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Hi guys!

I've been thinking about this, and I've tried it.

Apothecaries have the exact same stats as a sergeant.

So, I suggest:

If no upgrade is taken (fist, weapon, combi bolters etc.) the sergeant may be upgraded to an apothecary, for 15 pts
(thoughts?) therefore, granting the squad FNP.

he may then trade his bolt pistol or bolter for:
Storm bolter: 15 pts
Plasma Pistol: 15 pts
Combi-weapon 20 pts
(maybe power fists, power weapons.)

Thoughts?

I just thought FNP might be nicer for marines

If it seems too over-powered, thats probably true, but it went really well against orks.

It'd be pretty damn powerful to play against.

Any non-AP1/2 armies might as well pack up and go home...

Tried killing Plague Marines before? It's not fun...

Check out one of the imperial armour's I don't remember which one. they have rules for the red scorpion chapter of space marines where instead of sargents they get apothicaries. IIRC the upgrade is + 25 points, cannot take wargear and are only in tac squads.

If no upgrade is taken (fist, weapon, combi bolters etc.) the sergeant may be upgraded to an apothecary, for 15 pts
(thoughts?) therefore, granting the squad FNP.

he may then trade his bolt pistol or bolter for:
Storm bolter: 15 pts
Plasma Pistol: 15 pts
Combi-weapon 20 pts
(maybe power fists, power weapons.)

What you said makes no sense there. It a redundent point. You say if he takes no upgrades he can then become an apoth and once he's an apoth he can take upgrades. So there is no disadvantage at all to being an apoth.

Again look at the IA book for the rules.

Captain Solon wrote:Hi guys!

I've been thinking about this, and I've tried it.

Apothecaries have the exact same stats as a sergeant.

So, I suggest:

If no upgrade is taken (fist, weapon, combi bolters etc.) the sergeant may be upgraded to an apothecary, for 15 pts
(thoughts?) therefore, granting the squad FNP.

he may then trade his bolt pistol or bolter for:
Storm bolter: 15 pts
Plasma Pistol: 15 pts
Combi-weapon 20 pts
(maybe power fists, power weapons.)

Thoughts?

I just thought FNP might be nicer for marines

If it seems too over-powered, thats probably true, but it went really well against orks.

This is OP, and you know it. So play with it if you want, but don`t get disappointed if people won`t use it, m`kay?

You play tested this?? With REAL people??

Sorry, but im not buying it.

As stated, its blatently overpowered and has already been done to a degree by GW.

1) Waaaaay too cheap (+15p for a 50% increase in surviaiblity vs small/medium arms?)
2) Silly upgrade costs (+15p for a Stormbolter? You've just tried to tell me 15p is worth FNP on a 10 man squad of MEQ)
3) The existance of upgrades in the first place (Apochecarys have always had BP and the sawy thing with the silly name)
4) The fact that you suggest something that ALREADY EXISTS. (go play Red Scorpions if you want lots of apothecaries)

last codex marines could do that for 10 points per sergeant.

course then apothacaries simply allowed the unit to ignore 1 non-ID/power/ap1-2 wound.

Yeah, Solon--you didn't playtest this at all. The 25 point Apothecary squad leaders from The Anphelion Project weren't even this good--and they cost more and paid for Terminator Honors to get access to the armory.

No please you have Combat Squads, Combat Tactics, ATSKNF, and a million other awesome special rules... please let chaos keep FNP please please for the nurglings.

On a serious note I feel it might be OTT maybe a toned down version of FNP like maybe one FNP role per APOTH or something. I just dont like it very much

I only suggested the upgrades/weapons on forum.

what about only one wound may be taken as FNP.

what about that?

Captain Solon wrote:I only suggested the upgrades/weapons on forum.

...So? That makes it ok for them to be stupid?

what about only one wound may be taken as FNP.

Then it sucks. Thats lots worse than the 4th ed medic chars

what about that?

Holy Department of Redundency Department Batman!


And please don't tell be thats supposed to be a snappy retort

Black Antelope wrote:Holy Department of Redundency Department Batman!

You sir Win this thread!!

And Solon, ill answer your question the most simple way I know how:

Is it really so hard to accept people's ideas without being rude about it?


Upgrading Sergeants to Apothecaries really isn't that wild an idea. It was allowed under the doctrine system in the last codex, at 40 points a pop (15 points to upgrade for Terminator Honours, then 25 points to upgrade to an Apoth including Narthecium and Reductor).

So the only real problem with Solon's idea that I can see is that it's potentially a little cheap.

...has nobody noticed that this exact thing is already in Imperial Armor?

I believe that when somebody says that and people keep saying the exact things that are in Imperial armor and acting as though it's the newest S*** out there they should be quiet...

grayspark wrote:...has nobody noticed that this exact thing is already in Imperial Armor?

Yes:

dumplingman wrote:Check out one of the imperial armour's I don't remember which one. they have rules for the red scorpion chapter of space marines where instead of sargents they get apothicaries. IIRC the upgrade is + 25 points, cannot take wargear and are only in tac squads.

It's worth noting though that a lot of people don't have, or don't use, Imperial Armour.

Following my policy of giving Solon a web-smack every time he posts without thought...
*smack*

alexwars1 wrote:Following my policy of giving Solon a web-smack every time he posts without thought...
*smack*

That's a good policy to follow if you're looking for a vacation from the forum...

Res Scorpions have this rule. They have Apoths instead of sergeants for 25 points a pop.

Note: If an Apoth takes a PF wouldn't they lose thier Nerthesium gauntlet?

don't IG have medics only in command squads and cost 30pts? Seems a bit unfair if you have better armour/larger number/and cheaper?

(Wait theres my waaaaaabulance chimera pulling up...)

The 5th ed rules for the apothecary are in Vraks part 2.

The Red Scorpions pay +25pt for apothecaries to replace sargeants in tactical squads only. The apothecaries cannot take upgrades so your tac squads cannot have combi weapons, plasma pistols, power fists, meltabombs, etc.

Furthermore, red scorpions cannot use the infiltrate or scout USRs (so no outflanking either).


25pts is just about okay considering the downsides.

15pts for FNP in all squads with no downsides is much too cheap.

As has been pointed out, guard pay 30 points and it's only available in a handful of squads which are much cheaper than 10 marines.