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HI all,am new to these forums.
I have played 40k for a couple years now and have a space marine and daemon army,but have now decided to go for an eldar army.I have come up with a 2500 pt list mainly because thats the size of the games we play at our club.i was after any advice from eldar players or any one wishing to drop any comments good or bad.

HQ
Farseer
Spirit stones
Doom
Fortune
Singing spear

Farseer
Spirit stones
Doom
Fortune
Singing spear

Elites
Fire Dragons x5
Exarch
Fire Pike
Tank Hunters

Wave serpent
T/L Star Cannons
Star Engines

Howling Banshees x10
Exarch
Mirror Swords
War Cry

Wave serpent
T/L Scatter Lasers
Star Engines

Striking Scorpians x5
Exarch
Bitting Blade
Stalker
Shadow Strike

Troops
Rangers x5
Pathfinders x5

Rangers x5
Pathfinders x5

Rangers x5
Pathfinders x5

Dire Avengers x10
Exarch
2nd Shuriken Catapult
Bladestorm

Jetbikes x5

Fast
Swooping Hawks x10
Exarch
Sun Rifle
Skyleap

Warp Spidersx10
Exarch
Death Spinner
Power Blades
Surpirse Assault
Withdraw

Heavy
Fire Prism

Fire Prism

Falcon
Star Engines
Scatter Laser

The main though behind this list is using the units i like the look of and all the above models i think look awesome.

The basic paln will to station the rangers on or near objectives to take out elite squads i.e terminators.
The 2 farseers would split up,one going with the banshees in the serpent to help the banshees out by using fortune and doom.The other farseer would go with the dire avengers to do a similar role,esp with the dire avengers bladestorm too.
the scorpians will infiltrate from the start and eiter go for artillery or go for lone hqs.
the fire prisms would harrase tanks and use the combine affect alot too.
the falcon will try to get behind vehicles to shoot at the rear armour.
The fire dragons would also be on tank and elite killing duties.
The swooping hawks deep striking with their grenade packs while the warp spiders jump in and out causing confusion.
The jet bikes i would keep held back till near the end when i would release them to go for an objective.

im just after a fresh set of eyes to glance my list over and tell me what they think,good or bad its ok.

iam thinking maybe the swooping hawks and warp spiders are too big and might drop their squad sizes down.

i mostly will be fighting csm,space wolves,blood angels,the vanilla marines and tau.

Not a bad start for a list.

A couple things I'd change are:
I think your Farseers are a little heavy, leave one as a bone-dry Doomseer
Place the Firedragons inside the Falcon, and Waveserpent the DAs
Swooping Hawks aren't very competitive, perhaps field another unit instead?
No firepike on the Exarch, tank hunters is even a bit overkill IMO
You'll begin to love Executioner on the Banshee Exarch over Mirror Swords, Doom isn't always gonna be there

Things to definately keep:
Two Farseers
Two nekkid Fire Prisms
Dire Avengers
Rangers(I know some will disagree with this, but I love how they annoy people)

Hey bro, welcome to Eldar.


A couple things I notice about your list I wanna toss out just real quick like.

HQ

Double Farseers can be an effective combo, just try to make sure they dont get drop-killed.

I sortve like running 1 generic farseer with warlocks and 1 without, and keeping them close together so they can counter-charge or attatch if necessary.

Warlocks generally arent an advisable splash, if your taking some, take a lot. If they arent on jetbikes, then give the ones NOT modeled with singing spears destructor if you have points to burn at the end. Otherwise a guide never hurt anyone, and not every Warlock has to buy a power.

If you dont want the warlocks, attatching to the dire avengers is a fine idea, although I recommend you give it a transport.


Elites

In any army over 1500 points you definately need two squads of Firedragons. There seems to be a debate over the exarch, but in my opinion he isnt necessary. It isnt worth the extra 50+ points for all those abilities when the turn will play out something like this.

Your Turn: For movement I'm putting my Waveserpent within 6' inches of your vehicle. For shooty I'm going to blow it up.

His Turn: I'm using every available bullet and power to kill your firedragons before they can jump in your serpent.


The exarch's range only affects his firepike. I say field 2x units of firedragons, no exarchs.


I have limited experience with Banshees, so I cant say much about them other than that when not in transports they die easily with 4+ armor and no invuls. I see you have them in transports, but I'm going to suggest you cut them to make room for the other fire dragons and keep the scorpions, possibly increasing their size a little bit more.



Troops

15x Pathfinders.


Pathfinders are tricky. Rending on 5 and 6 is great, so are 2+ coversaves, but keep a couple things in mind.

1) Their weapons are Heavy Weapons, so with walk on rules they arent doing anything your first round.
2) Make sure when you deploy them in cover that you arent so far in cover yourself that your opponent gets it as well. (2inches I think?) If you do, then youve given away your best feature of the mode. Having Armor Penetrating sniper fire is mitigated greatly by a 4+ cover save.
3) I play a lot of space marines at my store as well, and this happens a lot.

My Turn: Snipers go! Pew pew pew!
His Turn: Deep Strike = Pathfinders vs AP5/4 flamers. The outcome there, as you might guess, is 5 dead snipers usually.

A small squad of them is good if you have the ability to sit them on an objective at the start of the game and can keep another unit nearby to dissuade a deepstrike, but they generally die the turn they prove usefull. And even with a 4 BS, only wounding on 4+ sucks.

I'd recommend dropping 2 squads of these and creating 1 squad of no more than 8, to save points and to maybe survive a round of flames.


DA's are a great troop for the eldar, even if not as good as a basic space marine. I do recommend giving these guys a waveserpent however, and using them as objective whores if you can. Blade storm is awesome for shots fired on a target, and if you move them back into the wave serpent next turn, the reload downtime doesnt hurt so bad.

Since we opened up 2 troop slots by reducing the number of pathfinders, I suggest creating a 6 man squad of Dire Avengers as well, that you can mount inside of your Falcon. If push comes to shove at the end of the game you can attempt to tank-shock-capture the point with the DA's in tow.

Jetbikes are Jetbikes. Keep a warlock in there that can cast embolden so they can reroll failed leadership if they break.


Fast Attack

A lot of people dislike swooping hawks for their points, but I like running a squad of 5 + sunrifle exarch. If you want to run 10, have you considering cutting some points elsewhere and splitting into two groups of 5+ exarch? That would give you two haywire or grenade packs a turn.

I havent played with spiders just because I dont have the models, so I can tell you much about them. I never liked the thought of losing them in the warp though.

Heavy

Looks solid, the 2 naked Fire Prisms.



Other Suggestions

Wave Serpents

Considering what you are hauling in them, I would recommend keeping them cheap. You have a lot of tank kill, and to be honest, you will very rarely need the Star Engines. They were great before the FAQ confirmed that you have to use them in shooty phase, so you can combine the moves for a long range ram or whatever.

Star Cannons are also pretty horrible in this edition.

I recommend the 110 point build of all the free shuriken weapons and Spirit Stones, so you dont ever lose the ability to move. (Unless you got blowed up.) I'd make this pretty stock for ALL of your WS. It will save you a ton of points as well.


Falcon Grav

Putting the Scatter laser on here is a bit of a mixed hat. It's Pulse cannon is an armor killer, while the scatter laser is anti infantry. With the holo-fields, your Falcon is intended to be a ranged tank, taken in close in an extreme situation, like a last minute grab for an objective. I'd swap the ESL for a EML or BL, depending on your points.

As usual, drop the Star Engines and upgrade to Spirit Stones, and get holo-fields.




I'm at work and cant tally the points, but I'd revise your list to the following, in summary.

HQ

Either

Farseer x 1
Spirit stones
Doom
Fortune
Singing spear

Autarch w/ wings, Fusion Gun + ???

OR

Farseer x1 (Rolling with the DA's)
Spirit stones
Doom
Fortune
Singing spear

Farseer x1
Spirit Stones
Doom
Fortune
Singing Spear

Warlocks x Affordable. (Make sure some have spears and at least one has enhance.)

Elites

Fire Dragons x5

Wave Serpent
Spirit Stones

Fire Dragons x5

Wave Serpent
Spirit Stones

Striking Scorpions x7
Exarch
Bitting Blade
Stalker
Shadow Strike

Troops

Pathfinders x8

Dire Avengers x10
Exarch
2nd Shuriken Catapult [ Attatch Farseer ]
Bladestorm

Wave Serpent
Spirit Stones

Dire Avengers x6
(This unit is an end of game tank-shock objective grab. No reason to spend for an exarch imo, when they might not ever leave your Falcon Grav.)

Jetbikes x5
Jetbike Warlock x1 w/ Embolden

Fast

Swooping Hawks x5
Exarch
Hawk Talon or Sunrifle, based on points.
Skyleap
Intercept

Swooping Hawks x5
Exarch
Hawk Talon or Sunrifle, based on points.
Skyleap
Intercept
(Talon may be better if your playing a lot of marines and not guardsmen or hordes.)

Warp Spidersx10
Exarch
Death Spinner
Power Blades
Surpirse Assault
Withdraw

(No comment here.)

Heavy

Fire Prism
Fire Prism
Falcon
Spirit Stones
BL or EML
(6 DA's embarked)

Again, I didnt math out the points, so you might have to cut in some places, especially to afford the locks. The double squad of Rubber Hawks is if you plan on yo-yoing them up and down. The Autarch helps make that more reliable.


Just my suggestions.

Good luck.

Thunderfrog's advice is all completely correct. I still think pathfinders aren't worth it against skilled opponents and swooping hawks are just awful though!

I would also give one farseer runes of warding, it's a very useful upgrade, if you expect to face any psykers at all.

the farseers are cool although if your haveing two id think about mixing up the powers abit maybe tske on with guide and doom just to sweeten the shooting of one of your squads for a turn and maybe give the other mind war its a great spell for clearing really anoying characters.

the rest of the army seems pretty sound
ive never been brave enough for the pathfinders/rangers troops list as there very very fragile one well placed flamer and thats it no cover saves no nothnig usually one squad just gone.

the swooping hawks are far too large for there points especially considering used well theyll never be attacked at all, at the start of every turn they can use skyleap even if the arrived that same turn so basically use them to deepstrike drop the haywire then jump up and do it again next turn gets rid of tanks a treat then on turn 5 /6 deepstrike in and run onto an objective to contest it.

10 warp spiders will be awesome especially with there firepower if you can get a succesfull guide and doom with you farseer whislt shooting with them itl be fun to watch the opponent taking his models off the board

other than that mate it sounds like a sweet army i might even have to give it a go myself

oh and p.s the falcon model is cool but its very overpriced for what it actually does and how easy it goes boom
perhaps consider warwalkers they can ammass far more fire power are cheao and if you want something to get rear armour well they have out flank so sit back and watch the fireworks

hope this is of any help

Thank you very much for your replies. i have adjusted my list and will post it in the morning.

"oh and p.s the falcon model is cool but its very overpriced for what it actually does and how easy it goes boom

perhaps consider warwalkers they can ammass far more fire power are cheao and if you want something to get rear armour well they have out flank so sit back and watch the fireworks "


I'm playing my first game with a Falcon Grav tomorrow. I stubbornly stuck with my Wraithlords, but am moving on to try something different.

I just cant see bringing a "few" war walkers.

Im my opinion, if your brining 3, you should be brining 9.

They're kinda like Vypers, in my opinion.

Right have had a think and changed a few bits about and come up with the following.

Hq
farseer
doom
fortune
singing spear
spirit stones

farseer
fortune
guide
spirit stones
singing spear

warlocks x8
destructor x4
singing spear x4
enhance x1

wave serpent
spirit stones
tl catapults

elites
striking scorpians x8
exarch
biting blade
stalker
shadowstrike

fire dragons x5

wave serpent
spirit stones
tl catapults

fire dragons x5

wave serpent
spirit stones
tl catapults

troops
dire avengers x6

dire avengers x10
exarch
2nd catapult
bladestorm

wave serpent
spirit stones
tl catapults

jetbikes x5

fast
warp spiders x10
exarch
deathspinner
powerblades
surprise assault
withdraw

swooping hawks x5
exarch
hawks talon
sky leap
intercept

heavy
falcon
holofields
spirit stones
eml

fire prism

fire prism

right i have taken the awesome advice given and reduced some of the squad sizes. i changed the powers on the 2nd farseer and given him a warlock body guard and put them and most of the army in serpents. a second fire dragon squad has been added as has a small da squad to go in the falcon for last turn objective hunts along with the jetbikes.the hawks have been reduced but the spider's stay at 10. the first farseer will tag along with the large da squad to add his support, right any thoughts? good or bad. many thanks.

How about more wave serpents and less aspect warriors?
That gives you a faster army,instead of foot sloggers
But I still love your list!


Automatically Appended Next Post:
I mean Deep strikers,not foot sloggers

I can't really add much different, everyone has nailed it. One thing though, I play Eldar and I love running Eldrad. If your list is 2500 I would include him, I think he's well worth it.

Well, its almost a little bit of everything.
Swooping Hawks have no place in a competitive list.
Scorpions are better replaced by a 2nd FD squad.
Falcons are not worth their pts in the 5th ed.

ok cool. thank you. what are your opinions on a wraithlord instead of the falcon

wuestenfux wrote:Well, its almost a little bit of everything.
Swooping Hawks have no place in a competitive list.
Scorpions are better replaced by a 2nd FD squad.
Falcons are not worth their pts in the 5th ed.

1. Spiders are better than Hawks in every way. You already have spiders so... Wuest is right there.
2. I agree on the dragons, but only because without a hammer/anvil or counterassault setup, scorpions are hard to position for success.
3. Disagree. Triple Falcon lists are gone, but I think Falcons are worth the points with a BL and Guideseer or Eldrad to buff them. With no supporting element - they suck. (BS3.. Wha?!)
I like Dual Fire Prism and a Falcon Gunboat.

Right i have dropped the 1st farseer and added eldrad. the swooping hawks have gone too and the warlocks now up to 10 with an extra destructor and singing spear put on the extra warlocks.

Well, Falcons are too expensive, especially in small pt games.
How about 3 War Walkers with shuricannons, 120 pts.

i quite like the idea of that. how about wraithlords?

Daemon Dave wrote:i quite like the idea of that. how about wraithlords?

Well, in a fast moving army, a Wraith Lord would be a liability.
He's good in a footslogging army giving fire support and having decent counter-strike abilities.

what are peoples opinions on wraithguard?

"Well, its almost a little bit of everything.
Swooping Hawks have no place in a competitive list.
Scorpions are better replaced by a 2nd FD squad.
Falcons are not worth their pts in the 5th ed. "


His new list has 2x FD.




It looks waaay better Dave. You could play it at this point. As far as the swooping hawks go, they have limited use, but not much.

The 10 Warpspiders are good. I hadn't seen them used previously when I posted but I played someone running double autarchs and 20 warp spiders this weekend, and those things are fairly nasty. Against toughness 3 they need two or better to wound. and they have good ballistic skill, so it's a nice addition to your army.

Keeping your 1 falcon is good. I used to play 1 or 2 Wraith Lords, and they are good for attacking vehicles up close if you can get them there. They also give a cover save to a Farseer council moving behind them.

Just remember that the more eldar zombies you use, the more clustered you will be. Keeping psykers in range is important as Wraithsight is horrible.

The wraithguard seem best used in a group of 10 with a spiritseer as a troup choice. They are expensive and slow, but hard to peel off an objective. If you dont have enough wave serpernts to house all of your troop choices, a WG unit can help.

I think your list as posted right now can play a game and win if you play your opponent correctly. It wouldnt win a tournament, but it might give your store some good games.

awesome. might write a wraith list and see what you think. to be honest i wont be entering tournaments yet, im in the process of setting a club up in my area.