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Q1. When you disembark after your vehicle have been wrecked in the oppenents shooting phase and are forced to to disembark into difficult terrian the rules states that you are not allowed to do anything else that "turn". Is it Player turn or Game turn that correct interpretation of just "turn".

Q2. Are you allowed to deploy into terrian in the deployment phase? For instance setting up Lootas in a ruin etc...

1. When being forced to emergency disembark you can do anything till the following turn. If just being forced to disembark from a wreck result then difficult terrain has no effect.

2. Yup, if it's in your deployment zone then you can deploy there. Dangerous, difficult terrin, etc doesn't matter when your deploying as it isn't considered a move.

You can disembark into terrain...anywhere within 2" of that door...I have deployed units on second levels of buildings because up 2" is still 2".


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Whoops...misread that...yes you can...you can even put Rhinos in trees if you wish...no way to get them down though.

"turn" is defined in the rulebook as meaning *player* turn unless otherwise specified.

You are given free reign to deploy anyweher in your deployment zone - so yo ucan deploy a basilisk on top of a 10 storey building if you want. It cant move at all during the game, but still...!

nosferatu1001 wrote:"turn" is defined in the rulebook as meaning *player* turn unless otherwise specified.

Yep, so if you've lost the vehicle to shooting then you can act as normal in your turn. However, if you somehow manage to lose a vehicle in your own turn (scatter a battle cannon onto it or something) then the disembarked troops cannot do anything that turn.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

nosferatu1001 wrote:You are given free reign to deploy anyweher in your deployment zone - so yo ucan deploy a basilisk on top of a 10 storey building if you want. It cant move at all during the game, but still...!

However, whilst legal, expect lots of arguments if you deploy a unit in a position that it is not allowed to move to or from. (e.g. artillery or vehicles in upper levels of buildings, etc) since it just makes no sense!

a94marbo wrote:Q1. When you disembark after your vehicle have been wrecked in the oppenents shooting phase and are forced to to disembark into difficult terrian the rules states that you are not allowed to do anything else that "turn". Is it Player turn or Game turn that correct interpretation of just "turn".

Whenever the game says "Turn" the rulebook states that they are referring to "Player turn".

Hence one game turn will comprise two player turns.
Whenever a rule uses the word ‘turn’, both in this rule
book and in the Codexes, it means ‘player turn’,
otherwise it will clearly state ‘game turn’.

P9 SRB

a94marbo wrote:Q2. Are you allowed to deploy into terrian in the deployment phase? For instance setting up Lootas in a ruin etc...

Yes

Thanks for all your answers.

I remember that we had one more rule issue. It was regarding Deff rollas.

I claim that the deff rolla is not part of the hull, hence I can not use the area under the deff rolla for disembarkment if the BW is explodes.

But there was 2 things that we finally had to roll off to continue:

Q1: If deff rolla is not part of the hull, does that mean that I can let the Rolla part of the wagon be outside the deployment zone when I deploy?

Q2: When ramming with the rolla, do the rolla need to be in contact or the front hull of the BW? (since the rolla is not part of the hull). Does the price of the rolla include a 2" extension for ramming purposes?

If the rolla is not part of the hull...then you must count the ramming as coming from the actual hull...which cannot possible reach any enemy ever as it is behind the rolla.

If the rolla is not part of the hull...then you must count the ramming as coming from the actual hull...which cannot possible reach any enemy ever as it is behind the rolla.

Ramming doesn't require hull contact only contact. manty people will regard the deffrolla as part of the hull as it makes the game simpler. But if not (and that is a more accurate way to play by RaW) then yes the deffrolla can be placed outside the deployment zone. No the hull doesn't need to contact the nemey for ramming any part of the vehicle can (if you're playing strict RaW the Hull isn't even allowed within 1" during a ram). However this also means the enemy can't measure shootig distances to the deffrolla and neither can you from it and it also means you can't disembark from the front of your vehcile (nor can someone assault it from there).

ductvader wrote:If the rolla is not part of the hull...then you must count the ramming as coming from the actual hull...which cannot possible reach any enemy ever as it is behind the rolla.

UNfortunately this has nothign to do with the ACTUAL ramming / tank shock rules, which only require contact.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Scott - however it does make sense, when you consider the Imperiuum has these things called "cargo planes" which drop entire prefabricated CITIES onto a planet.

FlingitNow wrote:

If the rolla is not part of the hull...then you must count the ramming as coming from the actual hull...which cannot possible reach any enemy ever as it is behind the rolla.

Ramming doesn't require hull contact only contact. manty people will regard the deffrolla as part of the hull as it makes the game simpler. But if not (and that is a more accurate way to play by RaW) then yes the deffrolla can be placed outside the deployment zone. No the hull doesn't need to contact the nemey for ramming any part of the vehicle can (if you're playing strict RaW the Hull isn't even allowed within 1" during a ram). However this also means the enemy can't measure shootig distances to the deffrolla and neither can you from it and it also means you can't disembark from the front of your vehcile .

Yay, someone else standing up for the actual rules when people make crazy claims about rolla hull problems.

FlingitNow wrote:(nor can someone assault it from there)

Is incorrect though, you can assault the front perfectly fine if you can contact it.
p34, moving assaulting models
"Move the model into contact with the
nearest enemy model in the unit being assaulted, using
the shortest possible route."

nosferatu1001 wrote:
Scott - however it does make sense, when you consider the Imperiuum has these things called "cargo planes" which drop entire prefabricated CITIES onto a planet.

So it makes sense to put bikes or cavalry in the upper levels of a ruin at which point they cannot move? (just for example) Or a basilisk would be air-dropped onto impassible terrain (e.g. a lava field) where it is then stranded?

As I said, if you deploy somewhere that you would not be allowed to move to then expect arguments.

And I'd naturally ask you were in the rules your argument was supported...

The only restriction on deploying units is that they may NOT be deployed in impassable terrain.

Anything else is fine (difficult, dangerous, area, clear).

How you would move them afterwards is one for you and your opponent to figure out.

Scott-S6 wrote:
So it makes sense to put bikes or cavalry in the upper levels of a ruin at which point they cannot move? (just for example)

Fire base? Donkey up a Minaret? Acting as far spotters, but unable to rejoin battle in time?

LOTS of reasons.

Scott-S6 wrote:Or a basilisk would be air-dropped onto impassible terrain (e.g. a lava field) where it is then stranded?

Um, you CANNOT deploy in actual Impassable terrain - you know that, right?

Deploying a Basilisk on top of a building is *fine* in my book. Or do you have an issue with someone deploying the fixed artillery pieces, or the Sabre platforms, whcih cannot move at all?

There is a thing called "this battle didnt magically appear out of thin air" to consider here.

Scott-S6 wrote:As I said, if you deploy somewhere that you would not be allowed to move to then expect arguments.

Yes, and MY main argument would be to show me where, in the rules for deployment, that is prohibited. If you were unable to do so then I would respectfully suggest that you mind your OWN deployment, not where I choose to put mine.

Actually, the assaulting from the front IS a problem. Pg 34 tells one how to move models into contact, and it is only contact that is mentioned so just moving into contact with the rolla is fine. Unfortunately, we then need to look at pg 35 to see what models can then fight in the cc....and we see that only models in btb contact or within 2" of another model that is in btb can attack.

So moving a model into contact with the rolla doesnt mean that a model can then attack the BW. there is still the requirement of being in btb contact, which becaue of the shape and position of the rolla usually doesnt happen.


Sliggoth

FlingitNow wrote:

If the rolla is not part of the hull...then you must count the ramming as coming from the actual hull...which cannot possible reach any enemy ever as it is behind the rolla.

Ramming doesn't require hull contact only contact. manty people will regard the deffrolla as part of the hull as it makes the game simpler. But if not (and that is a more accurate way to play by RaW) then yes the deffrolla can be placed outside the deployment zone. No the hull doesn't need to contact the nemey for ramming any part of the vehicle can (if you're playing strict RaW the Hull isn't even allowed within 1" during a ram). However this also means the enemy can't measure shootig distances to the deffrolla and neither can you from it and it also means you can't disembark from the front of your vehcile (nor can someone assault it from there).

So, to take this to the level of the absurd, if you put a 2 foot long antenna on the front of your land raider, as long as you can poke a tank with the antenna on the other side of the table, you can ram on the first turn?

Norsehawk wrote:So, to take this to the level of the absurd, if you put a 2 foot long antenna on the front of your land raider, as long as you can poke a tank with the antenna on the other side of the table, you can ram on the first turn?

Yes, but I would then point out that:
a) Conversions are nor permitted, RaW.
and
b) It is also no longer a "Citadel Model" and thus not permitted to be used.

Gwar! wrote:

Norsehawk wrote:So, to take this to the level of the absurd, if you put a 2 foot long antenna on the front of your land raider, as long as you can poke a tank with the antenna on the other side of the table, you can ram on the first turn?

Yes, but I would then point out that:
a) Conversions are nor permitted, RaW.
and
b) It is also no longer a "Citadel Model" and thus not permitted to be used.

That could come in handy then. I have yet to see anyone at my game club use the official Deffrolla conversion kit, it usually consists of a soup can or mountain dew can held on with sticks.

An answer which does not allow for conversions is not a useful answer.

An answer which suggests that there is more than one way to determine what constitutes “contact” with a vehicle for rules purposes is, I think, inviting more problems than it solves.

"As normal, all engaged models will attack." Models that will be allowed to assault the vehicle pg 63.
"for distances involving a vehicle, measure to or from their hull" Lets see if they can reach to assault.
"Move the model into contact with the nearest enemy model in the unit being assaulted, using the shortest possible route." First referance to 'contact' when assaulting.
"the model must move into base contact with any enemy model within reach that is not already in base contact with an assaulting model."
From that quote on it's all 'base contact' from this I'm fairly sure it's an expected conclusion that 'contact=base contact'
Now, we are told not to pay attention to decorative elements for vehicles, sowe measure to the hull (as we are told) and find we can't move into 'contact' with the vehicle so can't assault, keep in mind however one could move a guy into this space still having him btb with a guy in btb too.