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So everytime I search for orcs here I find really old posts...I am pretty new to warhammer and I am looking for some advice on playing orcs and goblins...any advice would be great...thanks in advance


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ok so I was just looking in the wrong place...I do have a couple of questions tho...

Orc boyz in groups of 20 or 30?

2 spear chukkas, one doom diver, and a rock lobba or should I go with 2 rock lobbas, a doom diver, and a spear chukka?

also how many goblins should be in an army? I do like the fanatics.

I realize most tactics are learned thru trial and error but any pain you guys can save me would be great!

Orcs currently in 25-30

4 spear chukkas are ALWAYs my first choices in an O&G army. Doom diver is better than a rock lobber.

I run 4-6 units of 35 Night Goblins between 2000 and 2500 points. I find 4 the best as they can stay in the general's Ld bubble and they aren't tripping over each other.
I normally run 10 fanatics between 2000- 2500 points. (I like them too)
1 in spear units (as spears cost more) and 2 in my SB and HW/Sh units.

I'd like to hear your opinion on WHY exactly you think Doom Divers are better than rock lobba's W_G, if this isn't too much off-topic talk.

D6 S5 is usually better than S4/S8 under the hole, and Doom Divers allow no saves. Thus taking out those pesky Chaos Knights... Plus they can alter their landing positions a tad.

d3 inch redirect.

Aim at a unit.
Even better now without guess range
Roll 5 or 6 and scatter 3 inches onto the head of a hidden mage/character/anvil/something better to kill.

ANYTHING that improves your chances to hit should be taken, and the ability to scatter in any direction you want, to even hit stuff you cannot target is just obscene.

I've found rock lobbas to be ABSOLUTELY hopeless, even with great guesswork. They will scatter off or kill a couple of enemies.
Doom divers are absolutely brutal vs heavy cav and characters.

if its not too much trouble could you post ur 2500 point army or link where you have before? I have made a list and I think it is pretty potent. My friends say that I am autistic when it comes to guess range lol...I am usually within .5"

If he's taking full command on the Night Goblins (and fielding 5 HW&S units), it should be about 1,370 points for the units of Night Goblins, a pair of Doom Divers, and Four Spear Chukkas. Depending on what character and remaining special choices were taken, that's still 630-1,130 points to spare on the army (2000-2500pt lists).

Looking in his profile under "Threads posted by Waaagh_Gonads", army lists are:
2500pts w/ special considerations.
2500pt Tournament List (Pre-most 2009 & 2010 WHFB books).
2250pt Tournament List (See above).

I now run:
Black orc warboss, boar, heavy armour, enchanted shield, kicking boots (+1 attack), effigy Mork (-1 to hit), Martogs best basha (+1 WS, +1 St, +1 I )

Negates animosity, mv 7 (feel confident to charge him out of the unit to kill enemies), WS8, St6, T5, W3, I5, A5 (+1 St 5 from the boar) AS1. And most importantly Ld 9. I cannot say enough how much you need 1-2 units that you can be confident will do what you want them to (thanks to animosity) and you MUST get as high a Ld as you can.

Black orc BSB with spirit totem , heavy armour

Negates animosity, adds dispel dice, good fighter, BSB.... goes with HW & Shield unit

Goblin mage level 2 - x2 dispel scrolls

Extra 1 to Ld over a NG mage. Essential for Ld tests when units start running. But these days I put 1 in each unit that the BO characters are in so I don't fail my animosity checks and twiddle my thumbs for a turn. A note on Little Waaagh Magic- it almost all has a high casting strength. throw 3 dice each mage for 1 spell each per turn. You should get them off most times and the enemy really has to think about burning up scrolls.

Goblin mage level 2 - staff sneaky stealin

31 NGs HW & shield Full command, 3 fanatics, NETS!

31 NGs HW & shield Full command, 3 fanatics, NETS!

31 NGs spears and shields Full command, 1 fanatic, NETS!
I have the models. I find they end up almost exactly the same as HW&Sh units in combat.... but for more cost. They will kick ass compared to HW&Sh in 8th ed. Nets are essential. If for nothing else than to save your characters in a challenge. Run all the NG units up as a wall to benefit from the general and BSB Ld bubble. You will smash anything that comes at you with the fanatics and if nothing else will throw their advance into anarchy.

30 NGs short bows, musician, 3 fanatics, NETS!

5 spider riders with muso, spears, short bows, shield

Move through forests/difficult terrain penalty, fast cav - now you have somewhere to deploy them in an alreay crowded deployment zone. I like to put them in/behind a fores, move them forward first turn the redirect/charge warmachines/block LOS from turn 2-3. Almost ALWAYS die. Invariably fail their animosity tests- annoy me no end.

2 snotling bases


The second best unit in the army list- If I had more bases I'd take 8 units at 2500 points. Capture quarters, Immune to psych, stubborn, don't cause panic to anything larger. can run in and flank charge enemies to negate ranks and +1 Flank combat res. These guys have killed daemon chariots, flesh hounds, swordsmasters all with flank charges. They are you spam deployment (my first 2 always go in back corners) to see where your enemy is deploying, then keep dropping units to force the hand of your opponents deployment.

2 snotling bases

2 Spear chukkas with orc bullies

Always take orc bullies. used to kill monsters/multiwound fliers (giant eagles, gyrocopters) first, heavy cav or infantry second. Despite me saying other units are better, 4 spear chukkas are the 1st thing I buy for a tourney army

2 spear chukkas with orc bullies

8 squig hoppers

Immune to psych, WS4, St 5, 2 attacks, skirmisher, ignore terrain, can jump over your own units. THE best unit available to O&G as they do one thing that noone else in the army list does- give you 360 degree move/charge flank protection.

8 squig hoppers

Giant

Giant

2 giants are exponentially better than 1. Despite being hopelessly random in combat they are very heavy hitters and a huge amount of firepower goes into killing them. 1 always dies, the second usually but the second always makes it to combat, and occasionally both do.

As a note I try to run the 2 SH units and the giants as my last deployments and all down one flank. they are fast, and it really throws out the enemy, he has to divert units to take all that hitting power on, but it is usually not enough to hold me up. Turn 4 I'm into the rear or flank of the main body of his army.


With this army (or variations of it at lower points) I'm currently 22-0-3 in tournaments with losses to Skaven (HPA killed/chased down/crossfired/terrorbombed 1500 points turn by mid turn 3) and daemons at 1500 points (My BOB general was killing blowed bottom of turn 6 tipping to a slight win to him) and a 2500 daemon army that I think I ended up getting about 250 points out of and I has 1 spear chukka with 1 crewman left, one of those game where nothing works.

2 doomdivers are brutal but I'm left with nowhere to dump the points in a place where I can hit as effectively as the giants can. I don't want more rank and file units as >4 and they trip over themselves.

A BLACK ORC UNIT are a must they are killing machines the only problem with them in my experience is that they attract a lot of range attack

And they are M4 Infantry and can be avoided by most armies.

Will be interesting to see how BOs turn out in 8th ed.

Currently with shield I think they are 3-4 points overpriced.
If they were stubborn and had 2 attacks base, they they would be worth their current price.

Waaagh_Gonads wrote:And they are M4 Infantry and can be avoided by most armies.

Will be interesting to see how BOs turn out in 8th ed.

Currently with shield I think they are 3-4 points overpriced.
If they were stubborn and had 2 attacks base, they they would be worth their current price.

What do you mean? 2pts less than a Chaos Warrior for +1S (on the first round), -1WS, -3I, -1A, and -1Sv makes perfect sense.

B.Orcs have the problem in that they had a point hike for not having a negative special rule, and - because Big 'Uns were upgraded to 4pts instead of 2pts - the need to be worth more than a core upgrade which lacked the Heavy Armor, Leadership, and special equipment. B.Orcs wouldn't be a bad unit, if it weren't for the overpriced (which, since they must often be fielded at least 18 big if you're using them for combat purposes, is at least a good 50+ points spent on them that shouldn't be there).

Yes but with 1 attack.

You would always take a shield, I agree 18 is usually the smallest i've seen them run (with character on mount)

Welcome to a huge point sink of only slightly better than average troops.

The key to CWs is that they have 2 attacks base, AS 2 (if use HW&sh).

There is a reason why noone takes chaos warriors at tourneys either- they suck for the points cost compared to what other units can do within the list.

Which is why I said that they need the other attack, HE specials were in a similar position but at least they have ASF.

Now all this may change in the new ruleset, but currently a large unit of BOs is about the most useless unit in the O&G army book UNLESS you want a very expensive animosity free pit to put a mage.


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And I agree that big uns are way too overcosted.

They should be St4 and 2 points more.