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Does they shall know no fear stop your marines from running of the table? Like do they automatically stop at the table edge if fleeing? Sorry if this has been asked before: I'm new.

KamikazeCanuck wrote:Does they shall know no fear stop your marines from running of the table? Like do they automatically stop at the table edge if fleeing? Sorry if this has been asked before: I'm new.

No need to apologize for being new.

And No, sadly It doesn't.

KamikazeCanuck wrote:Does they shall know no fear stop your marines from running of the table? Like do they automatically stop at the table edge if fleeing? Sorry if this has been asked before: I'm new.

To clarify: If they meet those 3 bullet point requirements, no enemy unit within 6" and so forth, then they can rally.

But a smart opponent might dog and follow the retreating unit all the way to the table edge, denying them that one last criteria to rally (non enemy units within 6") and they'll run off the table.

That was the last time I saw *any* SM opponent use "Combat Tactics."


ATSKNF is more about rolling a morale check at the end of h2h, failing it, and then having to roll X number of armor saves that combat was lost by.

Better?

Ummm, brothererekose, they only have to meet two of those bullet point requirements, since ATSKNF allows them to ignore being below 50%.

if their opponent within 6" they can't rally.

they will also still fall back if they fail a moral test.


this is why its bad for marines to sit on the table edge. if they fail a test they will run away off the board edge with no chance of return.


also remember in general that to rally a fleeing unit you roll to rally and if you fail then roll for movement. model who rally may not move, but other wise act normally(they may fire heavy weapons)

Grey Templar wrote:also remember in general that to rally a fleeing unit you roll to rally and if you fail then roll for movement. model who rally may not move, but other wise act normally(they may fire heavy weapons)

In general, it's the opposite. If you rally, you may consolidate up to 3" but may not move further in the turn. You're counted as having moved but other than that you act normally on the turn you rally (i.e. you can run and/or charge but not fire heavy weapons.)

ATSKNF rally works differently, of course. They can move 6", for one.

Combat Tactics coupled with ATSKNF is awesome. Had it work a few times for me to great effect. This is what happens:

An enemy squad shoots at you with assault weapons and kills 3 of your guys. Well, you know an assault is coming. You use your combat tactics to fail the moral check that you would usually pass. You fall back farther then they can assault, and ATSKNF will allow you to autorally since you are greater then 6 inches from them. Next turn, you shoot them. Maybe even move, shoot em, and assault giving you the advantage.

Yeah, great stuff.

I'm thinking more along the lines of a devastator squad sitting on the board edge, takes 25% shooting causalties then just runs off the table...

I'm thinking more along the lines of a devastator squad sitting on the board edge, takes 25% shooting causalties then just runs off the table...

It's gone I'm afraid.

FlingitNow wrote:

I'm thinking more along the lines of a devastator squad sitting on the board edge, takes 25% shooting causalties then just runs off the table...

It's gone I'm afraid.

Damn. I think back in the day like 4th edition there was something called like "last chance" or something. Which let you attempt to roll for one more regroup as long as you met the criteria. Since Marines always regroup (when below 50% strength) I think that saved 'em. but I don't see that rule anymore.

No such rule existed in 4th ed.

nosferatu1001 wrote:No such rule existed in 4th ed.

I believe it was 3rd. The rule definately existed at one time.

It would be both a strength and a weakness if that rule did exist though: Strength because you wouldnt lose units because of retreating and Weakness becaus it would be easy to get pinned.

It was in 3rd edition. In 3rd, units would stop at the table edge if there was no enemy unit within 6", and get a "last chance" to Rally there. They got a similar chance if the unit fell back into terrain/cover, though that could be hard to judge.

They should bring that back.

Or you can just not position units on the back line in case they fall back.

It was a rule that very much favored HTH armies. Shooting armies had a lot of difficulty getting enemies to run off the table.

Well they seem to be going towards making people shoot more. Shooting can now take out anyone in your squad whereas before they guy with the missle launcher would always be the last man standing. Rapid fire is much more powerful than back in the day before.

KamikazeCanuck wrote:Well they seem to be going towards making people shoot more. Shooting can now take out anyone in your squad whereas before they guy with the missle launcher would always be the last man standing.

Not quite. In 3rd you could pull range-sniping or LOS-sniping tricks. Like if I used a piece of terrain and a Rhino to block LOS from my heavy weapon to the other squad members, so I could only see the SM with the missile launcher, he has to be the model who died. Or if the missile launcher was on the edge of the squad and I moved so that only he was in range.

The 5th edition would allocation rules are definitely better and more fun to play than that was.



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KamikazeCanuck wrote:Well they seem to be going towards making people shoot more. Shooting can now take out anyone in your squad whereas before they guy with the missle launcher would always be the last man standing.

Not quite. In 3rd you could pull range-sniping or LOS-sniping tricks. Like if I used a piece of terrain and a Rhino to block LOS from my heavy weapon to the other squad members, so I could only see the SM with the missile launcher, he had to be the model who died. Or if the missile launcher was on the edge of the squad and I moved so that only he was in range.

The 5th edition wound allocation rules are definitely better and more fun to play than that was.

uh ya, but that was the exception not the rule. Hence the name "trick".

Well, my point was that it actually WAS the rule. 3rd had all sorts of rules like that; such as template and ordnance casualties having to come from the models under the marker/template. Or all shooting casualties having to come from the models in range and LOS. Or HtH casualties having to come first from models in base contact, and only the guys in base contact getting to fight with full effect (the models within 2" only getting a base-strength no-special-rules “supporting attack”.

Lots of finicky stuff that was a bit of a pain to use in play, and subject to manipulations like LOS-sniping.

KamikazeCanuck wrote:uh ya, but that was the exception not the rule. Hence the name "trick".

No, it was most certainly the Rule.

I think you could take template causalties from anyone in the squad (as long as you had line of sight). I think they specifically mentioned that was done so your couldn't assassinate people with a missle launcher.

KamikazeCanuck wrote:I think you could take template causalties from anyone in the squad (as long as you had line of sight). I think they specifically mentioned that was done so your couldn't assassinate people with a missle launcher.

Nope, back then both flamer templates and blast markers required you to remove models from under the template/blast.

The opponent could, however, move the Marker/Template themselves to cover the same or more models to avoid the Heavy Weapon being sniped out (iirc that was the exact reason for that rule!).