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HQ
Captain w/ Power Sword - 115

Elite
Dreadnought w/ Multi-Melta, CCW - 105
Terminator Squad (Sarge w/ Chainfist) - 200

Troops
Tac Squad 10 marines w/ MG, ML, plasma pistol for sarge, Razorback w/ TL LC - 265
Tac Squad 10 marines w/ FL, ML, Rhino w/ HK Missile - 215
Scout Squad w/ Sniper Rifles, ML, One extra sniper, Telion - 148

Fast
2x Land Speeder w/ MM

Heavy
2x Predator w/ Autocannon, LC sponsons - 240
1x Predator w/ Autocannon, HB sponsons - 85

Total: 1493

I'm still a noob (most of this list is based off of AoBR) and so what you see as advantages and disadvantages would be helpful. I've not yet purchased one of the predators or the razorback as of yet, so I'm more inclined to dropping one of those than something else.

Some loose comments:
- The captain is an assault character but I can't see which unit he's going to help out.
- I like the LC/TL PG Razor better.
- Predators are great

The captain can be tooled up a little more. A relic blade is the ultimate power weapon btw for the captain.

Dreadnought needs support and a drop pod or it will never get into range.

Terminators need a land raider to be delivered really.

If your taking tanks take them in pairs, though both the rhino and razorback haev the same armour anyway. But it does make target priority easy to do. If your combating your squads may as well go razorbacks if it works for you.

Speeders should be seperate, armour 10 in a squad is a no-no.

Predators are ok, while the lascannon turret is over priced the autocannon isn't exactly anti tank like the lascannons so kind of odd couple.

Captain: either go with a single Lightning claw, two, or if you want to keep the blade, a relic blade.

Dread is ok, though pretty average performer equipped like that. (Pod and hvy flamer when expanding is recommended)
Termy squad really needs a hvy weapon as that is the reason to get them IMO.

Speeders are ok, though I feel Attack Bikes work better with the single weapons like Hvy Bolters or MM.
Preds are ok.
Scouts: I don’t think there is enough bodies in that squad, IMO drop Telion for the bodies.
Tacticals are ok, though I’m not sure how useful the TLLC is on a Razorback, I’d suggest the LC/TLPG instead.

@mercer:
The AC/LC pred is IMO a widely accepted combo that's great for an anti-transport role...it's not an odd couple in that regard.

Against armour 12 the autocannon needs a 5+ to glance while a lascannon needs a 3+. Tell me how that is good?

If a MEQ is firing:

Lascannon will hit on 3+, cause an effect on 3+: 4/9 results.
Autocannon will hit on 3+, cause an effect on 5+: 4/9 results.
Why? AC has 2 shots and is cheaper for same results vs. AV 12 and better if less AV.

Sanctjud look at chance to penetrate:

3+ to hit 4+ to pen = 1/3

vs

3+ to hit 6 to pen = 2/9

When you're actually talking about doing real damage the LC is better against AV12, against AV11 you're the same against AV10 you're slightly better off.

But yeah I'm with you the AC/LC Pred is the best set up for a Pred. All Dakka is also good. The tri-Las is over priced for under effectiveness. I don't rate LCs against armour over AV12 anyway. Even with MEQ firing your chance to take out AV13 with a Lascannon is:

2/3 hit 1/3 penetrate 1/3 destroy = 2/27 or just 7% If that AV13 is a Hammerhead half that immediately...

Against AV14 again we're again talking half, so why even bother firing when you've less than a 4% chance of success (unless it's your only option)?

Use Meltas for anti-heavy armour (AV13-14) that AC/LC will tear through light to medium armour (AV10-12 or even MCs) at a rapid rate and is hugely points efficient.

Pretty much what Sanctjud.
However in your list with I think you could save some pts and go with a plain TLHB one. Plasma pistol on the sarge is also a waste. Way too expensive for what it brings to the table.
Not sure that 6th scout is needed. They are just extra wounds for telion and the ML guy.


Get a CML on those termies if you want them to make a difference.
Try to either find 35pts for a Pod in order to suicide drop the dread, stick another weapon on it or simply drop it all togheter.





Automatically Appended Next Post:
Actually, vs transports I find glance to be an important thing aswell. Usually atleast half the glances stops the transport from moving forward (for atleast a turn)

Usually atleast half the glances stops the transport from moving forward (for atleast a turn)

? Only immobilised will stop a transport from moving if it has extra armour/spirit stones etc (which most do) even if not only 2 results stop it from moving 6 and 4, which is 1 in 3 at best.

People buy extra armour? . Ill give you the spirit stone, but then you will be looking at a str 8 LC shot as well...


Automatically Appended Next Post:
oh, dunno what I was thinking. Obviously its just 1/3 but my point is still somewhat relevant

People buy extra armour?

If it's carrying anything that desperately needs to get to your lines. Spirit stones all the time obviously, Tau always have DPs (not quite the same thing obviously) and LRs often have EA as their such a point sink anyway.

Ok, lets revise then:

HQ
Captain w/ Relic Sword, Digital Weapons, Hellfire Rounds - 150

Elite
Dreadnought w/ Multi-Melta, CCW, Drop Pod - 140
Terminator Squad (Sarge w/ Chainfist) - 200

Troops
Tac Squad 10 marines w/ MG, ML, Razorback w/ TLPC/LC - 250
Tac Squad 10 marines w/ FL, ML, Rhino w/ HK Missile, teleport homer - 230
Scout Squad w/ Sniper Rifles, ML, One extra sniper, Telion - 148

Fast
2x Land Speeder w/ MM (Wasn't planning on squadding them) - 100

Heavy
2x Predator w/ Autocannon, LC sponsons - 240

Total: 1498

Teleport Homer is to bring in the Terminators for Assaulting. (I wish they were assault terminators, but hey.)

TYou need more than one drop pod or else the dreadnought will come in and then be nuked.

You mean one drop pod with dreadnought and one deathwind drop pod?

No, he means 3 drop pods so 2 can come in first turn to have some saturation...but I'm not a fan of pods in general. Great stuff but not my cup of tea when we don't have the choice to pod stuff in first turn.

Terminator Squad (Sarge w/ Chainfist) - 200

Sarge can't take a Chainfist and it would be 205 points.

Mercer is right the whilst the Dread needs a DP to be effective it also needs a buddy, either pair him up with another DP dread (and take a 3rd DP obviously) or drop him and spend the points on something you are going to commit to. Like you have done with the preds.

The rest of the army is pretty good except drop the extra scout sniper for camo-cloaks on the scouts. HK missiles suck big time unless you are using a bucklet load for an alphastrike (even then they are of dubious value).

Sanctjud wrote:No, he means 3 drop pods so 2 can come in first turn to have some saturation...but I'm not a fan of pods in general. Great stuff but not my cup of tea when we don't have the choice to pod stuff in first turn.

Exactly as he said. And I'm not a massive fan of them either.

How's this then? I'm not super happy about losing the lascannon option on the Razorback.

HQ
Captain w/ Power Sword - 115

Elite
2x Dreadnought w/ Multi-Melta, CCW, Drop Pod - 280
Terminator Squad - 200

Troops
Tac Squad 10 marines w/ MG, ML, Razorback w/ HB - 215
Tac Squad 10 marines w/ FL, ML, Rhino-205
Scout Squad w/ Sniper Rifles, Telion - 125

Fast
2x Land Speeder w/ MM - 100

Heavy
2x Predator w/ Autocannon, LC sponsons - 240

I think you have to buy camo cloaks for the rest of your snipers, Telion does not pass his save on to the rest of them and its worth the points.

I think you have to buy camo cloaks for the rest of your snipers, Telion does not pass his save on to the rest of them and its worth the points.

Ifyou do that you also have to buy the camocloak for Telion, his stealth rule is a bit dumb that way. This list looks far more solid. Not convinced on the Vanilla Terminators tough.

snipers should always take camo cloaks. it's 15 points but an extra save is always worth it when you're talking snipers.

Scouts aren't in power armour so if they get shot at (and they will because sniper rifles are a BITCH to fight against even in power armour)

Vanilla Terminators......Either make them ATs (TH/SS all the way) or give them an Assault Cannon or Heavy Flamer. Storm Bolters are all well and good, but an AC or HF will give you much more long range or short range firepower.

HQ
?

Elite
2x Dreadnought w/ Multi-Melta, CCW, Drop Pod - 280

Troops
Tac Squad 10 marines w/ MG, ML, Razorback w/ HB - 215
Tac Squad 10 marines w/ FL, ML, Rhino-205
Scout Squad w/ Sniper Rifles, Telion, camo - 140

Fast
2x Land Speeder w/ MM - 120

Heavy
2x Predator w/ Autocannon, LC sponsons - 240

If I get rid of the captain and the terminator squad, what do I get to replace them? (300 points to fill)

(I don't have a big problem with the Captain, I'm just not sure what I'd do with him, since I'm not running a very assault oriented list.)

I was going to suggest keeping the single dread, and having it march forward with your rhinos to be a bigger target and walking cover save.

Keep the Termies, get an assault cannon, and your HQ can be a Termie libby with storm bolter, with either avenger or vortex, and null zone.

The only HQ's for marines I like in your list would be a librarian for medium range abilities, or a MotF (possibly on bike with beamer)