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HQ Master of the forge = 100+20 = 120
conversion beamer

HQ Chapter Master = 140
boltgun/powersword, orb. Bombardment

Elite Dreadnought = 105+20 = 125
plasma cannon, heavy flamer/ccw

Elite Dreadnought = 105+15=120
twin linked heavy bolter, twin linked autocannon

Elite Venerable Dreadnought = 165+40 = 205
lascannon/missile

Heavy Dreadnought = 105+40 = 145
lascannon/missile

Heavy Dreadnought = 105+30 = 135
lascannon, storm bolter/ccw

Heavy Dreadnought = 105+10 = 115
assault cannon, stormbolter/ccw

Troop Crusader Squad x10 = 180
plasmagun, missile

Troop Crusader Squad x10 = 180
plasmagun, missile

Troop Crusader Squad x10 = 170
missile

Troop Crusader Squad x10 = 180
lascannon

Scout squad x5 = 75+15 = 90
sniper rifles, camo cloaks

Scout squad x5 = 75+15 = 90
sniper rifles, camo cloaks

=1995

lol I dunno I just love this list because I looooooove dreadnoughts. Basically I try to put all of the objectives (if there are any) close to my side and just let em come to me. I also use the MOTF's bolster defenses and if able stick the 2 scout squads in it to give them a 2+ cover save with their cloaks. I have a lot of FTFP with several missiles and lascannons and the conversion beamer (which I stick with a scout squad and if one squad is wiped join the other one). The orbital bombardment is my other random shot and I've found that the conversion beamer and the orb bombs make wonderful broadside killers.

Does this list have any merit to it? Could it possibly be any viable for the tourny setting?

drop the chapter master. throw in rhinos for his points >.>

lol I got a better idea! drop the chapter master and add...
ANOTHER CONVERSION BEAMER!

HQ Master of the forge = 100+20 = 120
conversion beamer

HQ Master of the forge = 100+20 = 120
conversion beamer

Elite Dreadnought = 105+20 = 125
plasma cannon, heavy flamer/ccw

Elite Dreadnought = 105+15=120
twin linked heavy bolter, twin linked autocannon

Elite Venerable Dreadnought = 165+40 = 205
lascannon/missile

Heavy Dreadnought = 105+40 = 145
lascannon/missile

Heavy Dreadnought = 105+30 = 135
lascannon, storm bolter/ccw

Heavy Dreadnought = 105+10 = 115
assault cannon, stormbolter/ccw

Troop Tactical Squad x10 = 180
plasmagun, missile

Troop Crusader Squad x10 = 180
plasmagun, missile

Troop Tactical Squad x10 = 170
missile

Troop Tactical Squad x10 = 170
missile

Scout squad x6 = 75+31 = 106
sniper rifles, camo cloaks

Scout squad x6 = 75+31 = 106
sniper rifles, camo cloaks

=1997

So are you joking around, or what?

Well I dunno if you would call it joking around. I'm definitely trying to have fun and do something unique but still teeter on the edge of competitive.

I think I'm actually going to try this list out, just to see how the elements come together.

Interesting second list.
How do you plan to deploy the Masters of the Forge? In those lone-missile tac squads? A single lascannon evaporates them if they're deployed alone.

How do you plan to handle multiple-objective missions? Marine version of a Kan Wall? March the groups of Dreads forward with the tacs slogging behind, while the rest of the army fires downrange?
If so, you'll have to move the tac squads every single turn, and hope you don't run into a terrain-heavy board that you have to navigate around. Expect to have to make judgement calls about whether the Dreads fire in a given turn, or Run to keep pace with the Tacs, since they should be running every turn to press forward withthe attack on the objectives.

Dreads and Tacs make a great synergy combo, though. Unfortunately, it's a better defensive synergy than an offensive one.

TheRhino wrote:Interesting second list.
How do you plan to deploy the Masters of the Forge? In those lone-missile tac squads? A single lascannon evaporates them if they're deployed alone.

Well obviously I wouldn't deploy them alone, that's why I didn't put them on bikes actually, because I knew they would just get vaporized and I'd be out 150 points per each motf. I actually want to deploy them with the scouts in the bolstered defensed ruins, that way I can make use of the scouts 2+ cover saves (although I don't think they would have to check distance anymore to shoot at the scouts because they stealth bonus wouldn't confer to the motf). I could also put them with the tac squads like you said.

TheRhino wrote:
How do you plan to handle multiple-objective missions? Marine version of a Kan Wall? March the groups of Dreads forward with the tacs slogging behind, while the rest of the army fires downrange?
If so, you'll have to move the tac squads every single turn, and hope you don't run into a terrain-heavy board that you have to navigate around. Expect to have to make judgement calls about whether the Dreads fire in a given turn, or Run to keep pace with the Tacs, since they should be running every turn to press forward withthe attack on the objectives.

I've thought about this alot as well, if this happens to be the scenario and the majority of the objectives are toward my side of the table then I wont have to worry too much because I can just move for a turn or two and set up my line on the objectives.
What I think you were asking though is what if they are on the other side of the table? In that case I'd probably split my 4 tac squads into 5 man groups keeping the heavy weapons back to shoot and the the 5 normal marines to slog it up behind the dreadnoughts, I might run the close combat dreadnoughts but the lascannons and the autocannon one probably not. I'd also hang the motf's back with the heavy weapon marines who stayed behind and use the scouts to infiltrate onto the objectives.

So what did you think about my dreadnought configurations? I would probably take the flamer off the plasma cannon one, however that dread is one of the old metal ones and as such I can't change it to a stormbolter without mutilating its beauty. I think I have a good balance of range and close combat though. I'm thinking about dropping the second motf though to make the other lascannon/missile dread and the heavy bolter/autocannon venerable. This would probably be a good idea because two conversion beamers may be excessive and some extra survivability on the dreads couldn't hurt.

TheRhino wrote:
Dreads and Tacs make a great synergy combo, though. Unfortunately, it's a better defensive synergy than an offensive one.

Yep, it is definitely a more defensive army. But with all the mechdar and blood angels I play against this isn't completely a bad thing.

MOTF on bikes ? fast moving conversion beam shooting space marine

Mr. DK wrote:MOTF on bikes ? fast moving conversion beam shooting space marine

hivefleetmonolith wrote:
Well obviously I wouldn't deploy them alone, that's why I didn't put them on bikes actually, because I knew they would just get vaporized and I'd be out 150 points per each motf...

I have been playing very similar list.. 6 dreads with different load outs.. but as for the MOTF.. put him in an building far away...maybe even bolster the building you put him in.. The further opponent the stronger the beam..

yea one of the things I was thinking when taking 2 motf's was that I could stick them in opposite corners and have them cover each other, that way if the enemy gets close to one I still have a beamer that can fire.

The only thing I would change is making the HB/AC Dread a Rifleman dread w/ 2 AC arms. idk, just my 2 cents.

that is a decent idea, however it does put me over the 2k mark

I guess then, drop the venerable to a regular, make the one i mentioned above a Rifleman, and possibly giving some of your tactical squads a power fist or something, JUST in case something reaches you.

I love dreads, my normal 1500 point list plays 5 of them. However I dont like mixed use dreads at all, with the normal dreads give them HW and keep them back, consider useing Ironclads as they are quiet a bargin for teir point cost. For 145 pts you get an AV 13/13/10, a seismic hammer, extra armor, a heavy flamer and a melta.

Your Dread loadout is actually pretty good, and balanced for your biggest threats:

hivefleetmonolith wrote:
Elite Dreadnought = 105+20 = 125
plasma cannon, heavy flamer/ccw

This one can hit the things that are most annoying for Dreads: TEQ. Massed powerfists from Terminators, or powerklaws from Meganobz will take down Dread quick, fast, and in a hurry. The plasmacannon can clear a couple at each shot. The Heavy flamer can deal with gribblies that get close. He won't win any fights by himself, but that's why you have other Dreads marching forward with him.

Elite Dreadnought = 105+15=120
twin linked heavy bolter, twin linked autocannon

This is the only one I don't like. The TLHB is just sub-optimal in all ways. Not enough shots for true anti-infantry work, and not enough S for anti-transport. I think it's in the codex just so folks can still buy and use the Forgeworld, or old metal Chaos parts. I'd rather have the assault cannon, or another autocannon here. S5 can't even cause instant death to an IG HWT. :(

Elite Venerable Dreadnought = 165+40 = 205
lascannon/missile

Heavy Dreadnought = 105+40 = 145
lascannon/missile

Classic gunline Dreads. Can't go wrong here.

Heavy Dreadnought = 105+30 = 135
lascannon, storm bolter/ccw

Some might laugh in your face for this one, but I think i see what you've done here. You have half of a gunline Dread, that retains a DCCW so he can be a lifesaver/tarpit for the other gunliners. No reason to invest in the heavy flamer here, as it's unlikely that horde units are reaching that far into your gunline without heavy casualties, or getting an instant charge via Outflanking.

Heavy Dreadnought = 105+10 = 115
assault cannon, stormbolter/ccw

Classic spearheading Dread. Cheap, and effective. Again, can't go wrong with this loadout.

Looks like a very fun list, I would suggest droping the TLHB arm for another TL-AC arm, the riffleman dread is always useful

Did you read my Gunline tactics article? Unit choices for a SM Gunline.

it would help you sort out the kinks.


like why don't, your Tac squads at least have the Flamers? they are free so why not?

Wow thank you all so much for all the wonderful feedback!

@everyone who said make the dreadnought 2x TL autocannon
Point taken, will do.

@rhino
Glad you noticed I kept the ccw on one of the lascannon dread merely to support the other ones against random things like mawlocs and the like that get too close.



So, I've dropped the venerable off the dread and added the 2nd autocannon to the HB/AC dread. But what should I spend the other 58 points on?

I think you have 55 points left after dropping Venerable, and swapping the TLHB for a TLAC, yes?

I'd look at power weapons in the tac squads, and the free flamers. Meltabombs on every sergeant in the list is a nice defense against Tank Shock.

yes, Melta bombs are almost assured of penetrating. you do still have a 50% chance of dieing.

if you have an option between melta bombs and a Melta gun do the Melta gun every time. Mbombs arn't AP1

K so here's my 3rd crack at a list

HQ Master of the forge = 100+20 = 120
conversion beamer

HQ Master of the forge = 100+20 = 120
conversion beamer

Elite Dreadnought = 105+20 = 125
plasma cannon, heavy flamer/ccw

Elite Dreadnought = 105+15=120 (yea I know I kept it)
twin linked heavy bolter, twin linked autocannon

Elite Dreadnought = 105+40 = 145
lascannon/missile

Heavy Dreadnought = 105+40 = 145
lascannon/missile

Heavy Dreadnought = 105+30 = 135
lascannon, storm bolter/ccw

Heavy Dreadnought = 105+10 = 115
assault cannon, stormbolter/ccw

Troop Crusader Squad x10 = 185 (added meltabombs to all sgts and 2 meltaguns squads)
plasmagun, missile, meltabomb

Troop Crusader Squad x10 = 185
plasmagun, missile, meltabomb

Troop Crusader Squad x10 = 180
missile, meltagun, meltabomb

Troop Crusader Squad x10 = 180
missile, meltagun, meltabomb

Scout squad x7 = 75+47 = 122 (added another sniper to each squad)
sniper rifles, camo cloaks

Scout squad x7 = 75+47 = 122
sniper rifles, camo cloaks

=1999

good list there

Well after much play testing I can say that the dreadnought spam list is not just a ton of fun and very intimidating looking, but it's also decently competitive!

I have, however, taken some lessons I've learned and put them into effect.

Here's what worked well in my games so far

1. Having three dreadnoughts with close combat and three without has allowed for great synergy between units. For example, keeping the las/ccw dread near the las/missile has been beneficial in that when units got close the ccw dread moved forward to engage while the other two kept moving back.

2. Having so many missiles/las/autocannon/conversion beamers etc. Gives this list a great amount of ftfp.

3. Combat squading the tactical marines was great as it provided a bunch of 5 unit "meat shields" to absorb or delay incoming assault and forced enemy gunlines to spread their fire out.

4. Choosing to fail morale tests at the end of assault phases and then opening up on the enemy on my next turn was wonderful.

Here's what didn't work out so well for me.

1. I didn't have any real way to deal with assault units that got past the meat shield except for the ccw dreads. This was ok against other walkers and units with ccw's that weren't equipped for vehicle killing, but failed miserably against units like terminators or sanguinary guard.

2. The scouts were pretty much a waste of points. You can't really rely on them to kill MEQ armies and I found them very disappointing against orks as well with their crazy mob leadership. They were ok for objective grabbing but they never ever would survive to hold them by the end of the game.

3. Splitting up into combat squads often gave me problems with falling back and even pinning tests.

4. Having two motf's was fun but not having a strong HQ unit really hurt me in the endgame.

5. The Heavy bolter on the dreadnought was pretty fail, never seemed to wound anything.

So I think this army list has shown potential but I've made a new list that addresses what I feel are my weaknesses. Please give me feedback on the changes (hopefully improvements) I've made.


HQ Master of the forge = 100+20 = 120
conversion beamer

HQ Chapter master = 125+45 = 170
lightning claw x2, artificer armor

HQ Honor guard x5 = 185+25 = 210
chapter banner

Elite Dreadnought = 105+20 = 125
plasma cannon, heavy flamer/ccw

Elite Dreadnought = 105+20=125
plasma cannon, twin linked autocannon

Elite Dreadnought = 105+40 = 145
lascannon/missile

Heavy Dreadnought = 105+40 = 145
lascannon/missile

Heavy Dreadnought = 105+30 = 135
lascannon, storm bolter/ccw

Heavy Dreadnought = 105+10 = 115
assault cannon, stormbolter/ccw

Troop Crusader Squad x10 = 180
plasmagun, missile

Troop Crusader Squad x10 = 180
plasmagun, missile

Troop Crusader Squad x10 = 175
missile, meltagun

Troop Crusader Squad x10 = 175
missile, meltagun

= 2000

So some of the major changes are the adding of a 2nd plasma cannon on one of the dreads replacing the terribad heavy bolter. In my experiences, I've found you can never have enough terminators killers and the plasma cannon has also been great at dealing with longfangs and sanguinary guard.
Another change was dropping the 2nd motf and the two scout squads for a chapter master and some honor guard with a banner thrown in. This was a good idea for me as it took out some crappy ranged troops and an unneeded 2nd motf and gave me some much needed close combat power. (heh it also let me reuse some of my old black templar units as proxy like the emperor's champ and sword brethren). The chapter master was also good looking for the orbital bombardment which could be used as an unwieldy yet powerful weapon against broadsides and popping wave serpents (they don't get the pesky max str 8 from a barrage weapon). The most useful thing I can see from this though is the autopass on morale and pinning tests at 12" from the banner guy, it will really help my combat squaded tac marines.

Anywho glad to give you the update! hope to hear from you all as you've been a great help getting this army on its feet, but now its time to teach it to walk!

p.s. I've started painting my army and I'll try to get some pics and battle reports up soon! Also here is my scheme for troops/HQ