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I automaticaly put sanguinary guard on my 2000pt army list put didn't consider termies at all. Termies lack the manoverability of SG and don't have guns but have 3++ invuls and THs. Do I have a dilemma or is one of these significantly better than the other.

Note: I run a sanguinary preist with my SG so termies would have one as well.

I have no strong opinion one way or the other, but offer this as advice: Sanguinary Guard are 5-man squads only, but come with Fearless standard - in case you find Fearless to be a good thing or a bad thing. Terminator squads may increase in size, but cost more in the long run since you have to purchase the Storm Shields, provided that is the route you are taking...

That would be the route but I'm worried that it will take longer for them to get into combat than the SG as thats what I really want.

well, for an extra 250-ish points you can get a Land Raider transport?

also, while not subject to the Descent of Angels special rule, they still have the option of Deep Striking, what with them being Terminators & all...obviously not as efficient as 12" movement, but still.

furthermore, what is better: one re-roll to hit, or multiple re-rolls to wound? is that something to consider? all I know is my gut says, ''Maybe.'' though if you are taking Thunderhammers that means no re-rolls, so there's also that.

Well, I don't like the look of the Sanguinary Guard, golden and birdy wings.
I prefer Termies with th/ss led by a cheap Chaplain and transported in an LRC,
possibly adding a Sanguinary Priest.
This is a real death star combo to be reserved for larger pt games.

wuestenfux wrote:Well, I don't like the look of the Sanguinary Guard, golden and birdy wings.

sorry, but I just have to take this opportunity to say that I totally agree with this! I know I'm probably in the minority, but the Sanguinary Guard models, I think, are fugly! that is all...

Thats not a reason to not take them.

gurgle wrote:Thats not a reason to not take them.

Right.
One concern is that the unit is very small and cannot be beefed up with models. Each casualty hurts badly. At the end, when only a decimated squad (of say 3 men) hits an enemy unit it may eventually be screwed. I'd stay away from it.

The terminators will require less skill to play well and are more all-round killers.

Shrubs wrote:The terminators will require less skill to play well and are more all-round killers.

Indeed, I used Assault Termies with th/ss to take on MC's, like Carnifexes or Hive Minded, and they slice through them like butter.
If you use the S. Guard in a melee vs. an MC and the MC hits back, they are put in a world of hurt.

TH/SS terminators with FNP from a Priest are the hardest unit in the game to kill.

I've been running a unit of Sanguinary Guards with 3x Infernus Pistols, a powerfist and a JP/PW Priest and Chapter Banner in my BA lists for a bit now and I've been happy with them. Being only 5 models, and with no invulnerable saves, they're tricky to use. A powerfist/weapon ruins their day quickly, which is a huge shame. If you support them correctly with other units to help dilute/remove the PF/PW saturation then they are really killy and resilient. 4 str5 I5 PW attacks each on the charge is nothing to scoff at by any means. They can tear right through most things with stats like that.

Also, I've been running them in a Storm Raven, which is a big help for them. They've also had an Honor Guard to support them in combat. The two units together is an outrageous wrecking ball. I've dropped the Stormravens and Honor Guard at least for now as I try out other things. At the moment I have Dante joined to them but I'm not really sure he'll work out to be a real winner.

Being only 5 models, and with no invulnerable saves, they're tricky to use. A powerfist/weapon ruins their day quickly, which is a huge shame.

They are good taking on Devastators or Havocs but not so much vs other assaulty units.
However, in the 5th ed, armies are mostly mech and shooty infantry units are not so often seen.
This limits the usability of the Sanguinary Guard.
I'd stay away from it.

They can do serious damage to other assaulty units as well, if they charge (which, with their long threat range, they should be doing). Assuming just a Sanguinary Priest with a Lightning Claw is with them, and they have 1 Powerfist and a Chapter Banner (seems the standard way to go about setting up the unit), their output is:

16 Master Crafter Power Weapon attacks at str5 I5
4 Powerfist Attacks at str9
4 Lightning Claw Attacks at str5 I5

If you also attach an HQ to the unit, they become really killy. Also against anything but low AP firepower they ca absorb tons of damage with a 2+ save followed by FNP.

Their access to Infernus Pistols makes them nice against mech armies if you can get them close enough (stormraven) because they can melta the tank then charge whatever was inside of it.

When I'm careful with the unit, it is really good. It is difficult to use sometimes because it can be rather fragile against certain unit types.

To be completely honest, it depends very much on the rest of the list when determining if Assault Terminators or Sanguinary Guards will work better. General advantage would point to the Assault Termies in terms of raw killing power, but the Sanguinary Guard get more mobility and a bit more diversity due to their weapon options and ability to be taken as troops.

So how would you take assault terminators and a SP for 330pts or less? What layout?


Automatically Appended Next Post:
And if I was going to take them, what is the best layout for SG + SP?

I have found sanguinary gaurd to be very underwhelming. Their lack of an invulerable save really does not give them much staying power against any assault unit.

SS/TH Terminators FTW, run em with a priest and your enemy has to dedicate a sickening amount of firepower to bring em down.

Grey Templar wrote:TH/SS terminators with FNP from a Priest are the hardest unit in the game to kill.

Close, but not quite. The hardest unit in the game to kill is a diversified 10 man Nob Biker squad.

SG really aren't as effective as good old Termies. BA's can take LC termies with a priest and one hammer, and they mulch stuff, throw in a chappy and they get uber. Put them in an LRC and you have a party.

Problem is they are mighty expensive.

Try both, but from a points efficiency stance, termies all the way.