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40kenthusiast wrote:I can't imagine that the primary problem Guard have is being outshot. Wouldn't it be enemy assault units getting stuck in? I'd say the key for Guard survival in 5th is getting the hang of counter-move/rapid firing the enemy immediately before they assault, so as to limit your losses to one guard squad per enemy assaulting squad.

Actually, it has been my experience that the guard have serious problems with enemy vehicles. I can pretty well murder massed infantry but vehicles are much trickier now that I can't reliably glance them to death with multilasers and heavy bolters. I got lucky in the 'ard boys and played against three vehicle light armies. I am going to be playtesting this weekend against my friend's mechanized chaos list with lash and I am expecting things to be ugly but we'll see.

I agree that the primary concern about close combat is limiting your losses in combat to a single squad. Allowing multiple unit charges will make you lose multiple units. Guard have so much close range firepower (if you choose to take it) that surviving enemy close combat units that reach your lines should be blasted to bits after they eat one squad.

Biophysic wrote:Guard have so much close range firepower (if you choose to take it) that surviving enemy close combat units that reach your lines should be blasted to bits after they eat one squad.

Quoted for truth. If you properly deply then anything that manages to strand itself within 12 inches of your army gets disintigrated on the following turn. The key is to keep your opponent from combo assaulting you or from hitting you with everything at once so that you can have your units properly concerntrate fire on things that get close.

The two best ways for your opponent to overwhelm your firepower seem to be through Rhino rush and mass deepstrike/drop pod assault. An inquisitor with mystycs can mitigate the deepstriking option but the rhino rush seems like it might still be a problem. I will need to play more games against it to figure out a good counter.

2XAT lascannons squads with sharpshooters+ cameleonine actually survive a lot in cover and can keep the opponent busy and his templates\AI weapons not shooting the rest of your troops. Mine actually survived demolisher shells\RF bolters etc for 5 rounds in one game all the while the humble guard squads + plasma vets did the damage. Thy also managed to wreck a LR! Gettijng rerolls is very important IMHO...

tomguycot wrote:The two best ways for your opponent to overwhelm your firepower seem to be through Rhino rush and mass deepstrike/drop pod assault. An inquisitor with mystycs can mitigate the deepstriking option but the rhino rush seems like it might still be a problem. I will need to play more games against it to figure out a good counter.

Mech IG could counter this by disembarking the turn after and rapid firing the squad. Or the age old trick of 4 flamers in a command squad.

Other than that, clever deployment could mean that no matter where your opponent disembarked, he gets a faceful of las-fire. It would probably take a lot of careful moving. Haven't tried it before as my regular opponent plays 'Nids.

i ran IG in the 'ardboys tourny and it actually did very well
i only lost one match and it was to a mech marine army and i completely wiped a demon player
the killpoints thing is a huge advantage to guard. they only give one point for every platoon is awesome and is just another excuse to field big ol' platoons

and as for basilisks, they are still awesome
just hide them behind the guardsmen and use them to kill tanks

screen the infantry with more infantry and you will be fine, just remember who's who

dont spend points on AT in guard squads, its a waste of points, you can get that one lascannon shot that most of the time wont do anything and you just wasted the rest of the squads shooting

i personally get one platoon with autocannons and grenade launchers, one with missile launchers and grenade launchers, and one with drop troops and flamers or meltas

the auto cannons, missile launchers, and grenade launchers let you have some AT if you need it and the infanty killing ability most of the time

the AT is in the form of pie plates and hardent vets with meltas outflanking

i used to run 12 sentinels with multi lasers and hunter killers and they were amazing but i gave up guard for a while and sold them all >.<

now id give them lascannons and outflank/deepstrike them

thats pretty much all for now im getting tired of typing
hope that helped out a bit

Sgt. Salt wrote:
the killpoints thing is a huge advantage to guard. they only give one point for every platoon is awesome and is just another excuse to field big ol' platoons

Course, that only applies in the Ard Boyz... Normally a platoon is going to give a minimum of 4 KP.

well ya the kp thing is true but if you are playing decently then that wont even be a problem
i take allies and they usually soak up all the fire, as most people think to shoot everything they have at that one unit of uber hard grey knight termies than the squishy easy kp guardsmen