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I have seen many people talk of 'turbo boosting' their land speeders 24". But they aren't bikes, so they don't get the turbo boost rule, correct (because it only applies to bikes)?

Fast skimmers can move "flat out" to a total of 24" receiving an obscured status. Many people incorrectly quote this as "turbo boosting" that is just bikes.

Informal usage. The rules for flat out are similar in some respects to the rules for turboboost so some people improperly use the terms interchangeably.

Flat Out and Turbo Boosting shares a single characteristic; The maximum length of the move.

Using the two terms interchangeably would be like saying that moving in the movement phase is the same as assaulting in the assault phase as they share the same length.

Actually, only flat out for FAST SKIMMERS shares the length of the move with turboboosting.

Flat out for non-skimmers is 18".

Misuse of the term by many players.

Land Speeders may make a flat out move of 24" to gain the "obscured" (cover save) bonus. They may not "turboboost" because they are not bikes.

Also it is important to remember that Full Out with a fast skimmer is a 4+ cover save while Turbo boost is a 3+ cover save.

It's also important to remember that you won't get the cover save if you move Flat out in the Scout move but you DO get it if you Turbo Boost on the Scout move. Important difference

Gwar! wrote:It's also important to remember that you won't get the cover save if you move Flat out in the Scout move but you DO get it if you Turbo Boost on the Scout move. Important difference

really? that's weird. you would think that since the movement is in the same phase going the same distance, they would both get their appropriate cover save. Ho Hum.

irrelevent since i dont have any bikes or skimmers but still nice to know.

Its down to the wording - one talks about "in previous movement phase" (which Scout moves arent) and one talks about getting cover "in the next shooting phase"

Praxiss wrote:

Gwar! wrote:It's also important to remember that you won't get the cover save if you move Flat out in the Scout move but you DO get it if you Turbo Boost on the Scout move. Important difference

really? that's weird. you would think that since the movement is in the same phase going the same distance, they would both get their appropriate cover save. Ho Hum.

irrelevent since i dont have any bikes or skimmers but still nice to know.

The reason is because of the wording of each rule.

SMF says:

A skimmer that is not immobilised and has moved flat out in its last Movement phase counts as obscured (cover save of 4+) when fired at.

Whereas Turbo Boosters says:

In the following enemy Shooting phase, the bike benefits from a cover save of 3+

As the Scout move is NOT a Movement Phase, the Skimmer doesn't get the Save, but the Bikes do.

Yeah in fact by RaW you gain a cover save from turboboost scouting even if you go first and then don't move (or don't turboboost again) your bike so your now stationary bike gets a 3+ save.

But back to the thread yes poeple aften use Turboboost to mean they are flat out moving their skimmer to move 24" and gain a cover save. Just as many people refer to running as fleeting. Whilst not technically correct it is generally obvious what they mean (like if they say they are hitting you with their power sword...).

FlingitNow wrote:Yeah in fact by RaW you gain a cover save from turboboost scouting even if you go first and then don't move (or don't turboboost again) your bike so your now stationary bike gets a 3+ save.

But back to the thread yes poeple aften use Turboboost to mean they are flat out moving their skimmer to move 24" and gain a cover save. Just as many people refer to running as fleeting. Whilst not technically correct it is generally obvious what they mean (like if they say they are hitting you with their power sword...).

What's a Power Sword? I looked in my Rulebook and all the Codexes and cannot find any rules for them!

What's a Power Sword? I looked in my Rulebook and all the Codexes and cannot find any rules for them!

Exactly my point Gwar!

FlingitNow wrote:

What's a Power Sword? I looked in my Rulebook and all the Codexes and cannot find any rules for them!

Exactly my point Gwar!

Your Point (as far as I can tell) is that people know what a Power Sword is. How can they know what it is if there are no rules for it!

How can they know what it is if there are no rules for it!

Very very easily.

Gwar! wrote:

A skimmer that is not immobilised and has moved flat out in its last Movement phase counts as obscured (cover save of 4+) when fired at.

Whereas Turbo Boosters says:

In the following enemy Shooting phase, the bike benefits from a cover save of 3+

As the Scout move is NOT a Movement Phase, the Skimmer doesn't get the Save, but the Bikes do.

This is the reason we use the INAT FAQ as a guide at my FLGS instead of Gwar!'s

General_Chaos wrote:This is the reason we use the INAT FAQ as a guide at my FLGS instead of Gwar!'s

Wait, so the RaW is the reason why you use House Rule Set A rather than House Rule Set B?

I don't get what your Post is trying to prove here...

He's saying that he thinks it's dumb that the two rules, which are essentially the same rule, have different effects in the scout move.

Right...? It makes no sense that two compeletely different units which have their own way of functioning could have the same rule that works a bit differently...ya that's so dumb...

They work differently because they work differently...how is that so hard to fathom?

Sanctjud wrote:Right...? It makes no sense that two compeletely different units which have their own way of functioning could have the same rule that works a bit differently...ya that's so dumb...

They work differently because they work differently...how is that so hard to fathom?

Exactly. It's like saying "How dare they let bikes move faster than Infantry!" or "What do you mean Vehicles cannot take wounds??!"

They work differently because they work differently...how is that so hard to fathom?

Because mechanically in game the effect (cover save) is granted in the identical time period (the opponents next shooting phase) for the same reason (moving more than 12") and represent a save gained for the same reason (moving fast), and only due to different wording and the paculiarity of the scouts move does the effect differ in that situation and in that situation it differs immensely one gaining what is clearly an unintended advantage (a cover save in player turn 2).

Sanctjud wrote:They work differently because they work differently...how is that so hard to fathom?

They work the same - go fast, get cover save.

Gwar! wrote:Exactly. It's like saying "How dare they let bikes move faster than Infantry!" or "What do you mean Vehicles cannot take wounds??!"

Yes, it is exactly like this. Obviously.

They work the same - go fast, get cover save.

So? They are two different units doing it, it's not hard to accept that they interact with the same rule differently.

Maybe the writers though Vehicles are bigger hence worse save.
Or maybe the writers felt cover saved vehicles from the start was too broken and that the bikers are gonna be few and far between so they up their durability at the start.

Who knows...but as the RAW stands, they work differently and they work as intended as nothing has changed it from the last FAQ.

Sanctjud during actual play would you be fine with me turboboost my scout bikers in the scouts move. Then assuming I go first, moving them normally firing at one of your units assaulting it (and lets assume they break) and then claiming a 3+ cover save in your turn?

Yes...cause I'd either have the same thing, in reserves with stuff that matters, or have fast moving flamers in the speeder or dread in pod variety.

It's simply how it works... if someone has an issue with it in game, I'm happy to not use it like that, but come tourney, it's prob. something I'll discuss with TO before the event.

It's true, rules as played varies, but looking at it objectively and straightforward with the BRB as our guide, that's how I see it, play it, and play against it.

FlingitNow wrote:Sanctjud during actual play would you be fine with me turboboost my scout bikers in the scouts move. Then assuming I go first, moving them normally firing at one of your units assaulting it (and lets assume they break) and then claiming a 3+ cover save in your turn?

Yes, I would, because the rules as written allow you to do so.

That's like asking "Would you allow my flamers to ignore cover saves?"

Of course not, that would mean my FNP-less gaunts have no saves!!!

Gwar! wrote:That's like asking "Would you allow my flamers to ignore cover saves?"

There's a huge difference between flamers ignoring cover and the cover save for turbo boosting sticking. One is explicitly written in the codex and the other is a hack derived from poor interaction between two rules.

MasterSlowPoke wrote:

Gwar! wrote:That's like asking "Would you allow my flamers to ignore cover saves?"

There's a huge difference between flamers ignoring cover and the cover save for turbo boosting sticking. One is explicitly written in the codex and the other is a hack derived from poor interaction between two rules.

Actually, both are explicitly written. If they weren't, how would we know about them?

And what exactly gives you the power to determine what is a "poor" interaction as opposed to an interaction that was clearly written into the rules?

Flamers say they ignore cover saves. It's not written that the cover save for turbo boosting "sticks" even if the unit moves normally the first turn, that rule is derived from interacting the turbo boost and scout rules. It is anything but "clear".