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Not at all! The thunderfire cannon is there to munch light infantry, not much more

If the tank had a single long barrel, yes it's an autocannon 48" range, S7, AP4, Heavy2. Designed to kill light vehicles.

Mashira wrote:Ok so when those are fired at my Crisis suits-
1. I don't get a covor save
2. Drones are worthless in this situation
3. a 3+ armor save does nothing? Still not understanding the AP negates armor thingy
4. the Drones 4+ Inv. sv. doesn't get a save?

I'm thinking that had to be an Assault Cannon, maybe on a Land Raider? Four shots, ST 6, AP 4, 24" range, rending. I can't think of any Smurf tanks that mount an autocannon.

On AP issue, all you need to know is whether or not the AP number is the same as or lower than your armor save. If it's not, you get your save. So yes, against the Thunderfire, Assault Cannon, or Autocannon, you would get your regular 3+ save. And since you can use the 3+, the 4+ inv gets set to the side. But if you were shot with an AP2 or 3 weapon, then you would want to drop that one wound onto the drone, let it use it's invul.

don_mondo wrote:
I'm thinking that had to be an Assault Cannon, maybe on a Land Raider? Four shots, ST 6, AP 4, 24" range, rending. I can't think of any Smurf tanks that mount an autocannon.

Dakka preds mount an autocannon

Ok so take that Assault Canon for instance. Because it has a Strength 6. that's an Instant kill according to this guy. does Strength constitute an instant kill or does only AP/Sv apply?

Mashira wrote:Ok so take that Assault Canon for instance. Because it has a Strength 6. that's an Instant kill according to this guy. does Strength constitute an instant kill or does only AP/Sv apply?

That guy is wrong. Strength can constitute an Instant Death wound, but it has to be twice the target toughness or more to do so. So neither the Assault Cannon or Autocannon (Thanks Alerian, totally blanked on the Predator) can instakill a Crisis Suit, as it is Toughness 4. And that is a straight T4, not a T3(4). Also note (since some have problems with this aspect of it) that Instant Death Wounds do NOT automatically negate regular saves. It's true that many of the weapons capable of causing a double-toughness Instakill will ignore a suits regualr save, but it's due to the weapons AP calue, not due to the Instant Death capability. So weapons your Suits need to fear would be ST 8 or higher with AP 3 or lower, things such as Missile Launchers (Krak), lascannons, meltaguns, battle cannons and most other Ordnance. These are the wounds you put on those pesky drones, let them use their Invul.

Ok Now I'm really Confused. What in this Guys Army would be a Strenth 8. or AP 3 or lower. Because I know he had the 4 barrelled thing, and then a Vehicle with a huge barrel on it. Those were the only two things shooting at my crisis suits. he other Vehicle he had was focused on my Devilfish and he was having a hell of a time getting past the Disruption pods.

The tank with the huge barrel was probably a Vindicator. http://www.coolminiornot.com/9345 ? That could definitely Instant Death just about anything. S10 AP2 Ordinance if I remember correctly.

Also, sorry you've had to deal with such fethers. It's not like you're even playing some totally broken army like daemons. You at least want to earn your wins ;-) Seriously though, I hope you find some other good players soon, no one needs to put up with ignorance or outright lying.

I shall now wander off again and pretend to do productive things.

Pretty much the weapons I listed, Missile Launchers (Krak), Lascannons, meltaguns. Plasma is AP2 so no regular save but its only ST 7 so it will not Instakill your Suits.

My IG also have Battlecannons and other Ordnance that do a nice job on Suits.

Perhaps it is time we stop guessing.

Mashira, I sounds like your opponent pulled a fast on ya.
But it is really hard to be sure, when you aren't sure about your facts.
Next time you play, ask to be shown the rules. Or better yet, find a nice opponent willing to run you a few intro games where everything is explained.

Vindicator! yes I remember that word he used it often. Cept his didn't look like that. There was no scraper on the front, and it was Blue like the rest of his Smurfs as he called them. and there was no guy sticking out of it. It was flat topped, and no little box thing over the beginning of the barrell And the Barrell was longer. I think he modified it.

So that's what he took out my Crisis suits with. 3 crisis suits and 4 sheild drones. he basically put the template on one of the middle crisis suits and then rolled the scatter Die 50 feet away from where he was holding the template. I had to call him twice on moving the template in a odd direction not shown on the scatter die. I prefer rolling the scatter die as close as possible to the template so there is no confusion. But he rolled for 4 templates and then rolled the hits all together.

Should I have made him roll each templates shots seperately to maximise usage of the hits going to my drones?

A Vindicator only drops one large blast template. If he was dropping more than one template per turn with each tank, then he was definately cheating you

Mind you, a Vindi is S10, AP2 so pretty much anything he hits with it is toast.

See that just makes it worse. Now I feel all suckered and Newbish.... Why wouldn't he use the Vindicator to take out the Hammerhead with the Ion canon. Or the Broadside with Railguns!?

he definately used 4 small blast templates for it. cause by that time my broadside took out the thunderfire canon that destroyed my charging kroot.

Using the Vindicator against those units might have been a range issue. How far away was the Hammerhead or the Broadside unit? The Demolisher Cannon only has a 24" range, so an effective 30" range with move and weapons range.

As for feeling Newbish, happens to all of us once upon a time. I still find little tidbits in the 5th ed rules that I hadn't caught, and I've played two US GTs in 5th. If you're ever in the North Virginia area, come on by for a game. Most of us are pretty nice to newbs....................

Just too be sure, it seemed like you might not know which Tau codex is the current edition.

This is the current version


This is the older, no longer legal edition

I have the Current one. It's the only one I knew of. It's the ony one the game store had.

Oh Question

For the Thunderfire canon. Should I have made him roll each blast seperately? because he basically rolled for them all together and then added up the hits and then rolled all that at once.
Should I have made him roll each Blast template seperately to maximise use of my sheild drones?

Mashira wrote:
I try to play smaller games around 1250 points now. The boys say I have great tactics. I don't think so. I think I'm just getting creative. I got them all to just paint cause I love to paint. Then they got me to playing. my First game was against the Champion with his Necron army. I won! but I don't think I was playing appropriately. Alot of stuff that seems against the rules in the tau book are coming to light. And then My 2nd Game the fella I played Gifted me a Booklet from the Assualt on Black Reach so that's the rulebook I have. Under that book It says that Skimmers must land when done moving. while Sensor Spines allows you to Ignore Dangerous terrain, I had an unfortunate arguement because in that Tournament the chaos player kept saying I had to roll for dangerous terrain. and he said my Tau Codex was out of date and I shouldn't be using it.

Being Creative is great Tactics. Don't allow cheats and low self assurance geakoids to get you down.
You are correct about the skimmers BRB pg. 71 " Note that a skimmer must be set down on the table and left in place at the end of its move- it cannot be left hovering in mid-air!"
It seems The sensor spines from the codex over-rule the normal tests. If you are in a tournament ask a judge to rule on it, in 'friendly' games ask a third party to make a ruling.

stupid button happy mode.

THunderfire would instakill the kroot shaper, and the vindi would wax the crisis suits with drones.

With all this "describing the weapon" it feels like charades.

Ok Ok I got another one for ya. It's Black and Blue and happens when somebody cheats.

Mashira wrote:I have the Current one. It's the only one I knew of. It's the ony one the game store had.

Oh Question

For the Thunderfire canon. Should I have made him roll each blast seperately? because he basically rolled for them all together and then added up the hits and then rolled all that at once.
Should I have made him roll each Blast template seperately to maximise use of my sheild drones?

Nope, the multiple blast weapons like that are vicious. Basically, you determine how many models each blast hits, add all those numbers together and roll to wound all at once. My IG can get a similar effect with a Mortar squad. And just wait until you meet a squad with 2 or three flamers at close range. Ouch!