as the chaos possession left him), go mad with remorse and there would follow a galaxy wide civil war where humanity would kill itself in under a century. (therefore leaving the other races unaffected)

This is Heresy and I am going to report to my local commissar for a summary execution just for seeing this filth and I expect every body who has seen this forum to do the same until this website has been "taken care of" by the correct authorities