Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

Hey guys, gonna play my first game in a new city today... And vs a dakkite no less! It's a 1500 point slugfest vs dwarves...I'm thinking of running:
Exaulted with enchanted shield, Necrotic Phylactery
Exaulted with 2xWeapons and MoK
Sorcerer with LvL 2, Book of secrets, MoT
17 Warriors, full command, banner of neverending frenzy
17 Warriors, full command, MoK
6 Warhounds
6 Warhounds
5 Knights, MoT
2 Spawn

1500 exactly

I'm using most of the models in my current posession, only having a Demon Prince and a shaggoth which will look on intimidatingly from the side...the only real things I'm considering are merging the dogs or losing an exaulted for more shiney bits... Although generally that's not my style... I'll bring a camera and post a few pics

Not too shabby. My first change would be to drop the phylactery for a knight musician, and my second would be to drop the sorcerer's second level to buy him a disc and a talisman of protection. Or downshift the first exalted's e.shield to a shield and pick up the golden eye to ensure that dwarf shooting does next to nothing against him. As it stands, where is the sorcerer going? You've just got two frenzied blocks for him to hang in, meaning he'll be the weakest warrior in the front line and so punched in the face first! And there is little need for 2 levels with the book - I run a single level 1 + book in 1000 and 1500 and do well tossing 2 dice into flicker, 2 dice into fireball / dark hand. Much less chance of a miscast too.

One other thing, those warriors have shields, right? Good

Here's my little tweak'em:

H: Sorcerer - MoT, golden eye, book of secrets, disc = 175
H: Exalted - MoK, ahw = 129
H: Exalted - shield = 115

C: 17 Warriors - banner of rage, full command, shields = 337
C: 17 Warriors - MoK, full command, shields = 332
C: 6 Warhounds = 36
C: 6 Warhounds = 36

S: 5 Knights - MoT, musician = 230

R: 2 Spawn = 110
--------
1500

The disc gives you another mobile element to eliminate dwarf shooting with luck, as the dogs were going to be hard pressed to drop war machines on their own.

Good luck in the game!

EDIT: I'm guessing you don't have a disc? Running that sorcerer with the eye on foot is not impossible, especially against dwarfs and their slowness. It's a much less mobile option that suffers some LoS blocking, but 18" flicker + 24" fireball still works (just watch for gyro charges). The extra 20 points can get plugged into either exalted equipment (sword of might? roar? biting blade + e.shield + favor?) or a standard for the knights if you've got one handy.

- Salvage

Oh man! If only I'd noticed this thread- I could have read up for list espionage...

Thanks for the input salvage, and you are right on all accounts... (shields, disc, etc). I was playing Red_Zeke's dwarf army, which was primarily fighty, no small arms fire, a pair of bolt throwers and a stone thrower (which is now my least favorite dwarf warmachine, if it's possible to dethrone the organ gun). the sorc was able hide from warmachine fire for most of the game ... And only after Zeke had broken my army (Treason of Tzneetxhzczxxz!!!!) did I trow him to a swift death via rune encrusted bolt. I did botch a few key LoS oppurtunities, which a disc could have prevented...but overall I don't think it would have helped much. Not even my poor distance managment and timely dice farts could overcome Zekes superb generalship *looks at knights that got run down by dwarf infantry* *looks at slowest spawns in the world* *looks at slightly singed bolt thrower with nonDIAF dwarfs diligently skewering warriors*

Now then, I also lost to a wood elf army, although not as horribly, which is odd because it was a toned down tourney list, and was filled to the brim with long ranged pointy things (Must investigate further), fast cav, a Mage, GW highborn w/ hail of doom arrow and something about leadership arrow) and a treeman... All horrible things that my army really struggles with at this level. Once again dice farts let me dafty snatch defeat from the jaws of certain victory. (5 str 2 hits on general from flickfire... Gw highborn fails leadership and runs from combat before I could murderize his pointy ears... Lone knight kills one archer a turn to stay locked in combat most of the game). This one did have a few favorable mistakes by him, and some poor rolling (treeman failing 3 ld in a row to run off board not much shooting damage)... And I was only a few hundred down, although it could have easily swung to a solid victory/massacre had a few key moments gone my way... overall the guy was fairly new but nice and fun to play against/talk to; so I had a good time. They run a much tighter ship up here than I'm used to, which might be a nice change of pace for me (ultra left wing causal gamer... To me the beauty of warhammer is the infinite possibilites allowed by making up fun rules / battles) ... But it would be fun to be savvy enough to go and whomp ass at a GT... On that thought: what did I learn from my second game vs dwarfs and 3rd against Welfs?
1. Needs more cowbell, and by that I mean warhounds... I will steal 20 from my BoC and run two more units of ten (I will also make an effort to place them by my general, because you feel like an idiot when both units fail ld by being 2 inches out of his radius). I need more cheap speed to engage stonethrowers (hate!) and weather the rain of feathered sticks.
2. Have Heros leave units BEFORE they are march blocked, so they can 360• charge fast cav.
3. Change MoK exaulted for another sorc? I had the upper hand against both armys magically... Another few spells a turn could really help with my battleships getting march blocked...
Those are the tweaks I feel would improve my army the most... I might end up playing both fellas again next week, so we'll see if those changes come to fruition and what effect they'll have...
Until then I'm gonna look into painting up my other unit of knights as MoT, as the ones I use now don't look the part, and the min sized MoT unit has served me well.

Until next battle, I'm off to convince the dark gods to give me ranged weapons so that I might smite more efficiently in their name,
dru

I should mention that in our game, I literally only failed 2 armor saves, and those were two light armor wearing gun crew. Add to that the fact that even when I guessed a little long or short, the grudge thrower scattered on to target, and I was pretty much watching my dice play the game for me.

I'll be on a painting spree this weekend, so we can get some pics up of round 2...

Kiwidru wrote:
1. Needs more cowbell, and by that I mean warhounds... I will steal 20 from my BoC and run two more units of ten (I will also make an effort to place them by my general, because you feel like an idiot when both units fail ld by being 2 inches out of his radius). I need more cheap speed to engage stonethrowers (hate!) and weather the rain of feathered sticks.
2. Have Heros leave units BEFORE they are march blocked, so they can 360• charge fast cav.
3. Change MoK exaulted for another sorc? I had the upper hand against both armys magically... Another few spells a turn could really help with my battleships getting march blocked...

4. Get magic weapon. I didn't mention it as you were playing dwarfs specifically, but past 1000 I make sure I have a magic weapon for taking on ethereal things and *drum roll* wood elves! Even a biting blade suffices, ala that one exalted build I suggested.

Re: your other tweaks -
1. 10 strong puppies?! You should be able to get by with 5, and I wouldn't go beyond 3x 5 warhounds, IMO things start to get cluttered and your points in chaff start to amass. You ever think about marauder cav? Lovely models, fix war machines right up better than hounds do (but cost oodles more and it sounds like you've got warhounds to spare).
2. Spawn are probably best for nabbing march blockers. Wandering heroes around seems fraught with peril, mostly ensuring their unusefulness to their block as well as their death.
3. The khorne boys probably don't need the exalted's help, frankly. Pushing your magic advantage might indeed be a good idea, maybe a level 2 fire mage? Or a level 2 tizzer to toss another 2 die flicker

Here's what some of that might look like in a list:

H: Sorcerer - MoT, golden eye, book of secrets = 155
H: Sorcerer - level 2, enchanted shield, talisman of protection = 150
H: Exalted - sword of might, shield = 135

C: 18 Warriors - MoK, full command, shields = 348
C: 17 Warriors - banner of rage, full command, shields = 337
C: 5 Warhounds = 30
C: 5 Warhounds = 30
C: 5 Warhounds = 30

S: 5 Knights - MoT, musician = 230

R: Spawn = 55
--------
1500

Solo tizzer still there, but with a fire mage buddy, equipped with gear to ride the front of the ragestar if required. Pretty buff save on the dude, so solo work isn't unheard of. Exalted got his magic S6 on, and then there are more puppies too. A spawn was ground up to pay for this, because as you are finding out they're only so-so. I'd keep one around to help deal with march blockers and do 360 things, though the extra wizards running about should toast them off nicely.

Cheers on your games thus far, pity that RZ dropped the (grudge thrower-shaped) hammer on your boys. Better luck next time!

- Salvage

Alright, having done no work yet today... I'll post and start playing catch up before the weekend. I made this army back when I had beast herds and furies to protect my flanks... And havnt gone back and picked up marauders to replace them :( but I would love to take a warrior block out and replace it with a cheaper core... the wall of steel marches on regardless; Revised List:
Exaulted: Shield
Sorc: MoT, Disc, Book of Fireball
Sorc: MoT, Level 2
17 Warriors: Shield, Command, Banner of Neverending Frenzy
15 Warriors: Shield, Command, MoK
10 Warhounds
10 Warhounds
5 Warhounds
5 Warhounds
5 Knights, MoT
Spawn

1497.

I think the blocks are strong enough to lose a few bodys... with this format I can keep a big unit of 10 as a wingman to the perkmiter of each block, ready to engage any fast movers that bypass my initial battle line, while still having units to be the disposable first wave. The discer has two dd's so he should be able to fry anything that the dogs don't chase away... The only real change in considering is from a modeling aspect... Switching to a slaanesh Mage. I already have a 1500 pt khorn themed beastmen auxiliary, and my next one was going to be slaanesh themed dark elves, led by a sorc... But it irks me to play with models that arnt wysiwyg... Anyone have experience with lore of slaanesh?

Gads that's a lot of hounds! What are you wanting to do with the 10 hound units? Part of warhounds value is their cheap cost per unit - 30 (36 if you want 6 for numbers) is so cheap that you can easily have them die on suicide missions like diverting and such. The big dog units bring numbers but not a lot else, if they're there to fight.

I say play around with MoS on the level 2, there are a lot of more tactical (read: involving psych, unlike 1/2 of fantasy) spells with neat uses. You've got the tizz dude to bring the offensive fire, let the other guy bring a DD and an interesting slaanesh spell a turn. Also, you really do want golden eye on the discer, it's superb, and I still think ANY magic weapon would be a good idea on the exalted. His big unit has a lot of CR, but liquefying treemonics is extra special.

Here's my next round:

H: Exalted - biting blade, favor, shield = 125
H: Sorcerer - MoT, golden eye, book of secrets, disc = 175
H: Sorcerer - MoS, level 2 = 125

C: 17 Warriors - banner of rage, full command, shields = 337
C: 15 Warriors - MoK, full command, shields = 300
C: 10 Warhounds = 60
C: 5 Warhounds = 30
C: 5 Warhounds = 30
C: 5 Warhounds = 30

S: 5 Knights - MoT, musician = 230

R: Spawn = 55
--------
1497

I'm concerned for where that non-disc sorcerer thinks he's going, cause if it's the front of the ragestar he's pulp ... But at least he'll get 3 attaks

Kept one giant warhound pack, and made sure the knights brought a horn along. 5 non-khorne knights with no standard are relying upon CR to win, but don't bring enough attaks to make that a sure thing. You will want the musician. You will also want to relegate them to flanking real blocks, engaging with light targets or supporting charges from the warriors. IMO they simply don't bring the heat to make a frontal charge functional.

- Salvage

Don't know the book real well, but can you find a way to get your exalted with shield a great weapon as well? Then he can pick and choose before a combat. And so when you get the charge off, and if he's in with the frenzy banner, you can throw 5 attacks at WS 7 and Str 7. That should help dice some people up for a pretty small investment.

RZ