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So the issue is getting beat by a girl then, in your case, and not that the codex uses special rules that overrule the BRB. Don't confuse the issue.

The codex overrides the rulebook, as specifically stated in the rulebook, and therefor it follows both the spirit AND the letter of the rules of the rulebook in doing so. Also, Acts of Faith don't override anything. Neither does the Book of St. Lucius.

No more than, say, a lascannon overrides the rulebook just because it isn't mentioned in the BRB. Or a Leman Russ Exterminator overrides the rulebook because its main gun isn't mentioned in the rulebook.

And did I say I disagree with that? No? Good. Again, you are confusing the issue.

No, you just made a comparison that wasn't very accurate

SO ANYWAY WE CAN ALL AGREE THAT TANK SHOCKING REALLY IS ALRIGHT.

That is what I was trying to say, yes.

Yeah, I think we all pretty much agree on that.

The Marquess of Queensbury wouldn't approve.

Nurglitch wrote:The Marquess of Queensbury wouldn't approve.

Yes, but he's from Queensbury and I'm from America, so that works out rather well (IE I ignore him being the uncultured swine I am).

FoxPhoenix135 wrote:So you own a copy of every codex? And purchase the new ones the day of release? I have kids. I can't afford to do that.

To purchase Codexes when they come out is only $30 every three months or so, it's not really that expensive to do. Now, Carrying all those Codexes once you have them... That's a real pain on the shoulder.

There are other ways to obtain the rules within codices. Which I will not speak of here nor condone, but I know several of my friends use such methods to preview an army list before they get into the army itself.

Jaon wrote:I'm surprised! I would never complain about tank shock, Especially because if you pass the leadership test then it doesn't actually do anything. Ive tank shocked gaunts (not under synapse) away from my IG gunline with chimeras, I like the tactic

They don’t break but they’re still forced to move, which can be enough to shift them off the objective and put your vehicle (carrying a scoring unit) onto the objective.


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nosferatu1001 wrote:Because 'ard boyz used fixed game lengths (6 turns), which exacerbated the advantage going second gave.

Ah, I misread sennacherib as playing in friendly, fixed length games, not in 'ard boyz like the OP. My mistake.

Thinglike wrote:SO ANYWAY WE CAN ALL AGREE THAT TANK SHOCKING REALLY IS ALRIGHT.

not when a fast skimmer flies over something it was hiding behind the chases away something you thought was safe from enemy attack. especially if you couldn't actually SEE the skimmer because a single game takes so long that it's easy to forget about things that havn't been trying to kill you.

Melissia you are pretty good at trolling.

Melissia wrote:I try to. In fact, the C:WH codex is specifically designed for that-- you have to declare many Acts of Faith on the beginning of the phase, so the unit that has that 3++ invulnerable save has that save BEFORE the opponent declares targets for shooting. That never stopped little brats from whining about being beaten by a girl and being bad sports about it. Or giving me a bad sportsmanship score because "she used a cheater army".

Funny thing about my WH army, I only learnt that I had to declare the Act of Faith BEFORE the shooting started after almost 5-6 months playing with them. My opponent and I knew each other and were both surprised by the 3rd party telling us this. I had never won a match with them until then, so I guess it worked out anyway.

Lotet wrote:

Thinglike wrote:SO ANYWAY WE CAN ALL AGREE THAT TANK SHOCKING REALLY IS ALRIGHT.

not when a fast skimmer flies over something it was hiding behind the chases away something you thought was safe from enemy attack. especially if you couldn't actually SEE the skimmer because a single game takes so long that it's easy to forget about things that havn't been trying to kill you.

I'm actually going to agree with you here. So the guy hid this skimmer then rushed the objective with star engines last turn? It was a legal tactic sure, but there is a fairly underhanded and unsporting feel to it. If you pulled it in a friendly game well, TBH you'd be a dick. Since this was a tourney though it's completely legitimate.

Nah I wouldn't say it makes them a dick, that's why you buy the Star Engines in the first place. Then after that it's a roughly 130+ point transport, so what else do you expect?
The way to counter it would have been to go after it and not leave it alone. It can move up to 36" in a turn

Wave Serpents are expensive, so it makes sense to use them that way. If it just drove straight up on turn one it would die before the second turn started. Like everything in that codex it requires finess and outwitting the opponent rather than bute strength. If you were to try the straight forward approach you'd pretty much end up tabled fairly quickly. Although most of my opponents have been Wolves, Blood Angels and the occasional Tyranid so my point of view might be biased from facing these opponents.

Emperors Faithful wrote:Funny thing about my WH army, I only learnt that I had to declare the Act of Faith BEFORE the shooting started after almost 5-6 months playing with them. My opponent and I knew each other and were both surprised by the 3rd party telling us this. I had never won a match with them until then, so I guess it worked out anyway.

Indeed. I even know someone that interpreted the book to make it so that they had gained faith points so long as a single faithful model died. So they had three Celestian squads in order to cheese out this interpretation-- every time a Celestian died, they claimed they gained a Faith Point.

... even that's not how Martyrdom works... it requires the entire squad to die if the entire squad is Faithful.

Tank shocking is fun, fair and interesting. If he had a problem with it, it is his own deal. you did everything right, so don't worry about it.

Emperors Faithful wrote:
I'm actually going to agree with you here. So the guy hid this skimmer then rushed the objective with star engines last turn? It was a legal tactic sure, but there is a fairly underhanded and unsporting feel to it. If you pulled it in a friendly game well, TBH you'd be a dick. Since this was a tourney though it's completely legitimate.

n0t_u wrote:Nah I wouldn't say it makes them a dick, that's why you buy the Star Engines in the first place. Then after that it's a roughly 130+ point transport, so what else do you expect?

If he used Star Engines to Tank Shock, then he was wrong.

Pardon me for not knowing the Eldar rules as well as I'd like, but Wave Serpents are indeed tanks, and therefor can tank shock regardless of whether or not they have Star Engines. Star Engines merely effect the distance they can move.

No, Star Engines are a separate move made in the Shooting phase, and therefor not eligible for Tank Shock.

Melissia wrote:Pardon me for not knowing the Eldar rules as well as I'd like, but Wave Serpents are indeed tanks, and therefor can tank shock regardless of whether or not they have Star Engines. Star Engines merely effect the distance they can move.

Yes and no. Star engines allow movement in the shooting phase (IIRC), whereas tank shocks may only happen in the movement phase.


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*ducks shuriken*

NINJA!

Tank shocking and ramming belong to the game.
I use it with my mech Eldar whenever its appropriate.

CatPeeler wrote:Yes and no. Star engines allow movement in the shooting phase (IIRC), whereas tank shocks may only happen in the movement phase.

Ah. Thanks for the clarification, you two.

Because, you see, "movement" is not always movement or movement in a GW game. Sometimes, it's only movement.

I had a similar experience to the OP, in last years hard boy, I played mechdar with seer council and 12 tanks.

I used tank shock to push orks off every obj they had and then I also routed an entire IG army with Tank shock too. Neither player was happy, but it was all strait by the rules.

Fair, and actually good play too IMO.

People don't like getting caught offguard. Especially by tactics with which they are not accustomed. That does not excuse the behavior of acting like you cheated when making a legitimate maneuver.

You know, it's not merely being "caught off guard" or just plain poor sportsmanship. A lot of game players have solipsistic senses of honorable play. This guy probably sees under his concept of conduct tank shocks as not worthy of play.

Doubtless, you guys have seen this article: http://www.sirlin.net/articles/playing-to-win-part-1.html. It has corrected my bad behavior, some.

You know, it's not merely being "caught off guard" or just plain poor sportsmanship. A lot of game players have solipsistic senses of honorable play. This guy probably sees under his concept of conduct tank shocks as not worthy of play.

Doubtless, you guys have seen this article: http://www.sirlin.net/articles/playing-to-win-part-1.html. It has corrected my bad behavior, some.

Your link is dead, sir


Sirlin's articles have opened a lot of peoples' eyes, but he is not himself faultless.