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Ok! so far i have a bunch of threads sort of taking up space , so i have decided to ask ALL the related question
in 1 same thread , this one!

My questions are:

a) What transport do terminator takes most often? How about drop pods?

b) How do i use dreads effectively? Without drop pod they'll pretty much chase things around unless they have a ranged weapon.
But even if they have ranged weapon (or 2) they are really expensive compared to devastators and their AV isnt very high either.
Sure they can move and fire , but is it enough to justify the cost + 1 shot can potentially destroy it? What are tips on earning it's points back?

c) Long Fangs , is it necessary to mix weapons? how well do they do if they all use the same weapons? ( i imagine all ML is great , but i dont have many :x )
What combination if mixed do you recommend?

d) My Araj + Terminator squad . Since it can carry six models , should i just throw them into a Redeemer instead of a Crusader?

e) Whats a good weapon choice for Razorback? TL Lascannon seems expensive and i have lots of lascannon in my Long Fangs squad. I was thinking maybe Assault Cannon,
since it can drive around , getting into range wouldnt be a problem?

Thats all the questions i have for now , thanks for reading ^^v

a. Most people put their terminators in a land raider crusader or redeemer. Those two have the added benefit of both being able to hold more terminators and giving termies frag grenades the turn they disembark and charge.

b. Dreadnoughts tend to be good blocking units. Walkers aren't hit in the rear armor in hth and are hit with grenades on 6's, making them fairly tough against units that don't have a power fist. The advantage of a gun is that they can shoot while you move them around and put them into position. Also, the Dreadnought Close combat weapon is strength 10...and is one of the few ways to deal with land raiders. Generally, shooty dreads don't shoot as well as other tanks point for point. They're only worth it if you can take advantage of their mobility and hth prowess. Oh...and they're a HUGE deterrent to genestealers. The stealers will kill one in hth eventually, but it usually takes a bit of effort.

C. You can split fire, so it's okay to take more than one type. I see lascannon/heavy bolter, lascannon/plasma cannon, all missiles, all sorts of things. Since the heavy bolter is the cheap one, some people take the heavy bolters to act as ablative wounds.

D. The redeemer is very similar to a crusader, the difference being the ap3 flamer vs. the 6 twin-linked bolter shots. It's hard to say exactly which one is better, but you won't go wrong with either one, imo.

E. If you're making a balanced list, giving your razorbacks different weapons from the rest of your army is a sensible decision. Since the razorback has many weapon choices, the sensible choice varies depending on what the rest of your army has. The general consensus is that the heavy bolter one, while cheap, is the worst one. Let me answer your question by asking you a question: What gives you the most trouble: Do you need more anti-tank, anti-monster, or anti-troop? The answer will decide your weapon choice for you.

scuddman wrote:Let me answer your question by asking you a question: What gives you the most trouble: Do you need more anti-tank, anti-monster, or anti-troop? The answer will decide your weapon choice for you.

I dont know , i havnt played any games for a long time o_o
Im asking now so i can assemble them the right way if anyone ever feel like playing SW.

I was thinking TL ASS , they can rend vehicle and kill infantry , and i get to play with Baal predator minus the sponsons xD

If you're not sure and you want a weapon that does all 3, then the assault cannon is an excellent choice.

a) What transport do terminator takes most often? How about drop pods?

For Space Wolves Drop Pods are the most common transport for terminators. Land Raiders are good, but the unit becomes a point sink, I honestly prefer power armor wolf guard in a land raider to have the larger number of attacks.

b) How do i use dreads effectively? Without drop pod they'll pretty much chase things around unless they have a ranged weapon.
But even if they have ranged weapon (or 2) they are really expensive compared to devastators and their AV isnt very high either.
Sure they can move and fire , but is it enough to justify the cost + 1 shot can potentially destroy it? What are tips on earning it's points back?

Space Wolf Dreadnoughts are not that great, Bjorn the Fell Handed has some fun uses for being tougher than a land raider, In an objective mission you can keep him in a favorable position, and when you enemy rolls on the damage table force him to be destroyed (reroll non-destruction results because of venerable) then score an extra objective. Or in a killpoints mission use him as a screen and fire magnet for a rhino loaded with Njal Stormcaller... does your enemy shoot at the 2-4 killpoint Dreadnought with a 5+ invul save or the rhino with Njal in it that has a 4+ cover save? Also, there is no penalty for him dieing in a table-quarters mission.


c) Long Fangs , is it necessary to mix weapons? how well do they do if they all use the same weapons? ( i imagine all ML is great , but i dont have many :x )
What combination if mixed do you recommend?

Long Fangs are excellent for 1 reason, Cost. They are cheap and need to remain as cheap as possible to be points efficient, I recommend as many Missile Launchers as you can put down, filling the remaining slots with Heavy Bolters, if you still dont have enough then take some Plasma, If you absolutely need it take some lascannons, but you can get a 5 missile launcher unit for about the same cost as a 3 lascannon unit. Only take Multimeltas if you plan on putting them in a drop pod with logan grimnar (I run 5 Missile Launchers, with attatched cyclone Wolf Guard and Logan Grimnar in a Drop Pod, 7 Relentless missiles into rear armor on turn 1, 7 tank hunting missles thereafter)

d) My Araj + Terminator squad . Since it can carry six models , should i just throw them into a Redeemer instead of a Crusader?

If you are only using 6 terminators I recommend a redeemer, I played a doubles tournament yesterday and all day long the Redeemer was nuking units left and right, one game it scored 4 killpoints, the next game it scored 2, and the last game it scored 5. It also was able to get its transported units where they needed to go unharmed. The Crusader left much to be desired in the firepower department.

e) Whats a good weapon choice for Razorback? TL Lascannon seems expensive and i have lots of lascannon in my Long Fangs squad. I was thinking maybe Assault Cannon,
since it can drive around , getting into range wouldnt be a problem

Assault Cannons are my favorite weapon, they are better at anti-tank than lascannons, better at anti-infantry than heavy bolters, with the only drawback being range. Having said that I think it depends on what squad the Razorback is for, if its for some objective-hunting Grey Hunters then go for the assault cannon, you will be moving up anyways. If its for your long fangs then get the TLLC, good chance to hit and extra long range punch. I dont particularly like the las/plas varient or the heavy bolter version.

A.) I would be curious as to how you intend to use your Wolf Guard Terminators. If you intend them as an assault force, armed with combimeltas and Wolf Claws, then Drop Pods would probably work okay. I would also suggest a variant build, using 4 regular power armor WG and a single Terminator with Cyclone Missile Launcher, especially in lists that feature Logan as they are a cheap scoring unit that can reach out and touch people.

B.) If you're dead set on Earning its Points Back, two T/L ACs will give you the most return. You'll be able to fire the entire game and the T/L AC is potent against basically everything except AV13/14. The other role I would suggest is as a counterassault unit since you want a bunch of Long Fangs. Assault Cannon/CCW and just hang out, baby-sitting the heavy weapon teams while plinking away at anything that comes within 24".

C.) How many MLs do you have? If you've got 8-10, I'd recommend doing two squads of 5-6 long fangs with 4-5 MLs each, and since it sounds like you have lascannons in abundance, one squad of 6 LF with 5 Lascannons and Logan. Logan makes them relentless for Dawn of War positioning, and gives them Tank Hunters for S10 guns.

In general, if you have to use things like heavy bolters and multimeltas to fill out bodies, I simply would not take the extra LF model.

D.) I don't consider Arjac "worth it", but you seem to want him in, so I'd just put him into a pod. He's already an expensive (I'd say overcosted) model, and investing even more into his ride just sinks 700 points into a single unit+transport.

C.) How many MLs do you have? If you've got 8-10, I'd recommend doing two squads of 5-6 long fangs with 4-5 MLs each, and since it sounds like you have lascannons in abundance, one squad of 6 LF with 5 Lascannons and Logan. Logan makes them relentless for Dawn of War positioning, and gives them Tank Hunters for S10 guns.

In general, if you have to use things like heavy bolters and multimeltas to fill out bodies, I simply would not take the extra LF model.

D.) I don't consider Arjac "worth it", but you seem to want him in, so I'd just put him into a pod. He's already an expensive (I'd say overcosted) model, and investing even more into his ride just sinks 700 points into a single unit+transport.

I disagree with putting 5 Lascannons in a single LF squad, firstly you lose frag missiles, which doesnt seem like much, untill you see the glory that 7 (with cyclone wolf guard attatched) frag missiles does to a poorly positioned unit of ork boys, 30 boys? now its closer to 5.
I do frequently put Logan Grimnar with my Long Fangs, relentless for DoW deployment and repositioning, Tank Hunters for.... hunting tanks, Prefered enemy when you are about to be charged (and the +1a howl), Fearless during your opponents turn so you cant be pinned/broken from taking a couple of wounds. All great.

Multimeltas for extra bodies is a Bad idea. Heavy bolters are ok though, they are dirt cheap and you can split fire so they are not useless.

Arjac is a badass, plain and simple. Dont look at him as a upgraded wolf guard, but as an HQ that doesnt take up an HQ slot. I have an 1850 LOLganwing list, and Arjacs unit always wrecks face.

So did you actually read the part where she said she didn't have enough MLs to kit out all her LF squads? And that she does have lascannons?

As for Arjac, I look at him as a Wolf Lord with 2 wounds. So he's Str 10? So's a Wolf Lord on Twolf Mount with hammer. More attacks, greater mobility, more wounds, real similar point cost. Who cares if he doesn't take up an HQ slot? You find yourself needing 5 HQs with regularity?

I recommend as many Missile Launchers as you can put down, filling the remaining slots with Heavy Bolters,

So did you actually read the part where she said she didn't have enough MLs to kit out all her LF squads? And that she does have lascannons?

I recommend as many Missile Launchers as you can put down, filling the remaining slots with Heavy Bolters,

yes, I did
and I recommend not taking lascannons on Long Fangs. They are not horrible, but I think its counter intuitive to the biggest strength of the unit... Low cost.

As for Arjac, I look at him as a Wolf Lord with 2 wounds. So he's Str 10? So's a Wolf Lord on Twolf Mount with hammer. More attacks, greater mobility, more wounds, real similar point cost. Who cares if he doesn't take up an HQ slot? You find yourself needing 5 HQs with regularity?

Arjac is great because he can't be singled out in combat, so he will be dying last, as opposed to eating a few powerklaws and dying first. Arjac also is scoring with Logan Grimnar in the army. he can also pop transports before the assault with his throw. You also cannot Drop Pod in Twolf mounted guys, or have them ride in land raiders. Lastly, some people really dislike the fluff behind Twolves and opt out of them because wolves riding wolves is just rediculous.

C.) How many MLs do you have? If you've got 8-10, I'd recommend doing two squads of 5-6 long fangs with 4-5 MLs each, and since it sounds like you have lascannons in abundance, one squad of 6 LF with 5 Lascannons and Logan. Logan makes them relentless for Dawn of War positioning, and gives them Tank Hunters for S10 guns.

I have.... 2 >.> that goes on LF . I have 3 on dreads if its viable to use them in place of DCCW

In general, if you have to use things like heavy bolters and multimeltas to fill out bodies, I simply would not take the extra LF model.

I take HB because they look good ^^; thats about it , and i havnt assembled any MM since their range confuses me in their usefulness without drop pod.
Between the 3 LF squads , whats available are: 4 HB , 2 ML , 8 Lascannon , 2 MM , 4 Plasma Cannon

D.) I don't consider Arjac "worth it", but you seem to want him in, so I'd just put him into a pod. He's already an expensive (I'd say overcosted) model, and investing even more into his ride just sinks 700 points into a single unit+transport.

Ah he isnt important no , i was just going to add ihim so i can convert something fun.

Arjac is a ton of fun. I've taken in in every fight and he has done well. Sure a WGBL on Twolf might have similar stats, but those guys can't go in transports and Arjac can. Also an S10 ranged weapon is pretty awesome, even if it is only 6".

I have.... 2

In case you hadn't thought about it, missile launchers are very easy to convert from the hunter killer missiles that come with every SM tank kit. I have 6 Long Fangs with actual SM missile launchers and 9 holding the converted launchers.

Therion wrote:

I have.... 2

In case you hadn't thought about it, missile launchers are very easy to convert from the hunter killer missiles that come with every SM tank kit. I have 6 Long Fangs with actual SM missile launchers and 9 holding the converted launchers.

Sounds great! may i see how to do it or what it looks like please? :3

I don't have any pictures of them yet I'm afraid, but if you don't want any hassle just take a bolt pistol arm (preferably an arm held straight out), cut the weapon off (leave the pistol grip intact) and replace it with the hunter killer missile to be held in one hand. You can put a bolt pistol, a close combat weapon, a targeter/scanner/whatever in the other hand.