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In 1000 points Devastators are an over-expensive way of getting Dakka down, and Elites are nice but really restrict you with regards to your tactical squads.

SO>


HQ

Captain
Lightning Claw
Storm Bolter

118

TROOPS

Tactical Squad (10 man)
Sergeant: Combi-Plasma
Plasma Gun
Lascannon

200

Tactical Squad (10 man)
Sergeant: Combi-Plasma
Plasma Gun
Lascannon

200

Tactical Squad (10 man)
Sergeant: Combi-Plasma
Plasma Gun
Plasma Cannon

195

Tactical Squad (10 man)
Sergeant: Combi-Plasma
Plasma Gun
Plasma Cannon

195

Fast Attack / Assault

Landspeeder w/ Typhoon Missile Launcher
90


Lascannons take out armour, and plasma fire should take out a lot of the infantry. Yes plasma is dangerous cause it Gets Hot!, but it's so effing cool!!!

Neat, the only problem I can forsee, is that your going to have roughly half your army way in the back usually outside of bolter range. But thats always a problem with combat squads.

I am a big fan of plasma though, Ive never really been let down by plasma cannons but I usually take them on vehicles.

Plasma Cannons IMO rock. And at 1000 points there's not much an opponent can bring against SM that can really bother them.
Cue the reply saying "OH YES THERE IS".

Some people will say "if they get assaulted they;re history".

Ummm if they get assaulted then the opponent must have brought an AWFUL LOT of models!

Corennus wrote:Ummm if they get assaulted then the opponent must have brought an AWFUL LOT of models!

Orks? Tyranids? Nob bikers with many wounds? Chimera spam? Blood Angels with Jump packs? Drop pod deepstriking space marines? (think a squad of assault marines with PW on sarge still worth 10 tacticals even after getting 5 high AP shots).

But that wasn't the point. Are you sure you'll fare well against "all-shooty" army with only 3 guns with 48" range (one of them AV 10) and only without any fast counterstrike force (Typhoon doesn't count)?

And, by the way - combat-squadding or not?

true.
And i'm not sure about combat squadding.......

If I combat squad the tac squads I can target more infantry squads while at the same time keeping anti-armour fire available from lascannons and plasma cannons...

But a 5 man squad is more easily taken apart by assault than a 10 man....

I've gone up against a 1000 point ork army previously with a slightly diff set up (plasma cannon tacs and a chaplain led assault squad) and CANED them

Just a comment here, I'd run most of the squads in combat squads - simply because they are more easily taken apart in assault.

Many assault troops are easily capable or tearing apart 5 space marines, but not 10. So with large squads, some survive, and you can't shoot at the enemy in your turn. Then they finish you off and are free to assault.

However I just remembered you've got Combat Tactics. Hmmmm. In that case use a mix of full and combat squads.

Combat squads allow you to offer a few sacrificial units, placed slighly further forwards, to manipulate the enemy attack. They also allow you the very necessary splitting of fire.

And what was the Ork list. A trukk rush would probably be owned by your list. Maybe a green tide if hybrid.

In return a Kan Wall with KFF support might hurt you quite a bit.

I know obviously that nobody plays competitively all the time (allthough some members in all the 40k forums would do well to remember we're not all WAAC gamers) - so you're not going to play optimised lists.

In that case I think your list will do great against most things it faces, I love the theme, and the 'realism' of having a task force just comprised of TAC squads and the Speeder (which'll probably go down very quickly by the way).

Anyway, that ramble didin't really achieve much but hey, never forget to use Combat Tactics and the assault army will still feel the pain. Hope something helped .

Ironically as stated, your list would struggle most against those lists which can hover at 36-48'' away and shoot, Prism/Mech. Eldar, Mech. Tau, most Imperial Guard.

I don't like the Speeder, at the same cost you'll can take a Sniper Scouts sq., by finding just 10 points somewhere with ML also.

Unlike the scouts a Speeder can actually put out some hurt tho unlike the craptastic scouts.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
On the contrary he would be better of droping a tactical squad for two more speeders

This is the first WORKABLE footslogging SM list I've seen. The problem is going to be on the table. The only way that you're going to be able to win is with a massed charge (like other horde armies). If you decide to combat squad them, and then only send in half while the other half piddle away with a couple of las/plascannon shots, you're going to lose.

If the heavy weapons give you too much temptation to ever sit your tac marines still, then dump the heavy weapons. Better to tear out your long range support than to allow it to cause your whole army to fail.

Personally, I'd drop all of the heavy weapons and turn all of the plasmas into meltas (including the combis), and put the points into some dedicated long range support, allowing the rest of your troops to move unhindered (drop the speeder if it's necessary to get the points).

My thoughts are this:

If I go with multi-meltas what do i get? 4 squads that have to get perilously close to the enemy to get Armour hits:
You miss with your multi-melta at 24" away from an enemy tank. A group of infantry are 12" away (why oh why did you shoot the multi=melta. Let's say the tank holds the enemy;s HQ).
You can't move in the assault turn cause you fired, and you can't assault anyway.

Come the enemy's turn not only will the squad have to endure shooting from the tank, but the infantry squad (let's make them something nasty like Chaos Possessed) will move 6" in its movement phase. And then oh dear, it just charged your tactical squad.

Now obviously I could fire my other tac squads against the infantry squad.....but why bother when I could take the tank out at range with a nice lascannon?


Automatically Appended Next Post:
I'm not willing to drop the heavy weapons, especially at 1000 points.
After all, having an infantry heavy army is ok at 1000 points, but if your enemy brings out three tanks you're kind of stuffed as nothing you have can take it out at range.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Oh and as for spacing....

Combat squadded army it shall be. 4 5 man squads form a bolter line in front of the heavier weapons. Heavy weapon squads don't advance more than 24" close to the enemy.

Bolter line squads advance so they're nearly in rapid fire range (15") then start falling back. when they get to the heavy weapon line they stand and Rapid Fire.

Corennus wrote:but why bother when I could take the tank out at range with a nice lascannon?

Because single lascannons here and there DON'T take the tank out at range. In order to be effective against vehicles, you're going to need to be up close and personal (power fists, krak grenades, meltaguns, etc.). Be prepared to have a lot of lascannons patter helplessly off vehicles entrenched in cover.

Corennus wrote:4 5 man squads form a bolter line in front of the heavier weapons. Heavy weapon squads don't advance more than 24" close to the enemy.

So you're making a gunline marine army? Brace yourself for woeful failure.

Nice list Correnus.

Don't worry about Ailaros's comments. Gunline Space marines aren't an awful failure if you play them right(which isn't that hard to do) he's just like that because he plays Guard.

you have 2 lascannons and 2 plasma cannons. thats plenty in a 1k match. i like the suggestion to drop a Tac squad for more speeders.


Gunline is really the way for Space marines to survive in low point games as Tyranids and Orks can still bring numbers, but they are still few enough to mow down with gunfire. Typhoons are great equalizers because they are cheap, allowing you to easily have 2-3 of them without hurting the rest of your force, and they are really shooty at long ranges.


if a LR shows up your opponent probably doesn't have much of a force. a couple of Scout squads and a cheap chaplain. that force will go down quickly.

It looks like a good list, but I would be inclined to replace one las cannon with a missile launcher and take a flamer where possible. Two reasons:
1) they are free
2) whenever I don't take them in a small game I wish that I did because of the amount of models facing me.

Swarm lists are nasty in 1000pts games. But, those lists are rare, so you shouldn't have to worry too much. I just prefer the safe take on all comers type of list.

The problem isn't just that a guard player can easily bring 3 collosuses in 1000 points and blow you off the table by turn 2. The problem is that the metagame heavily favors mobile armies in the missions, and heavily penalizes static armies due to your opponents now being more mobile (due to sprinting, cheap transports, lots of chances to outflank/deepstrike, and the like).

I'm not saying it's impossible, it's just that gunlines fare poorer quicker the better your opponent is - 5th ed. rules basically make this so.

which is why i advocate having every thing in a Transport. it's mobile cover and, if the case you mentioned arises(which will seriously hamper the rest of his army), you can rhino rush him(Colosses have a pretty large Minimum range right? 12"?)

if you get first turn he's dead.

Well I currently have one Rhino.

If I were to include the Rhino i'd switch three Plasma Guns for Flamers and one Plasma Cannon for Missile Launcher.

Combat squadded that would mean my gunline marines would have three squads out in front getting in Rapid Fire and template range, and one squad attached to the captain in the Rhino.

In a 1500 game I am sorely tempted to try out a HB Infantry Support squad (Dev). 12 str 5 shots each shooting turn up to 36" is actually quite nice. Now ML fire frag at Str 4, and yes they could theoretically cover more of an infantry squad (or take out a pesky deff dread or transport if need be). but i like the idea of a squad firing basically a load of BIG FREAKING GUNS into a load of infantry.