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Ok guys and girls, I just had the first game of my second round of a tournament (will get around to the battle report once I get the pics back from a friend) and I failed absysmally. It's best out of 3 so I still have a chance. For everyone's reference here is my current 1.5k list:

Hive tyrant
wings
paroxysm
Life leech
2x scything talons
Hive commander

3 zoanthropes in a spod

Doom in a spod

10 ymgarl genestealers

13 gaunts

Tervigon
Crushing claws
catalyst

2 trygons

My opponent ran something like this:

Logan Grimnar
Bjorn the Fell handed
Rune priest (JotWW and some other power which he didn't use)
Assault termies (THSSx3, LCx2)
2 lone wolves (mark of the wulfen both, PW on one and THSS second one)
5 man Grey hunters
7 bloodclaws
4 man long fangs (lascannon, plasma cannon and heavy bolter)
Vindicator

It was a terrible game. Some bad luck, a lot of bad decisions on my part and some other stuff which I will ignore (people explaining to the guy what to do...I told them to stop and they did eventually). It was KP's and dawn of war.

First off my list is very offensive in it's build. There are a lot of threats, a couple of hammer units and the rest tries to make it easier for the rest of my army (genestealers tie up dangerous units or get passengers out of transports, tyrant paroxysms firebase units, etc). My list therefore fares better against small elite armies...SM should have their buttocks handed to them. Alas it was not to be. The first and largest mistake was that I deployed too far back and allowed my opponent to deal with my units from afar (he made me take 1st turn and held everything in reserve) It took me 2 turns to actually reach cc with most of my stuff. It probably would have been better to deploy in his deployment zone and put the pressure on as his stuff came on piecemeal. I then proceeded to bunch my zoanthropes and Doom together as I made a dash for his army...stupid Vindicator knocked it out in 1 hit and a zoanthropes for good measure. Another mistake was choosing a piece of terrain on 1 side of the table for my ymgarls...guess where the guy castled up...you guessed it, THE OTHER SIDE.

Now I know some of the critical errors I made (and there were quite a few...I have only mentioned some of the most important), but is there anything else that I may have missed. I'm trying to look outside the box and see if there's anything else I can capitalize on...but I think I need some help with it.

So dakkaites, please help.

Nidz will always struggle against Space Wolves, just like Orks will always struggle with Land Raiders, Space Wolves are our "bad matchup".

His Space Wolf list was all over the place, be afraid when he realizes that you don't build Space Wolf Terminators like regular terminators, and he realizes that Long Fangs with Missle Launchers are the best Heavy Support Choice he has. Not to mention Land Raiders.

You are fortunate that your list is a little bit more Jaws resistant then most. The only changes I would make is that I would swap out the Doom for a second Zoanthrope Squad, reduce the Ymgarls to 6 - 7, and get a unit of at least 20 Gargoyles on the table.

Deepstrike everything, Hive Commander works off table (unless you play by the INAT FAQ), so you should have most of your stuff in his face on turn two. The goal of the Gargoyles is to provide cover to the Trygon. They come down, the Trygon uses their position to safely deepstrike, and in the shooting phase you run them to spread them out.

I advocate more Zoanthropes so you have a better chance to get past his Runic weapon and either pop Land Raiders or Blast template Long Fangs. Plus it would be harder for him to put all of them down before he can attempt Jaws.

some more notes:
1. mark of the wulven doesn't allow the unit to use a CC weapon, if he was using them, that isn't right.

2. 1500 is rough for bugs, they gain power faster the more points you get, but you are totally lacking in coversaves (hoping that your tervi's poop out enough babies) gargoyles would help with your tyrant, I like whargarbl stealers too but a swarm of basic genestealers get the job done.

3. doom is nice but at your point value you really aren't going to be able to use him very well.

4. as a "im gonna getcha!" army, you are a bit heavy on the "better", more expensive bugs and don't have much to absorb fire. Big swarms of normal genestealers, supported gargoyles, devourer gaunts, ect. ect. get the job done, don't be afraid of using them because they get gunned down easily. 20 gaunts in cover have a 1 worse save than a trygon, cost the same, and put out 60 shots a turn, you can't really ignore that, throw enough big time threats at your enemy and he will either have to spread out fire and not do enough damage or buckle.

Actually, his list is pretty terrible. As pointed out, Mark of the Wulfen doesn't allow the model to use any weapons, so that was an error. Additionally, his longfangs are very WTF? and he has dumped a ton of points into characters with only 17 scoring models!

The suggestions are very good- drop the special bugs (Ymgarl's and Doom) for their normal equivalents. He lacks transports, so you should be able to get on him fast with gaunts and genestealers. Some gargs would also be great for screening and tie up.

Be aware that the lonewolves in a SS/TH setup will rock your MCs world- rerolling hits and wounds with a 2+/3+ FNP eternal warrior. Two charging in is 6 of those attacks coming at you! Or just tie him up with gaunts. He can kill a couple evry turn and you can throw back a bunch of attacks hoping for some failed saves. 30 attacks is 15 hits and 7.5 wounds- enough for a failed save and maybe a failed FNP (50%). Even on the charge he is looking at 1-2 dead bugs, so not too bad. Just keep the tervi out of it!

I play SW and lose to Nids, Now it's deepstriking nids.
My lonewolves get shot from accross the table. Softer target. The Mark of the Wulfin is being used wrong.The fluff says He is biting and scratching. They do not use combat weapons for their attacks just the STR stat.
I love them for the d6 attacks rending. Shoot them up.
I want to see tthe battle report. Did Bjorn do well or suc.
Shoot the heck out of them and swamp them with small combat 'gants ?

Thanks for everything guys...I made so many mistakes it's unreal, but at least now I know that he made a mistake with his Lone wolves since he was using their weapons with their Mark of the Wulfen (could have actually changed the game considering it was KP's).

I'm actually quite happy with the way my list is *supposed* to work, and I honestly think it was my own errors that killed me. I played Imperial Fists in the previous round and tabled him twice so I'm back to thinking that it was my deployment that screwed me. Looking back there was no uber unit (even the termies were footslogging) that I couldn't deal with so I really have no idea why I deployed so far away...Just one of those days (brain dead) I guess.

Also since this is a tournament I can't change the list even if I wanted to. But at least now I know some other avenues that I can explore. I was thinking about dropping the ymgarls and Doom in exchange for Deathleaper plus 3 more zoanthropes in a spod.

Oh and Bjorn was ok. Charged him with a wounded (3 left) trygon and ripped his cc arm off. Next round I died but not before immobilizing him and ripping off his other arm (Bjorn the no-handed, lol).

Will get onto the report when I get some pics. For now will start taking notes so I don't forget.

Thanks again guys for the advice.

I'm pretty sure his list was illegal, seeing as how he has 3 HQ's.

I hate how 40k is becoming 40k hero hammer. Everybody runs one if not two named characters in their list. 400+ points on HQ's is dumb (unless you're Eldar).

eNvY wrote:I'm pretty sure his list was illegal, seeing as how he has 3 HQ's.

I hate how 40k is becoming 40k hero hammer. Everybody runs one if not two named characters in their list. 400+ points on HQ's is dumb (unless you're Eldar).

SW can have up to 4 HQs.

Gornall wrote:

eNvY wrote:I'm pretty sure his list was illegal, seeing as how he has 3 HQ's.

I hate how 40k is becoming 40k hero hammer. Everybody runs one if not two named characters in their list. 400+ points on HQ's is dumb (unless you're Eldar).

SW can have up to 4 HQs.

Wow that is slowed.

His list is just battleforcy and not good.

A typical Logan list at 1500-1750 could have 20 missile shots per turn, and you would find about 2 TMC down.

Don't give your opponent distance to shoot you again and again. DS or outflank more units--the tyrant could made tervigon outflank, is my recall correct?

eNvY wrote:I'm pretty sure his list was illegal, seeing as how he has 3 HQ's.

I hate how 40k is becoming 40k hero hammer. Everybody runs one if not two named characters in their list. 400+ points on HQ's is dumb (unless you're Eldar).

Wow, way to be bias.

eNvY wrote:

Gornall wrote:

eNvY wrote:I'm pretty sure his list was illegal, seeing as how he has 3 HQ's.

I hate how 40k is becoming 40k hero hammer. Everybody runs one if not two named characters in their list. 400+ points on HQ's is dumb (unless you're Eldar).

SW can have up to 4 HQs.

Wow that is slowed.

Yeah, taking 4 HQs is slowed...oh, wait, you think it's good...

Like i said the mistakes were mostly mine. Bad luck played it's part in some areas, but that's expected. Deployment lost me the game (aside from the lone Wolf thing).

Will be prepared for the next game.