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Ok, from previous posts here and elsewere most folks know I really have a problem with the use of opposing Chaos powers in the same army for traional and fluff reasons. The sight of Khorne Berserkers with a lash prince in the same army (or worse yet nurgle and tzench daemons in the same force) makes me want to claw my eyes out. I don't want to re-hash that argument here. But my stance on the issue helps to frame were I'm coming from.

Yesterday I pulled out the raw material I have gathered for an old style World Eaters themed CSM army and started the planning. It's to be a colorful force with lots of old school flavor. The majority of the army is of course Khorne Beserker squads made up of Khorne marked RT chaos renegades, "1992 pattern World Eaters", and second edition models. I've got a lord on a first pattern juggernaught and a "blood slaughterer" that I plan on using as a "counts as" drednaught as well. (http://www.solegends.com/citcat9x3/c92402chaosspacemarines-01.htm) It's going to be a fun project to put together.

Well, I was thinking over unique HQ options, when I thought about the sorceror. True enough you would never see a sorceror in a World Eaters army. Khorne hates "magic" and all the librarians of the World Eater legion were killed when they turned to Chaos. This is even more the case with a Slaanesh marked character using the "lash" power. But though the magic of "counts as" I have come up with a suitably old school solution.

He's not a sorceror at all and he's not using a psycic attack. It's a World Eater legion techmarine armed with a graviton gun!
For those younger gamers out there the graviton gun is a weapon from the first edition of the game that also briefly made a showing in 2nd editon as well. Even in those days it was harldy ever used by anyone. Here is the description of the weapon from the RT book:
"The graviton gun is a curious weapon. It was oiginally developed for peaceful purposes in low gravity enviorments. Any target hit by the gun acquires added mass-becoming much heavier almost instantly. This does not physically change or harm the target but it does make movement difficult..."

Granted the effect of the lash is not in keeping with the original effect of the graviton gun, but one could certainly make the case that a modified/updated version of the gun might alter the gravity effect in the opposite way in lowering the target's mass combined with a sort of tractor beam effect. Yes it's a stretch, but it's a fairly characterful way to shoehorn in the character and is certainly more creative than just combining chaos powers in a "mix and pick" fashion with no regards to theme, tradition, or fluff.

I've even got a conversion idea in mind, using an old RT techmarine as the base model.

What are your thoughts on this?

TR

Well I guess my thoughts are that it's one hell of a techmarine that'll be represented by Daemon Prince stats, but sure! It's your army and you have a decent fluffy explanation for it, so why not?

I quite like this idea. I'm of the opinion that as long as there is a good-looking/unique model on the table, I can remember what it is. I think that a graviton gun is a great way to represent that ability. Whenever I think "Khorne Lash" I think a model with "taunt", but the graviton gun explains why you can move them other directions than just directly towards your model.

In summary, go for it!

tgjensen wrote:Well I guess my thoughts are that it's one hell of a techmarine that'll be represented by Daemon Prince stats, but sure! It's your army and you have a decent fluffy explanation for it, so why not?

Re-read the post.
I'm considering using the sorceror option, not the daemon prince.

TR

I like the idea. I have to say, when you talk about a heavily modified exotic weapon I usually think "Orks" first, with their way of looting and fiddling with everything However, I guess that's the right direction to go for making this model "special" - modify and convert the nine hells out of it. I guess the gun should look very different from any kind of normal gun you see on the battlefield and it should be rather obvious, so any opponent notices it. Maybe you could pimp up the tech-marines servo-harness and backpack with additional back-mounted gun parts, maybe as large as the Big Mek KFF is - of course all should be very spiky and chaosy.

For added Khorne flavour, I'd recommend an insane screaming face and the free hand filled with a really big axe.

I come to realize I really like this idea. Please make a WIP log about the creation of this World Eater techmarine!

Trench-Raider wrote:

tgjensen wrote:Well I guess my thoughts are that it's one hell of a techmarine that'll be represented by Daemon Prince stats, but sure! It's your army and you have a decent fluffy explanation for it, so why not?

Re-read the post.
I'm considering using the sorceror option, not the daemon prince.

TR

Aw, and I was really warming up to the idea of a monstrously mutated techmarine growing out of his power armor...

Provided there's a sweet techmarine model being used, I think it's a great idea.

In one of the Inferno short stories, there was a guy dedicated to Khorne that had a powerful voice that could motivate and captivate people. That would be good for the Lash also.

Your Champion of Khorne bellows his rage (ala Lord Humongus from Mad Max), causing his enemies to crap their pants and triggering their primitive herd mentality to huddle together for the false veneer of safety, or panic and bolt in a "random" direction.


Or a graviton gun, sure, why not?

Look at the BloodThirster, he has a giant whip...close enough to lash .
Or it's a battle field aura of hate that makes the opponent's units filled with bloodlust and can move faster then they normally would into really bad formations and charge ranges.

Just 'count as'. Think of the psy test as a more interesting to hit roll.

I'm thinking of having a Khorne Lord on a Powerboard as a counts-as Jump pack.

Powerboards are undoubtedly one of the most awesome things that needs to come back.

What are your thoughts on this?

Honestly, you should just go with the Slaaneshi model (IMO).
I mean, really, all you're doing here is looking for a way to incorporate a unit into your army that you want - because it's tough. I understand that. It looks like you're just trying to reason your way around your own prejudices, though.

Considering your stance on fluff, it just seems to me to be a little hypocritical.

I'm not trying to offend. I apologize in advance, if I did.
I know that word (hypocrite) carries a lot of negative connotation for some people. Unfortunately, I couldn't really find a better word to describe it.
NO insult was intended.

Eric

IMO it's not justifiable... Counts as bladibla.. yea, but it stil is Lash.

So despite not wanting a magic user in your army to use lash, you just change magic to "tech" and now you have lash? Word play to get lash is still getting lash.

@OP:
Ignore them, make it look good and it's all good.
Make it crappy and it's four times worse on you .

Count as is Count as, can't fault anyone when even GW is pushing people into it, prepare for different personal standards and points of view...

@Uriels_Flame:
Nice, a can of sliced mango, how thoughful

Ahem:
"Cheese is the cry of the unprepared."

Easy, it's a giant meat hook the daemon prince throws at people.

Your OP reminds me of an old D&D spell called 'Gambol's Fattening Ray'. Your target immediately gained several hundred pounds and had to make a save or suffer a minor heart attack, losing Dexterity.

Seems to me that the world eaters would have something like the new blood angel's magna grapples.

The other thing you could say is that Bob, Chosen of the Blood God is able to induce bloodlust in others making them give up their defensive position and run as quickly as possible toward whatever enemy (or friend) is around in order to smash their skulls.