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Title pretty much says it all: What equipment do you use with your chaos warriors?

Some people strictly think that Hand Weapon + Shield is the best way to go (and the cheapest) while others go Shield + Hand weapon + Great Weapon/Halberd

I was just thinking, would it be better to equip with a great weapon + shield just for the save for shooting? While you can get 2 attacks each at S6, though at I1

I was thinking to just do HW/Shield, but I'm not sure.

I usually go Shield + Halberd.

The Halberd isn't too expensive, and they can cause some damage, and usually strike first the next turn with their good initiative. I can choose that or the HW+Shield depending on the situation.

Great Weapons are also pretty good, and can do better against things like Heavy Cavalry. The problem is, it's expensive compared with the other weapon options and comes with a disadvantage.

I've actually been considering Great Weapons, and might try it sometimes since I can always use Hand Weapon + Shield if I need the initiative.

I go shield hand weapon hand weapon. If I charge or go first, I can usually obliterate the opponent's front rank leaving only the champion to attack back. However, I usually issue the challenge and carve that guy up first. MOK also helps in getting high CR scores.The +1 for shield hand weapon is handy when you get charged by enemy elite units.

You do know that you have to issue the challenge with a champion if you have one, right?

Sometimes they jump the gun and challenge me. Either way, the blood god wins...in some mythical counter universe made up of little plastic people.

And little metal and resin people too.

Shield + Hand Weapon = Old reliable. Gives you a pretty stupid save for an infantry unit and the fact that you're still Chaos Warriors means you aren't chumps in the damage category. If you don't have the option to bring this to a fight, you've sorely missed the entire point of the unit.

Hand Weapon + Hand Weapon = Wood Chipper. functions well against light infantry especially light infantry that isn't especially threatening like gobbos or other S3 fodder, then again you don't really need help against these opponents, so it's a nice little match on a fire, but isn't going to blow you away. The only area where this build really shines is against Vamps trying to invocation spam blocks of zombies or skellies at you.

Great Weapons = Semi truck. With 2 WS5 S6 attacks a model, this block will hit like a damn truck on the charge. The counter-point to this affair is that you're infantry, so charging is few and far between. The loss in speed of attacking is rarely a factor as WFB combats are usually 1 round affairs, you either get charged and go last anyways or charge and go first anyways.

Shield + Halberd = Indecisive. There really isn't a better way to put it, the other 3 builds all have areas where they truly excel, but the Halberd/Shield is the classic Jack-of-all master-of-none. It doesn't take charges as well as HW/SD, deliver charges as well as GW or chew cannon fodder like HW/HW. That being said, it still isn't what you would call bad, you're still S5 with a 3+ save, it just isn't optimized.


As far as marks:

Mark of Slaanesh= It's the best choice in the majority of cases. I hate to say it, but it's true. Having a block of rather expensive chaos warriors wet themselves because something scary is nearby or a few ablative wounds died to shooting/magic is a damn tragedy and happens more often than it should. It's the best way to make sure your guys can make it to the fight without saddling them with an inability to flee when faced with getting crushed.

Mark of Tzeentch= 6+ wards can be pretty hot especially when you're infantry are so well armored that they'll likely be eating every bolt thrower in this zip code. You can also tie this with a banner that gives you ward saves against shooting making them pretty resilient. Overall not bad and worthy of consideration.

Mark of Khorne= +1 attack and ITP would be great if it weren't tied to frenzy. While infantry blocks are less prone to getting completely screwed by being frenzied than their faster moving counterparts, they also have pretty much no chance of catching fast cav baiting them around the table like a group of pissed off retards. The extra attack is cool, and all but not really worth losing control of the unit.

Mark of Nurgle= Useful against shooting and WS3 opponents, but most WS3 can be easily beaten into submission anyways and the only shooting this unit will be terribly inpressed by is cannons, Stone Throwers and Bolt Throwers and it only works against 1/3rd of them. Seems better in theory than in practice.

The Halberd is useful in sustained fights as they're likely to be going first (not against Elves, but those are T3 so the main advantage of GW there is a better ASM).

Units like Temple Guard are better fought with Halberds than any other option as you're not likely to break them on the first turn.

The same goes for most units that won't or is unlkey to break unless they have a very heavy armour save and good toughness (GW is better against anything T4 2+ even striking last).

Overall, GW are great options but are expensive relatvely.

Aren't those halberds striking twice at str 5? Taking 2 off enemy's save? Not too shabby...

I see some great combos in the following units -

18x Warriors
w/ Full Cmmd, Slaanesh, Hand Weapon + Shield, Halberd

18x Warriors
w/ Full Cmmd, Khorne, Hand Weapon + Hand Weapon, Great Weapon
(***Expensive but awesome hitting power***)

20x Warriors
w/ Full Cmmd, Nurgle, Hand Weapon + Shield, Great Weapon
(***Splendid Anvil Unit as long as you have Counter Charge Units to help support them***)

If I were to field a WoC army, my Warriors would start off with the H. Wpn + Shield, Halberd combo.

The thing is, Great weapons are simply better.

See, if your charged, your going to use HW + Shield as a default for the save.

If your charging, your Init. doesn't matter since your striking first, so really, GW is always better for warriors.

Depends on what you are charging. If you are charging an unbreakable or stubborn unit, you are often better off with hand weapon/shield.

Well yeah, if your charging deathstar units, or just really tough units (most commonly Stubborn/Unbreakable/ASF/KB) then yeah, you should. But you don't have any business charging a deathstar unit with one block of warriors.

out of habit my WoC army is painted in all red and brass so my army on the field reflects that.

My chaos warriors were always put up with shield and spare hand weapon. with a 6 man front that's 25 attacks. Even at Str4 that many dice being thrown at your opponent will fold their units.

I laugh so hard at tomb kings and VC with my warriors because even with MoK and shields the combat resolution is so horrifically one sided they quickly run out of skellies, god help them if i get the charge and use dub hand weapons. with possible two rank fighting in 8th i only see my list getting stronger (49 attacks of awesome).

of course being frenzy baited sucks, gotta have Valkia or some chaos dragon to scare off those pesky fast cav units, or my favorite Lore of Slaanesh can give your opponents units frenzy (they cant run from you when you charge them!).

I usually run them 12 strong as they're expensive andi mostly relying killing power rather than ranks, though I do see the benefit for 18 for sustained combats, it's just so expensive.

For Halberds and GW, it's best to do a calculation and work out the different scenarios.

I run two units of 18 (6x3), with shields, mark and banner (Nurgle/Rage and Khorn/Rapturous). It's slow, it's expensive, it's imposible to kill, and it makes a great game clock. Mine roam most battlefields like battleships, one slowly marching straight towards the hardest target, the other plodding to the heart of the opposing force. The arguements about not getting the charge are irrelevant in my opinion... In my experience, they can take a charge and win combat against anything. Yes, anything. I don't care how you math hammer it out, Ws 5, T 4, 2+ save always wins. Of course the risk is multiple charges, but WoC has many great fast moving units to harass or destroy your opponents supporting units. Hounds are terrible cheap in MSU and perfect for disposible redirection. Marauder Horsemen are a good middle ground with Mark of Slaanesh and flails. They can kill anything other than Cavalry and RnF, and can more reliably redirect anything they can't kill themselves. Another perk is that this fullfills most list's core requirements. Knights are great in MSU, able to kill much more than anticipated, and distract from the Warrior blocks which are worth much more. 5 with mark of Tzeentch is 220, for a top 3 cavalry unit in the game, everything you love about warriors with more movement, strength, armor and a ward save! Any way you decide, get the warriors face to face with your opponents game winner, and let them do the rest.

Chaos Warriors 6 wide taking a charge from anyhing short of Chaos Knights do best with Great Weapons.

Kiwidru wrote:In my experience, they can take a charge and win combat against anything. Yes, anything. I don't care how you math hammer it out, Ws 5, T 4, 2+ save always wins.

<Insert Blood Knights here>

I'm sorry, its just that blood knights are rediculous and I cant really think of anything other than a lucky chosen of tzeentch unit that can stand up to them.

infamousxiii wrote:out of habit my WoC army is painted in all red and brass so my army on the field reflects that.

My chaos warriors were always put up with shield and spare hand weapon. with a 6 man front that's 25 attacks. Even at Str4 that many dice being thrown at your opponent will fold their units.

I laugh so hard at tomb kings and VC with my warriors because even with MoK and shields the combat resolution is so horrifically one sided they quickly run out of skellies, god help them if i get the charge and use dub hand weapons. with possible two rank fighting in 8th i only see my list getting stronger (49 attacks of awesome).

of course being frenzy baited sucks, gotta have Valkia or some chaos dragon to scare off those pesky fast cav units, or my favorite Lore of Slaanesh can give your opponents units frenzy (they cant run from you when you charge them!).

Absolutely the way to go! 6 wide, two hand weapons, FC, MOK is brutal. The frenzy bait has never been a problem for me with the Warriors. Dog meat shields or 10 marauder w/flail meat shields are great. There is also the naked 15 marauder w musician unit at 70ish points which can be effective. Also a big beefy 25 marauder hand weapon, shield, light armor unit with FC is like 170 - 190 (the book is in another part of the material universe at the moment) distracts opponents and draws a lot of fire.

Curiously, infamousxiii, how many characters do you run in a Khorne 2000 pt list? Do you do the scroll caddy? Skip the Lord go for the exalted General to get more boots on the ground?

I usually a little different depending what I'm playing against. Valkia is a given, I enjoy my dude on a juggernaut escorting my "fist of god" unit of knights that usually just bowls down the middle of the field. at this point its a little washy, sometimes ill use another khorne guy BSB with no magic flag but chaos runesword to bolster my middle unit of warriors and at least one lvl 1 fire sorc scroll caddy.

Lately though, with the number of skaven players (man i hate that wither spell) i had dropped the BSB for another scroll caddy.

My old Khorne list was by no means a strategic play. I put it together simply because it looked awesome on the field. I didn't use any marauders or dogs generally, like i said i went for looks, not for the first place ribbon specifically.

my 2250 list usually had 5 knights, between 45-60 warriors, full characters and a warshrine. All of it inked in deep red with brass trim and weapons over dark earth with snowfall.

At present, 16 CW's with additional hand weapon, full command and "Banner of Rage".

Gotta have a buzzsaw regiment what with all of the horde armies my pals are building...

infamousxiii wrote:

my 2250 list usually had 5 knights, between 45-60 warriors, full characters and a warshrine. All of it inked in deep red with brass trim and weapons over dark earth with snowfall.

WARGASM!

That's brutal!

I love the look of all-warrior armies.

Sadly, they do so poorly.

Who was it that said they don't care what it is, but WS5 T4 2+ save wins everytime?

12 warriors, shields, Banner and musician = 207?

23 skeletons, full command = 204

Warriors are 6 wide, have 12 attacks. 3+ to hit, 3+ to wound. 8 hit, 5 wound? -1 to skeleton save, so about 3 get through.

3 casualties, 1 ranks, banner = 5.

Skeletons have 3 ranks, banner, numbers = 5.

Replace skeleton with anything else, the unit just gets cheaper. Most units tie chaos warrior's usual combat res just by existing. If the chaos warriors miss a couple extra attacks, the enemy gets lucky with saves, or god forbid the enemy gets lucky and kills a warrior, the numbers just get worse. It's better when chaos warriors have more numbers to equal the combat res of other races, but a rank of 16-18 point models just to get a +1 is really expensive. And what if the 18 man unit that's 6 wide loses 2 models? That's 5 models [4 in the back rank, 1 extra in the second] doing nothing - not attacking, not counting as a rank, just providing 5 bodies until the next rank bonus goes away.

But if you DON'T spend the points, you risk losing the unit on a slightly below average roll. To something often half your points, no less!

2 rank fighting should help things, if the rumor is true in 8th. 5 extra WS3 S3 attacks on a unit of chaos warriors will matter little. An extra 12 WS5 S4 attacks will swing the odds much more!

Of course then Swordmasters will be nearly unstoppable...