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As said; you need WoN gaunts on a small brood to maintain the back objective, I can't stress this enough. After never using WoN and then using it...let's just say I can't build lists without it now.

How come no toxin sacs on your flyrant? Wounding on 3+ on MEQ is really annoying...and S5 can't ID T3.

Twin linked barbed strangler = meh. As drummerholt1234 said, just give it ST and a BS, gets the job done and it gets and extra attack now. Take off enhanced senses whenever you're using just blast weapons: 1 inch isn't going to make or break your scatter. You can try using the t-l deathspitters, but I find an extra melee attack or a venom cannon with ES is better. Also, a walkrant needs guard to stay around longer. You can try the flyrant if you want, I still like them a lot, you might get lucky and find great cover for him before he crashes into the enemy lines. Actually, if you keep the hormagaunts you'll need the flyrant to keep up with them.

You can try the hormagaunts and it might throw some people off as they assault 19"-24" but at the end of the day they're T3 I4 without upgrades. It doesn't matter against guard, tau, and orks, but it certaintly does against most other armies. You may want to invest in FH and AG(I) for them, in addition to the TS. I'm assuming you'll keep the genestealers as close as possible so the hormagaunts can reroll, but keep in mind that they'll outrun both feeder tendrils and synapse if you aren't careful. Speaking of synapse...you have 3 nodes, all of which will have anti-tank weapons fired at them. Either give guards to the walkrant or find a way to fit in warriors (which can then provide cover to the fex)

Good luck with your games.

Hmm, I see your points. Damn I'm just too indecisive! I'd build a half decent Nidzilla list if I could, however despite owning seven Carnifexes only one is modelled in a way that it could be used as an elite choice. Technically there is a second, but this is a scratch built model made from spare Fex bits (as can be seen in my gallery pics) and I don't think GW will let me use it. On that subject, does anyone know how I'd find out if it was legal in a GT? Would give me more options for a harder hitting list if I could use it.

On a slightly different note, I've been thinking of using two broodlords (since I have loads of them for Apoc games) with full retinues of 11 genestealers as my HQ choices. Then I'd use the outflank move to save them slogging across open ground through previous turns. Would be cheaper then 2 Tyrants and would free more points up for the rest of the list.

I still keep getting conflicting info though. Some poeple advise as horde as I can go with the list, others (like on Dakka) advise Nidzilla.

Gonna have another re-write tonight and see how it goes.

Wannabe Writer wrote:On a slightly different note, I've been thinking of using two broodlords (since I have loads of them for Apoc games) with full retinues of 11 genestealers as my HQ choices. Then I'd use the outflank move to save them slogging across open ground through previous turns. Would be cheaper then 2 Tyrants and would free more points up for the rest of the list.

I still keep getting conflicting info though. Some poeple advise as horde as I can go with the list, others (like on Dakka) advise Nidzilla.

Gonna have another re-write tonight and see how it goes.

Don't go with Broodlords they will die faster than Hive Tyrants and can not outflank that good (no fleet) plus you can only have one normally.

Don't go horde the people who tell you that do not know what they are talking about. The only viable tyranid build right now is a "balamced list" or a nudzilla or variant nidzilla army.

Also, don't forget you can only bring up to one Broodlord in a non-Apoc game. Don't, though. Tyrants are so much better in every way.

Anyone telling you to bring horde doesn't realize that our "horde" unit is a Gaunt, which dies to half a glare from anything, and is at its best for its points (in terms of killing ability for the points) when equipped only with a Fleshborer. This is a 12" gun. Yeah, not so much.

Genestealers are too expensive and fragile for Stealer Shock to work, they are best used as your elite, small-group unit killers.

Balanced lists do best for Tyranids right now, a healthy assortment of Carnifex, double Tyrant, Deathspitter/Strangler Warriors (each equipped differently for wound allocation shenanigans), a couple 8-10 WoN Gaunts, Outflanking Genestealers, and you might even have room for a few goodies in higher point games.

At 1500 I bring two Tyrants, Three Fex (two snipers as heavy, one dakka as elite), two WoN Spinegaunts for backline objective camping, two Zoeys to babysit those gaunts, and three healthy squads of Outflanking Genestealers. It's a good mix that does quite well.

Cheers for the advice chaps, especially that balanced lists are a good option. Up until know that's the one type of list that everyone says will bomb for Nids. By nature I like a varied army list so I tend to go for balanced as they make for a more fun game (although I'm aware that many at the GT take it way too seriously!).

But I've been giving it some thought and in my head at the moment I'm going to play to my army's strengths. This is close combat. I love Nids because of films like Aliens and Starship Troopers, which means in my head Nids don't shoot, they bite and stab!!!
This means that whenever I buy Nids they tend to get built with claws and talons. In fact the only reason I have Nids that can shoot at all is because I have swapped and traded models with mates for their Nid models and they have built theirs with shooty bio-morphs.
So to this end I'm thinking Tyrant with 2 x twin devourers and Shadow in the warp, 2-3 tyrant guard, Carnifex with talons and venom cannon, fex with claws/talons, elite fex with 2 x talons, 3 x 8 Guant sqds with WoN, 2 x Thropes with synapse, some winged warriors with death spitters, 2 x 10 Genestealers and any points left on raveners with talons/rending (yes I've gone back to my beloved raveners) or as many hormagaunts with +1 Str I can manage to fit in.
I'm still tempted to have an overkill combat core of Tyrant with 2 x talons and tyrant guard, flanked by 2 x Carnifex with talons/claws.

Damn this is doing my nut in. I've worked out 1,250 of really hard hitting monsters (2 tyrants, 2 elite fexes, 2 HS fexes, 2 x 8 gaunts with WoN and 2 thropes with synpase). However I can't help but think that I still need loads of troops as two thirds of the games will be objective based. Surely in 5th ed troops are more important then big crushing behemoths who can't score?

Wannabe Writer wrote:I've worked out 1,250 of really hard hitting monsters (2 tyrants, 2 elite fexes, 2 HS fexes, 2 x 8 gaunts with WoN and 2 thropes with synpase). However I can't help but think that I still need loads of troops as two thirds of the games will be objective based. Surely in 5th ed troops are more important then big crushing behemoths who can't score?

Part of your issue is trying to make a purer Nidzilla list than the mixed list we're telling you works in 5th. Further, you're wanting assault-heavy assault monsters. Though cool and deadly in assault, will spend at least two turns walking across the board. If your opponent has any kind of mobility, make that at least three. Three rounds of firepower will take down your Carnifex without too much issue, especially since everyone's geared to take down mechanized armies.

Tyranids who use their MCs for long and mid-ranged firepower, using Genestealers and such as their assault specialists do better overall. For instance, a flying dakka tyrant is amazing mid-ranged supporting fire, 30" threat range with twelve fully re-rolling BS4 S5 shots. This same flyrant still has four attacks on the charge against vehicles with the same strength and chance to hit as the full-assault version (albeit with two less swings) who is useless when more than 18" away from something.

As you've discovered, six MCs really eats into your troop choices, especially if you make the Tyrants and Heavies expensive. You need the WoN Gaunts for backline objectives, you need Genestealers to move in an rip someone off of an objective.

I've been giving things a little more thought and I've managed to nag my wife enough for her to let me spend some more money on my Tyranids, so I've got a new tactic in my head. In normal 40K games I like to use two Zoanthropes with psychic scream who follow close to a Tyrant with psychic scream also. This means any Ld tests the enemy makes within range are at -3 Ld. So I thought that the core of the list could be a tyrant with 2 x twin devourers and three guard, backed up by 2 Fexes with 2 x twin devourers, +1 BS, +1 Sv and +1 T (does make them heavy choices rather than elites, but I want them to survive as long as possible) and have 3 Zoanthropes follow behind with psychic scream. This means that there are 28 shots being pumped out, re-rolling misses, re-rolling wounds and any Ld tests taken from casualties are at -3. Scream and devourers have the same range so should compliment each other nicely. The only drawback, which is a big one mind you, is that this uses up all my H.S. slots and I wouldn't have a long range anti-tank model..... Unless I included my Tyrant with Venom cannon, but I don't own more gaurd to protect her.
Would then flesh out the troops with gaunts and stealers.
It does mean I can't have zoanthropes with synapse hanging back to provide synapse cover to WoN gaunts, but a brood of warriors could do the job. Still not certain of this tactic, as I do think it's a waste of warriors to hang back, but we'll see. I was going with the idea of flyrant with twin dakka, but I got put off by the price, 221 pts! That's with only the basic stuff to make her effective (+1 BS, +1 Str, 2 x twin devourers, winged and warp field).

I was going with the idea of flyrant with twin dakka, but I got put off by the price, 221 pts! That's with only the basic stuff to make her effective (+1 BS, +1 Str, 2 x twin devourers, winged and warp field).

Basic price for a dakka flyrant is 196pts (wings, field, sacs, senses), and well worth it in 1500 or less, and still usually worth it at 1850. At 2k it becomes more of a liability due to the sheer amount of models with anti-MCs that your opponent may have, at which point you switch out to Dakka walking tyrant with Guard.

Dude.. modify your original post. Its sooo hard to keep track of which army list is the current one used.

Zoanthrope doesnt have warp blast. Yet youve give the carnifex a second barbed strangler (for the TL-ness). Now while on BS3 gives you a fair chance to hit, it is only str 8 (against vehicles) and that Zoanthrope would be alot happier with warp blast in addition to its Synaspe creature power.

If you want hordes of shooty gaunts.. then simply get 3 squads of 15 fleshborer wielding gaunts. No other upgrades.

Hormagaunts; You want them to win combat, to do this you need three things :-
1) Strike before most standard infantry (+1I)
2) Wounding on 4's vs T4 (I see youve included this, +1str)
3) Hitting the enemy first, wounding on 4's and hitting on 3's (+1ws).

Now im pretty sure all of those upgrades net you more kills. Obviously the +1I is the best, as you get to strike first, reducing the returning attacks, giving you a better chance to win on combat resolution. If you care to work out the differeance between hormagaunts with any combination of the above upgrades (or not at all) be my guest but im 95% sure that this is the best way to do it. Also, drop the hormagaunts down to 12-14. Otherwise they become too much of a point sink (150pt/unit is a sweet spot IMhO)

Genestealers dont like boltguns. Giving them a +1sv means that every single small arms weapon is now alot less (by 50%) effective.

Give those carnifexes some Venom cannons. Ideally +1 save aswell but your going to be fielding alot of hordey broods, so thats fine.