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Nurglitch wrote:Spellbound is correct.

Why?
Is Typhus a Chaos Lord?

Yes, Typhus bears a Daemon Weapon, the Manreaper. He is a Chaos Lord.

No, he's not a chaos lord [WS5, Sorceror] but he doesn't NEED to be.

It says a chaos Lord has a daemon weapon appropriate to their patron god in the daemon weapon box.

Then it says...

A Daemon Weapon:
point 1
point 2
point 3
Has an additional ability depending on THE MARK GIVEN TO THE BEARER, as described below.


Chaos lord or not, he bears a daemon weapon, he has the mark of nurgle, he gets the benefit of the Plaguebringer.

Except once again, it says that he carries a normal daemon weapon and not the type of daemon weapon carried by a model with the Mark of Nurgle. They are two totally different things so stop trying to use them interchangably.

Spellbound wrote:Has an additional ability depending on THE MARK GIVEN TO THE BEARER, as described below.

It does indeed say this.

However, in the section that actually details those special abilities, it refers specifically to Lords, not to other models.


Plaguebringer is a special rule that applies to Daemon Weapons carried by Lords with the MoN, not models with the MoN.

While the entry for Daemon Weapons does mention that special rules apply depending on the mark of the bearer, unless the bearer is a Lord that special ability is not actually defined.


So, Typhus has a Daemon Weapon. His Daemon Weapon has a special ability, because he has a Chaos Mark. What that ability actually is ... we don't know, as the book doesn't say.

No, it never specifies that at all. In fact I believe all it says it that daemon weapons get those 4 points applied to them. It never says "lords with daemon weapons get..." it says "Lords may take daemon weapons" and then "daemon weapons get this". Elsewhere we find a special character [never says lord or otherwise] that says in his special [hence special character] rules that he has a daemon weapon - ok so he must be a lord, or he breaks the rule, either way he's got a daemon weapon.

And what exactly is a "normal" daemon weapon? It's one that follows the rules of EVERY other daemon weapon. There is no neutral daemon weapon. Every single daemon weapon that exists in this codex belongs to someone with a mark, and depending on that mark, that daemon weapon is granted a special ability. The undivided daemon weapon AND all four marked daemon weapons are all normal daemon weapons. Typhus' then gets the special bonus of also being counted as a force weapon [note it also says normal force weapon, but normal force weapons don't get d6 attacks, are you going to say I have to pick which one I get to use per turn?]

A normal daemon weapon and a daemon weapon carried by a model with the mark of nurgle ARE the same thing.

Typhus has a Manreaper, which is his personal daemon weapon. We've all agreed he's a special character, and no special character I know that can have anything changed except for Marneus Calgar and that's a minor change. The Manreaper is Typhus' own. It would say if it's a Plaguebringer, and it says the Manreaper is a normal Daemon Weapon. It's his special weapon.

Spellbound wrote:No, it never specifies that at all. In fact I believe all it says it that daemon weapons get those 4 points applied to them. It never says "lords with daemon weapons get..." it says "Lords may take daemon weapons" and then "daemon weapons get this". Elsewhere we find a special character [never says lord or otherwise] that says in his special [hence special character] rules that he has a daemon weapon - ok so he must be a lord, or he breaks the rule, either way he's got a daemon weapon.

And what exactly is a "normal" daemon weapon? It's one that follows the rules of EVERY other daemon weapon. There is no neutral daemon weapon. Every single daemon weapon that exists in this codex belongs to someone with a mark, and depending on that mark, that daemon weapon is granted a special ability. The undivided daemon weapon AND all four marked daemon weapons are all normal daemon weapons. Typhus' then gets the special bonus of also being counted as a force weapon [note it also says normal force weapon, but normal force weapons don't get d6 attacks, are you going to say I have to pick which one I get to use per turn?]

A normal daemon weapon and a daemon weapon carried by a model with the mark of nurgle ARE the same thing.

Yes it does. The line at the top of the box about Daemon weapons on p.93 has a line referring to Lords getting a weapon appropriate to their Patron God.
Then next to every Patron God's weapon it says "(Lords with the Mark of...)"

Typhus is not a Chaos Lord as it's a seperate HQ choice. It states very clearly that only Chaos lords get the Patron God's specific weapon abilities.

Typhus' Daemon weapon is named and has its own special ability (that of a force weapon that he auto passes!).

Spellbound wrote:No, it never specifies that at all. In fact I believe all it says it that daemon weapons get those 4 points applied to them.

Take another look at the Plaguebringer entry.

Plaguebringer applies to Lords with the Mark of Nurgle.

A model who is not a Lord will not benefit from a rule that applies specifically to Lords.

And what exactly is a "normal" daemon weapon? It's one that follows the rules of EVERY other daemon weapon.

Indeed it is.

But that simply means that all Daemon Weapons follow the same rules. It doesn't mean that rules that apply specifically to Lords also apply to other models with Daemon Weapons.

One of the rules that Daemon Weapons follow is that they have an extra ability depending on the Mark of the Bearer. But the only extra abilities actually listed in the codex are those that apply specifically to Lords. So Daemon Weapons carried by other models still have an 'extra ability'... it simply isn't one that's listed in the Codex, and therefore plays no part in the actual game.

A normal daemon weapon and a daemon weapon carried by a model with the mark of nurgle ARE the same thing.

Of course they are.

But a model with the Mark of Nurgle and a Lord with the Mark of Nurgle are not necessarily the same thing.

Spellbound wrote:A normal daemon weapon and a daemon weapon carried by a model with the mark of nurgle ARE the same thing.

No they're not. Otherwise GW would not have stated Manreaper counts as a 'normal' daemon weapon if that is the only type of daemon weapon there is. Add to the fact that they have different powers and different names based on the mark of the model cxarrying the daemon weapon more than amply proves that they are not the same thing.

Typhus has a "normal" demon weapon. Normally, daemon weapons are wielded by chaos lords. Normally, lords with a mark of Nurgle get a plaguebearer. Typhus, despite not being a chaos lord, gets to wield a daemon weapon. If it behaves like "normal," it will behave the same way it would behave for a chaos lord with the mark of Nurgle, i.e. it would be a plaguebearer. The alternative is that the demon weapon simply doesn't get an added ability from the mark, which would be most abnormal, not to mention a direct contradiction of the daemon weapon rules. Or you can claim, as insaniak does, that the weapon has some mystery ability conferred by the mark of Nurgle to models who aren't chaos lords, but this reading is unplayable and thus hardly worth discussing.

insaniak wrote:So, Typhus has a Daemon Weapon. His Daemon Weapon has a special ability, because he has a Chaos Mark. What that ability actually is ... we don't know, as the book doesn't say.

Good wording, Shirou.

He gets a normal daemon weapon. Normal daemon weapons are carried by chaos lords and get abilities. Thus his works just as normal, and gets mark abilities just like normal.

Ghaz wrote:No they're not. Otherwise GW would not have stated Manreaper counts as a 'normal' daemon weapon if that is the only type of daemon weapon there is. Add to the fact that they have different powers and different names based on the mark of the model cxarrying the daemon weapon more than amply proves that they are not the same thing.

I think you're taking the 'normal' part way out of context, Gaz.

A 'Normal' Daemon Weapon is one that comes from the normal Daemon Weapon entry, as opposed to a special type of Daemon Weapon... like Typhus' Manreaper, which is a Daemon Weapon and Force Weapon combined.

A 'normal' Daemon weapon has an extra ability that applies if the model has a Mark. That extra ability is a part of the rules of the normal Daemon Weapon, not a part of a different weapon entirely.

There's no need to start trying to arbitrarily decide which rules are 'normal' rules and which ones aren't. That way lies madness.

shirou wrote: If it behaves like "normal," it will behave the same way it would behave for a chaos lord with the mark of Nurgle,

That's not behaving like normal. That's behaving like a weapon carried by a specific model.

If it's behaving like normal, it works exactly as listed in it's entry. Which means that Plaguebringer only applies if the model carrying it is a Lord, because it is specifically listed as applying to Lords, not other models.

Or you can claim, as insaniak does, that the weapon has some mystery ability conferred by the mark of Nurgle to models who aren't chaos lords, but this reading is unplayable and thus hardly worth discussing.

How does not applying a specific special rule to the weapon make it unplayable?

The weapon still works just fine without it.

Giving it a mystery ability is unplayable. Giving it no extra ability is playable, but is a contradiction of the rules.

insaniak wrote:
That's not behaving like normal. That's behaving like a weapon carried by a specific model.

It is behaving like normal, because it's behaving like it does when carried by the model that normally carries it.

shirou wrote:Giving it a mystery ability is unplayable.

Nonsense. If the ability isn't listed in the codex, it plays no part in the game. It's that simple.

Space Marines have a whole bunch of abilities that aren't listed in their codex. The game doesn't suddenly come crashing to a halt just because there is no 'spit acid' rule in the codex. You just ignore it, and play with the rules that are there.

It is behaving like normal, because it's behaving like it does when carried by the model that normally carries it.

No, it's behaving like it would when carried by one particular model that normally carries it. You might as well claim working 'normally' means that Typhus also has Bloodfeeder...

He has a Daemon Weapon. That means that the rules for Daemon Weapons apply.
He is not a Lord. That means that the part of the Daemon Weapon rules that applies specifically to Lords does not apply.

insaniak wrote:A 'normal' Daemon weapon has an extra ability that applies if the model has a Mark. That extra ability is a part of the rules of the normal Daemon Weapon, not a part of a different weapon entirely.

No. A 'normal' daemon weapon is one without any extra attributes based on the mark of the model equipped with the weapon. When you have a mark, you take the specific daemon weapon associated with that mark. It is not a 'normal' daemon weapon but a very specifc one.

shirou wrote:Typhus has a "normal" demon weapon. Normally, daemon weapons are wielded by chaos lords. Normally, lords with a mark of Nurgle get a plaguebearer. Typhus, despite not being a chaos lord, gets to wield a daemon weapon. If it behaves like "normal," it will behave the same way it would behave for a chaos lord with the mark of Nurgle, i.e. it would be a plaguebearer. The alternative is that the demon weapon simply doesn't get an added ability from the mark, which would be most abnormal, not to mention a direct contradiction of the daemon weapon rules. Or you can claim, as insaniak does, that the weapon has some mystery ability conferred by the mark of Nurgle to models who aren't chaos lords, but this reading is unplayable and thus hardly worth discussing.

And yet agtain, you're confusing a "normal daemon weapon" with a "normal daemon weapon for a model with that particular mark of chaos". They are NOT the same thing. Just because something is 'normal' for one type of model doesn't mean it's 'normal' for all types of models.

1. Only Chaos Lords have Daemon Weapons.
2. Typhus, the Herald of Nurgle, has a Daemon Weapon.
3. Therefore Typhus, the Herald of Nurgle, is a Chaos Lord.

Ghaz wrote:No. A 'normal' daemon weapon is one without any extra attributes based on the mark of the model equipped with the weapon.

I'm honestly boggled as to how you have reached that conclusion. The extra ability for the mark is an integral part of the rules for the weapon. It's in the exact same list of rules as all of the other abilities of the weapon. You seem to have just arbitrarily decided which rules are 'normal' and which are not...

When you have a mark, you take the specific daemon weapon associated with that mark.

No you don't. There is no option for selecting a 'Plaguebringer' from the army list. You simply select a Daemon Weapon, and if the model selecting it is a Lord with the mark of Nurgle, that weapon has the Plaguebringer ability along with all of the other rules listed for the weapon.

Nurglitch wrote:1. Only Chaos Lords have Daemon Weapons.
2. Typhus, the Herald of Nurgle, has a Daemon Weapon.

...and therefore (1) is clearly false.

Nurglitch wrote:1. Only Chaos Lords have Daemon Weapons.

Unfortunately, the codex doesn't say that anywhere. I guess you're just assuming that since the only non-special characters that can buy Demon weapons are Chaos lords this must be true, but that obviously doesn't make a valid argument.

If GW put out a FAQ tomorrow saying that Typhus's demon weapon does wound on a 4+, it still would not mean that information can be inferred from the codex in a valid form.

It's nothing new in terms of extremely poor editing on GW's part. Here's all the information we have:

"A symbol of greatness as much as a weapon of war, the powers of a Daemon weapon vary with the nature of the god who gifted it. A Chaos Lord has a Daemon Weapon appropriate to their patron god.
A Demon Weapon: ...(+D6 attacks, etc)... Has an additional ability that varies depending on the bearer as described below."

...
"Plaguebringer (Lords with Mark of Nurgle)"

So the demon weapon entry doesn't say what additional ability a model with a demon weapon and a mark of nurgle has if that model isn't a chaos lord. Typhus very clearly receives all the other benefits of a demon weapon (+D6 attacks, is a power weapon, etc from the list of attributes of ALL demon weapons), since those attributes are not restricted to demon weapons equipped by a lord.

It's not valid to assume that Typhus's demon weapon wounds on a 4+. The information just isn't there. Doesn't mean it was or wasn't meant to wound on a 4+, just that it can not be assumed that it does; therefore, it does not since there is nothing written to indicate that any non-Lord model with the mark of nurgle and a demon weapon has a plaguebringer.

Termizzle: It seems that the rules for Daemon Weapons refer strictly to Chaos Lords. Has that not been demonstrated in this thread? Hence only Chaos Lords have Daemon Weapons. It seems perfectly clear to me, and as though it should be perfectly clear to anyone reading the codex.

Nurglitch wrote:Termizzle: It seems that the rules for Daemon Weapons refer strictly to Chaos Lords.

Nope, it doesn't.

Your conclusion about Typhus's weapon may very well be correct, but it is impossible to conclude that result using valid logic and only the premises presented in the codex. I've laid out step by step (more than once) why it's impossible, why don't you show step by step why it is correct that Typhus's Demon weapon wounds on a 4+, so we can at least address points more specifically.

insaniak wrote:

Ghaz wrote:No. A 'normal' daemon weapon is one without any extra attributes based on the mark of the model equipped with the weapon.

I'm honestly boggled as to how you have reached that conclusion. The extra ability for the mark is an integral part of the rules for the weapon.

Being 'integral' doesn't have anything to do with it. It is an 'integral' rule that a model with a particular mark of chaos take the specific daemon weapon associated with that mark. It still doesn't make those specific weapons 'normal' daemon weapons.

Also, claiming that there is no options for selecting a 'Plaguebringer' from the army list doesn't change anything. It still does not make it a 'normal' daemon weapon. It's that 'integral' rule for daemon weapons that forces them to take 'Plaguebringer' instead of a 'normal' daemon weapon. It is that specific 'integral' rule that is superceded by Manreaper's special rules that states that it is a 'normal' daemon weapon, not some argument that Typhus isn't a Chaos Lord so we don't know how a daemon weapon works in his case.

1) A Chaos Lord selects a 'Daemon Weapon' from his listed options.
2) The rules for daemon weapons state that if the model has a particular Mark of Chaos, then the daemon weapon becomes one of the specific types of daemon weapons (Plaguebringer, Blissgiver, etc).
3) Manreaper has a special rule that supercedes point #2. Although he has the Mark of Nurgle, the rules say to treat Manreaper as a 'normal daemon weapon'.

Termizzile: What exactly do you mean by "valid logic"? Usually that means that the conclusion necessarily follows from the premises. Is that what you mean?

But to demonstrate:

1. Only Chaos Lords have Daemon Weapons. (Premise)
2. Typhus, the Herald of Nurgle, has a Daemon Weapon. (Premise)
3. Therefore Typhus, the Herald of Nurgle, is a Chaos Lord. (Conclusion)

Does Typhus bear a Daemon Weapon?

Yes. P.55: "The Manreaper is both a Daemon Weapon and a Force Weapon." The next sentence describes how the effects of Daemon Weapons and Force Weapons combine. Normal Daemon Weapons are described on P.93, while abnormal Daemon Weapons and their deviations are described in the appropriate entries, such as the Daemon Sword Drach'nyen and the Talon of Horus on P.46.

Does Typhus have the Mark of Nurgle?

Yes. P.55, Wargear: "Mark of Nurgle (included in profile)"

Does a model with the Mark of Nurgle have a Plaguebringer?

Yes. P.93, Daemon Weapons: "A Daemon Weapon... -Has an additional ability that varies depending on the Mark given to the bearer, as described below."

Is Typhus a Lord with the Mark of Nurgle with a Plaguebringer?

Yes. Typhus' miniature is pictured under the heading of "Lords of Chaos" on P.67. He has the Mark of Nurgle, as stated on P.55. We are enjoined to "Treat the Manreaper as a normal Daemon Weapon" on P.55, and Daemon Weapons are described on P.93 to have an additional effect depending on the bearer's Mark.

So Premise 1 is true. Chaos Lords are the only things to have Daemon Weapons. Premise 2 is true, Manreaper is a Daemon Weapon. The argument is a valid syllogism, hence the conclusion is necessarily true.

There you go.

Nurglitch wrote:Termizzle: It seems that the rules for Daemon Weapons refer strictly to Chaos Lords.

Nope. They mention Chaos Lords, pointing out that Chaos Lords have a weapon appropriate to their Patron. And they list special rules that apply specifically to Lords. None of that means that the other rules in the DW entry only apply to Lords, though.

Nurglitch wrote:Does a model with the Mark of Nurgle have a Plaguebringer?

Not specifically, no.

A Lord with the mark of Nurgle has a Plaguebringer. Any other model with a Daemon Weapon will not.

Is Typhus a Lord with the Mark of Nurgle with a Plaguebringer?

Yes. Typhus' miniature is pictured under the heading of "Lords of Chaos" on P.67.

That makes him a Lord of Chaos for the purposes of the miniature gallery. It doesn't make him a Chaos Lord as referenced by the army list.

Ghaz wrote:Being 'integral' doesn't have anything to do with it.

Well of course it does.

It's a built-in function of the weapon. That would suggest, at least to me, that the 'normal' version of the weapon would have it.

There is absolutely nothing in the rules to back up your assertion that some of the rules of Daemon Weapons listed in the Daemon Weapon entry are 'normal' while others are not. You're just making it up.

Also, claiming that there is no options for selecting a 'Plaguebringer' from the army list doesn't change anything.

It certainly should change something. Your assertion the Plaguebringer is in some way 'taken' by a model, for starters.

You don't take a Plaguebringer. You take a Daemon Weapon. If you're a Lord with the Mark of Nurgle, that weapon then counts as a Plaguebringer.

It's that 'integral' rule for daemon weapons that forces them to take 'Plaguebringer' instead of a 'normal' daemon weapon.

This is still complete fantasy.

A Plaguebringer is a normal Daemon Weapon. There is only the one Daemon Weapon entry, and it only includes one set of rules. You can't simply run a ruler through the entry halfway through and declare that only the rules above your line are 'normal' without some actual rule to back it up.

Nurglitch wrote:But to demonstrate:

1. Only Chaos Lords have Daemon Weapons. (Premise)
2. Typhus, the Herald of Nurgle, has a Daemon Weapon. (Premise)
3. Therefore Typhus, the Herald of Nurgle, is a Chaos Lord. (Conclusion)

If Typhus has a daemon weapon and is not listed as a Chaos Lord in his codex entry, then your premise #1 is mandatorily false. No point proceeding further. If Typhus were a Chaos Lord then his entry (or an FAQ) would say so. Since it doesn't say anything of the kind, you are engaging in logic based on a false premise. Trying to prove why GW left something out of Typhus' entry is a RAI argument. He is not a Chaos Lord because his entry doesn't say he is one. There's no getting around that one my friend... (at least from a RAW perspective).

Nurglitch wrote:Termizzile: What exactly do you mean by "valid logic"? Usually that means that the conclusion necessarily follows from the premises. Is that what you mean?

But to demonstrate:

1. Only Chaos Lords have Daemon Weapons. (Premise)
2. Typhus, the Herald of Nurgle, has a Daemon Weapon. (Premise)
3. Therefore Typhus, the Herald of Nurgle, is a Chaos Lord. (Conclusion)

Valid logic means the premises prove the conclusion. I made a mistake, actually- your argument's form IS valid, but it is not sound, since one of the premises used to prove the conclusion is made up (that Only Chaos Lords have Demon Weapons). Let me present an identical argument:

1. Dogs are cats.
2. Cats have four legs.
3. Therefore, dogs have four legs.

Good form, the conclusion happens to be true, but the argument doesn't work because the first premise is just pulled out of thin air.

Nurglitch wrote:
Yes. P.93, Daemon Weapons: "A Daemon Weapon... -Has an additional ability that varies depending on the Mark given to the bearer, as described below."

Yeah, I quoted that part of the codex myself. The problem is, there are no rules for bearers who are not Chaos Lords. Again, you're fabricating the part that the lack of additional rules for non-Lord models means that any model with a Demon Weapon must be a lord.
Does it seem like that? Yes- sure as gak it does. Was that the intention? Probably. Does that mean that the information in the codex is enough to prove it? Unfortunately, no. Please pay attention to this, it's what you're missing.

Ghaz wrote:

shirou wrote:Typhus has a "normal" demon weapon. Normally, daemon weapons are wielded by chaos lords. Normally, lords with a mark of Nurgle get a plaguebearer. Typhus, despite not being a chaos lord, gets to wield a daemon weapon. If it behaves like "normal," it will behave the same way it would behave for a chaos lord with the mark of Nurgle, i.e. it would be a plaguebearer. The alternative is that the demon weapon simply doesn't get an added ability from the mark, which would be most abnormal, not to mention a direct contradiction of the daemon weapon rules. Or you can claim, as insaniak does, that the weapon has some mystery ability conferred by the mark of Nurgle to models who aren't chaos lords, but this reading is unplayable and thus hardly worth discussing.

And yet agtain, you're confusing a "normal daemon weapon" with a "normal daemon weapon for a model with that particular mark of chaos". They are NOT the same thing. Just because something is 'normal' for one type of model doesn't mean it's 'normal' for all types of models.

I understand the argument that Typhus is not a chaos lord and a daemon weapon becomes a plaguebearer for lords with the mark of Nurgle. What I am saying is that a daemon weapon wielded by a model with the mark of Nurgle normally would be a plaguebearer because it would normally be wielded by a chaos lord. If the manreaper acts like a normal daemon weapon, it should behave as it would for the model that normally wields it. For the manreaper not to be a plaguebearer would be abnormal because it would be the only daemon weapon wielded by a model with the mark of Nurgle to not be a plaguebearer.

Here are the relevent rules:

Manreaper: This Lethal instrument of death is shaped like a gigantic scythe. The Manreadper is both a Deamon Weapon and a Force Weapon. Treat the Manreaper as a normal Deamon Weapon, and in addition any model wounded but not killed by the Manreaper can be killed by Typhus with a successgul Psychic test, following all the rules for a normal force weapon. Typhus may take this test even if he has used one of his psychic powers in the same turn.

Under the heading Deamon Weapons on page 93:

A symbol of greatness as much as a weapon of war, the powers of a Deamon Weapon vary with the nature of the god who gifted it. A Chaos Lord has a Deamon Weapon appropriate to their patron god.

A Deamon Weapon:
- Requires two hands to use.
- Is a power weapon.
- Adds an extra D6 attacks in close combat. Roll the dice every time the model is about to attack. If the result is a 1 - the model may not make any attacks in this round and suffers one wound with no armor saves allowed.
- Has an additional ability that varies depending on the Mark given to the bearer, as described below.



Those are the relevant rules.

There is no such distinction between the "named" Deamon Weapons and a "normal" Deamon Weapon because a Deamon Weapon "has an additional ability that varies depending on the Mark given to the bearer, as described below." Therefore, a "normal" deamon weapon always takes on the ability of the mark.

"A Chaos Lord has a Deamon Weapon appropriate to their patron god." is not a restrictive sentence. It doesn't say "only chaos lords can have the following deamon weapons", is in't a restrictive statement at all, if anything it's a fluff statement in a fluff paragraph.

All that matters is the list of what Deamon Weapons are. Typhus has a Deamon Weapon, Typhus has the Mark of Nurgle, therefore Typhus' Deamon Weapon takes on the effects of the a plaguebringer.

Mahu wrote:All that matters is the list of what Deamon Weapons are. Typhus has a Deamon Weapon, Typhus has the Mark of Nurgle, therefore Typhus' Deamon Weapon takes on the effects of the a plaguebringer.

Mahu, many thanks for posting the relevant rules (I was curious about them in their entirety since I don't play chaos...).

However, you have not addressed the argument of the other point of view here. In order to 'win' a RAW discussion, you have to disprove the opposing argument with RAW. Your quotes informed us all of the rule, but the other side is pointing to a section of the rule for daemon weapons that relate specifically to 'Chaos Lords' who wield them. Until you show that their interpretation is faulty (ie showing Typhus actually is a Chaos Lord despite his codex entry), then you are just trading words and no resolution is possible. I am, so far, leaning towards the opposing point of view because they have more specific support from RAW.

shirou wrote:If the manreaper acts like a normal daemon weapon, it should behave as it would for the model that normally wields it. For the manreaper not to be a plaguebearer would be abnormal because it would be the only daemon weapon wielded by a model with the mark of Nurgle to not be a plaguebearer.

This is a good point shirou... almost. But I think you are using reverse justification. As I understand it, the Manreaper counts as a normal daemon weapon in so far as the rules can be applied to Typhus. The abnormality here has nothing to do with the weapon or its actions- it has everything to do with the model wielding it and his status (if I follow their argument correctly). The opposing argument holds that the part of daemon weapon rules relating to Chaos Lords wielding them is null and void since Typhus is not one. The rest of the daemon weapon rules apply.