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Hey All,

Trying to decide what route to go, I thought about this one for fun.

Lysander
Assault Terminators - 4LC, 3TH/SS, land raider crusader w/ MM
Master of the Forge - servo harness, PW, StormB
Dreanought - TL autocannon, plasma cannon
Dreanought - TL autocannon, plasma cannon
Dreanought, Ironclad - heavy flamer, meltagun, DCCW, SHammer, droppod
Dreanought, Ironclad - heavy flamer, meltagun, DCCW, SHammer, droppod
Dreanought, Ironclad - heavy flamer, meltagun, DCCW, SHammer, droppod
Tac Squad - 5man, sarge w/ PW & BoltP, meltabombs, in TL AssCanon RB
Tac Squad - 10 man, Heavy Bolter, Flamer, sarge w/ PW & MelttaB, Rhino
Tac Squad - 10man, flamer, multi melta, sarge w/ PW BoltP, Rhino or Droppod
Tac Squad - 10man, flamer, multi melta, sarge w/ PW BoltP, Rhino or Droppod

The Tactics - 3 Ironclads drop down in my opponents face and cause general unpleasantness for them. Even if they go reserves, I will be able to withstand most fire from them. The rifle dreads sit back and shoot stuff (obviously). The MotF rides in the RB and follows the terminators land raider into the fray, or splits off to cause trouble elsewhere.
The beavy bolter squad in the rhino is for scoring purposes only. The other 2 full squads, I am not sure yet what I want them to ride in. Taking both in droppods will allow me to land all 3 ironclads first round, and use them for dropping in where needed (CC, ojectives, etc). On the other hand, taking them in Rhinos allows for some maneuverability that may be needed, in which case landing 2 ironclads is still good, but not quite as good as for sure landing 3.

Such a list, I think, would work ok against horde type armies (and Im talking to you too rednekgunner) as the Ironclads can flame troops and then most likely assault. Using them as a screen the termies and support troops can motor in and join the fray. Against vehicle armies it would work against well as the Seismic Hammer can crunch most vehicles quite nicely.

I made this list mostly because I haven't see anyone at my FLGS take 5 dreads, and my dreads have generally done quite well on the battlefield (even when they explode they usually take someone with them). Plus, it would look pretty interesting on the table me thinks.

Comments and crits are welcome. If someone has a better view on taking 3 or 5 droppods, I'm open to hearing it.

Cheers

If your going to hinge everything on your Ironclads coming, put a locator beacon on one of those pods and drop them as a group. The last fellow who tried this against my IG lost the dreads and and the pods in 2 turns. Mostly due to the pods scattering so far away the dreads couldn't shoot anything.

Good idea, but locator beacons have to be on the board at the start of the turn to be able to be used. Unless I take a scout bike squad infiltrating with a locator beacon I can't use it could I?

And, just so I'm clear, teleport homers and locator beacons are not the same thing, correct?

Correct, paulguise. They can help later turn drops, but not other drops happening in the same turn.

I have a MoTF list also but I run nine droppods so I can have five dreads hit the table on turn one

Thanks for the suggestions and comments all. I think I will try out both the transport options to see how they play.

Now all I have to do is scratch build a MotF, as the metal ones kinda suck.

Thanks

Yeah pod all your tacs so all the Dreads can come down on turn 1. Personally I prefer the standard Dread with heavy flamer upgrade to eth Ironclad when you're in melta range AV12 or 13 doesn't make a huge difference and you save points and get more range for your melta.

Dump all the LC terminators and swap in TH/SS terminators they are just better everytime.

FlingitNow wrote:Yeah pod all your tacs so all the Dreads can come down on turn 1. Personally I prefer the standard Dread with heavy flamer upgrade to eth Ironclad when you're in melta range AV12 or 13 doesn't make a huge difference and you save points and get more range for your melta.

AR 13 works great when you get stuck in with some infantry, keeps those krak grenades from hurting you.

Dump all the LC terminators and swap in TH/SS terminators they are just better everytime.

Not true depends on the metagame of where you play

AR 13 works great when you get stuck in with some infantry, keeps those krak grenades from hurting you.

Krak grenades are hardly a major concern hitting on 6s and glancing on 6s.

Not true depends on the metagame of where you play

Why? LCs are better against horde TH/SS better against everything else. Even with LCs the Terminators will suck against hordes and hordes are the best way of dealing with Termmies so you won't want your LCs getting into CC with hordes but against your intended targets you are now at a disadvantage as you've got LCs instead of TH/SS...

I kindly suggest to exchange the 3 Ironclad Dreads with 3 normald Dreads as adviced by FlingitNow.
With the poins available you'll can update the 2 Dreads-gunners (or at least 1 of them) in Venerable, BS5. Or even better, just excanghe the autocannons for some TL lascannon.

I think you need one more Laser/antitank-source, why not on the MOTF Razorback.

Little "economically" / acceptables things that can change radically your efficiency in the first turn, in your case the more important turn of the game I think.

Looks alright to me, you've got the right amount of pods and transports. Only that land raider is a sore thumb but shouldn't be a issue with all the pods coming.

As flingit said ironclads don't really stop melta. And krak grenades still 6's and 6's to do any damage - not worth worrying about. Save those points and take multi melta dreads and you've got the extra range over the ironclads meltagun and also take a heavy flamer for having a BBQ before assaulting; can soften the unit up.

FlingitNow wrote:Why? LCs are better against horde TH/SS better against everything else. Even with LCs the Terminators will suck against hordes and hordes are the best way of dealing with Termmies so you won't want your LCs getting into CC with hordes but against your intended targets you are now at a disadvantage as you've got LCs instead of TH/SS...

blah blah blah, do I really have to tell you AGAIN why I disagree with you Fling... I've theorized and math hammered this to death on other threads just for you


I have had alot of success with Ironclad that measly one extra point of armour is huge plus, also the seismic hammer, extra attack, extra armour, and move thru cover are awesome

Wow. What an interesting discussion.

Fling: I have had better success with a LC & TH/SS mix then just going one way or the other. The LC termies usually die one per round of combat, but it is acceptable. Waiting until Int 1 can strike has cost me more in CC in the games I have played with them.

Also regarding Ironclads, the move through cover is a good one to have in the very likley case I have to go into or strike from cover.

Taking the Multmelta dreads was a consideration, but the one extra point of armor can make a difference. I may yet swap the ironclads for standard dreads w/ flamer, but I have to play test this list first to see how it goes.

Toban: I was considering a TL Las razorback, but 4 possible rending shots seems a better deal to me. Many a time I have seen a land raider brought down by a change rending assault cannon shot (it was usually my land raider being brought down). One shot to get a 3 or better doesnt seem like good odds. Have you had different experience?

Thanks again for the comments. It really helps to hammer out the ideas for list building.

While LC termies probably look better against hordes it will only be marginal; they only get one extra attack. Sure they get to re-roll but hammers wound on a 2+.

As for ironclads they are sure tasty, however the extra armour value doesn't make major difference with a 2D6 roll.

mercer wrote:While LC termies probably look better against hordes it will only be marginal; they only get one extra attack. Sure they get to re-roll but hammers wound on a 2+.

the difference is the initiative but am not gunna get dragged into this debate. Keep using those hammers and I'll keep killing your terminators with my Ork boyz works for me.

As for ironclads they are sure tasty, however the extra armour value doesn't make major difference with a 2D6 roll.

for an extra 30 points an Ironclad is well worth it's points against a Regular Dreadnought

Oh I agree general, in a way. But going first doesn't always help if you cannot hit and wound. However going last does let those 30+ attacks land first. Law of averages say you've got to fail some saves. Personaly I like a mix of hammers and claws for wound allocations and variety of opponents plus so some of my unit actually strikes more than likely first.

I'm not saying the ironclad isn't. I'm just saying that armour 13 isn't much difference for melta anyway from armour 12. Other anti tank weapons like a lascannon and krak rocket it's different and is where it counts. Plus even a power fist needs a 5+ to glance. So the melta difference from armour 12 to 13 isn't a negative so much as more benefits are gained by not been affected by other weapons so easily.

AV13 isn't as much help against melta, but against everything else it's awesome.

I like the list!

Sounds like a fun, although expensive list to play.

Are you going to be taking this list or one like it to 'Ard Boyz? Just asking because of the high point level of the list.

Yes, this is something I am planning on for 'Ard Boyz. Its a departure from my usual marine heavy list (i like more boots on the ground) but there is only so much that can be accomplished with 80+ troops.

As for the "against melta" discussion for the Ironclad, I am not terribly worried about it to be honest. There are 2 folks who are going to be in the tournament at the FLGS who use meltas religiously. Against those 2, I would be sending down the dread pods far enough away to prevent at least the 2d6 penetration rollling, and then tying them up on in CC with troops until the dreads can come into range to play.

Thanks again for the comments all. It really helps.