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Without sounding rude to Capn Bloodloss (srsly not trolling here) don't just take Crisis suits as your answer to anything
I've found that Tau (like any elf army) have units that are GOOD at a few things but are designed for one thing (except maybe stingwings...those are good at only one thing and are totally designed for it and suck at the inevitable assault that comes after...)
In short, Crisis suits are your anti heavy. They're heavy infantry that kick ass at killing heavy infantry to light vehicles
Broadsides and piranhas are your tank killers, TL Railguns can reliably hit tanks and fusion blasters are as good as any meltaguns
Railheads should be reserved for their coveted Submunition round, and ionheads provide good ID against those low T multi wound models and are good at popping small MEQ squads at absurd ranges (like devs...)
FWs are your maintsay, but in doing that run them as they are designed: simple, basic, as you've already discussed
Stealth teams are for light infantry what crisis suits are to heavies, if you're facing guard, do NOT take suits, take stealths, at least in the majority, as burst cannons are wasted on a suit, and stealth suits are rediculously good at killing the odd guard squad (CCS anyone?) and hiding in cover, as they are smaller.
From the looks of things you've got a MECHTAUtm army...so I would look at some of the forums around here for info on that...because how it is you've got some great mobility, and I think your kroot should bubble wrap your broadsides...and give them shield drones...you never wanna lose your I-Almost-cost-the-price-of-2-terminators-per-model Broadsides to a plasma cannon or worse, to three from an oblit squad...

Well the kroot tbat i got were in really bad shape so I am going to maybe buy a box but I am not sure. I do agree with the crisis suits deal though. Even though they are amazingly versatile they will suffer death by mob if not placed correctly. I am not sure if stealth suits are worth the trouble though simply because they are expensive as hell. To run a squad of six its almost worth taking a piranha or two and go full mobile light skimmer style.

I was recommending he get more suits. Not saying rely on them and only them. Just saying he only has a few and it would probably be good to have a few more. They can be very helpful and I don't think you'll deny that. I've seen too many rhino/razorback rushes to not recommend them to a fellow Tau player.

eldartau1987 wrote:2-Shas’vre
2- Missile (1 for each)
2 Plasma (1 For each)
H.W. Multi Tracker

I see you have not yet dropped the 'vre thing. Here's why you should:

1. Check the 'Vre's increase in Stats on Init and WS versus normal Crisis Suits. You'll see that they make no difference in h2h vs. MEqs. Little difference vs. GEqs. So, save points, make these two into an Elite FoC slot, and simply have the Shas'El 'attach' to them during the game. The upgrade for 'Vre is really only good for gaining access to Special Wargear.

2. The second reason is that you'll want the suits to be able to split up. A 3 suit, 2 drone unit is good sized, particularly with those 40 mm bases. The unit 'foot print' is quite large and easily caught. You'll get caught in h2h. Two smaller units, a pair of XV8s and a HQ with 2 drones are harder to track down and tie up in h2h.

eldartau1987 wrote:Broadside
Shas'vre Targeting Array Advanced Stabilization
H.W. Drone Controller
2 x shield

Two things:
1. You can't have TA and A.s.s. Each is a support system, and you can only choose one. Perhaps try, Team Leader, A.s.s. hwDroneControler, BK.
2. Again, the 'vre is pointless. Save a couple points and just have the one b-side be a team leader. Perhaps the couple points saved could be a Target Lock for the Railhead ... as its SMS will target infantry and the RG hits tanks.

One of the last posts in the thread, (lost track of who now that I'm on this screen) is debating how many Crisis Suits: IMHO, 6 or so total, is good enough up to 2k in points. Sure you could field a lot more, but with 3 filled Heavy Support choices and pathfinders and Warfish the army list can fill up with good units ... anyway, I'm pretty happy with owning six Crisis Suits.

eldartau: You stated something about having access to more b-sides. I own 3, and I've been happy with them ... the only case where I'd see needing more would be if I played against mech-IG more often.

So I played my first game last night and I lost but it was a learning experience. I learned that disruption pods are the best thing you can take defensively. They saved me on a million occasions.

I played a tourney guard list in annihilation.

His list was roughly

4 Leman Russ Tanks

2 Demolisher cannons
2 Battle Cannons

3 Veterans Squads
Shotguns, Meltaguns

2x Chimeras

1 HQ unit
Commisar, Vox Caster

2 heavy weapons squads
2 Lascannons
1 Missle Launcher

2 auto cannons
1 Missle launcher

Lots of bring it down and on my target orders on his front.


My List
1 Command Unit
Airbursting Frag
Cyclic Ion
Multitracker
H.W. Drone controller
2x shield

Elites
3x X8
3 Plasma Rifles
2 Missle Pods
1 Fusion Guns
Multitrackers
team leader
H.W. Drone Controller
2x shield drones

Fast Attack
6 Pathfinders
1 Shas Ui
BK
Markerlight Drone

Warfish

Troops
2 x 12 fire warriors
BK

Warfish

Heavy Support

2 Railheads
Disruption Pods
Multi trackers

1 Broadside
H.w. Drone Controller
T.A.

Turn 1

I rolled for first deployment. And kept my Railheads in Reserve ( my first mistake) and sent put the FWs and pathfinders out. I used the devilfish as a screen for my broadside deployment. I shot markerlights and used missles my first turns

He deployed all of his tanks and heavy weapons squads twin linked all of his heavy weapons and tried to shoot down my things with no avail. I could not move or shoot with either fish the next turn but that was my plan from the get go.

Turn 2 and on

I brought in all of my reserves and only took out two tanks. I deep struck my battle suits into his squads for suicide kills and only did a little damage with my commander.

He stood back and shot at me and kept rolling bad. He took out both devil on turn 6 ( lol) but I only had one kill point to his three.

I know this is kind of broad and I do not describe the table much and there are no pictures but I figured for those of you who wanted to play guard with this type of list there need to be a few changes made but this was the first time I have played with this list so I am proud of myself. I managed to withstand an army I haven't played before.

I hope this helps you all. Good luck!

eldartau1987 wrote:Turn 1
I rolled for first deployment. And kept my Railheads in Reserve ( my first mistake)

Oh, gods, yes! Big mistake. Well, I've had my share of brain farts too.

eldartau1987 wrote:and sent put the FWs and pathfinders out. I used the devilfish as a screen for my broadside deployment.

This is a mistake. It gives *his* tanks a cover save as you're shooting through something. B-sides are best deployed in terrain, hopefully high up and then give 'em a clear LineofSight.

eldartau1987 wrote:I brought in all of my reserves and only took out two tanks. I deep struck my battle suits into his squads for suicide kills and only did a little damage with my commander.

Again, a bad tactic. I don't even advocate the single TL-FB suicide suit. Suits are arguably the tau's best unit (or the Railhead), and should not be sent on throw away missions. Next game, try not deep stricking them at all.

eldartau1987 wrote:He stood back and shot at me and kept rolling bad. He took out both devil on turn 6 ( lol) but I only had one kill point to his three.
I know this is kind of broad and I do not describe the table much and there are no pictures but I figured for those of you who wanted to play guard with this type of list there need to be a few changes made but this was the first time I have played with this list so I am proud of myself. I managed to withstand an army I haven't played before.

Don't change up your list. Play with it a few more times, and *if* you make changes, make 'em minor, so that you get to know your list. And, on deployment, put everything onto table. Tau win because of saturated fire power, and they can't do that in Reserve **.


** - not applicable to the "Ninja-tau" tactic, which is a whole other topic.

Thanks for the feed back on the rather broad battle report.

After reading your report, I'd agree on the reserves thing. depending on how he deployed, you could deepstrike the suits behind his lines (remember, if the pathfinder's devilfish has LOS, you get to reroll bad reserves!!) and hit the juicy rear armor of all those lemans. Dont let hubris get in the way of tactics. You may have a s10ap1 shot with that railhead, but go for the sides. Best thing to do would be go for the CCS with a submunition shot. the reason they hide it is because they're real squishy. Pop the chimera with a missile pod, then drop the plate (I fight guard alot). Oh, and get a full team of broadsides asap. They're tough, and hard hitting, especially with TL-PR + 2 shield drones a piece. 9 2+ armor saves and 6 invulns for battlecannon insurance.



Taun Vior

StarHunter25 wrote:After reading your report, I'd agree on the reserves thing. depending on how he deployed, you could deepstrike the suits behind his lines (remember, if the pathfinder's devilfish has LOS, you get to reroll bad reserves!!) and hit the juicy rear armor of all those lemans. Dont let hubris get in the way of tactics. You may have a s10ap1 shot with that railhead, but go for the sides. Best thing to do would be go for the CCS with a submunition shot. the reason they hide it is because they're real squishy. Pop the chimera with a missile pod, then drop the plate (I fight guard alot). Oh, and get a full team of broadsides asap. They're tough, and hard hitting, especially with TL-PR + 2 shield drones a piece. 9 2+ armor saves and 6 invulns for battlecannon insurance.



Taun Vior

Yea That is my next process is purchasing the two broadsides i need to finish that up! I really appreciate the input and I think for fighting a tourney list against one of the most aggressive guys in the shop means i did pretty damn well.

Other then switching the Fusion Blaster to a Missile Pod I think your in good shape.

Oh and a question,

Did you find the Shas'ui upgrade and the Marker drone for the Pathfinders useful?

Just by the way, the points cost for your 2 vre in the lists before the bat rep is off, two fireknife vres are 144 points I believe, not 114.

CapnBloodloss wrote:Other then switching the Fusion Blaster to a Missile Pod I think your in good shape.

Oh and a question,

Did you find the Shas'ui upgrade and the Marker drone for the Pathfinders useful?

Yea i found the extra markerlight worth it. i liked the ui upgrade for the knife so it was worth it as well. Someone sees the markerlights and they are going to gun for the pathfinders and mess your day up.

If you decide to not deep strike then I would question the presence of the Pathfinders at the 1000 points level.

BTW, Are you still looking to run that level or are you going above it. I ask because as I was skimming the thread I saw the battle report and the IG list, at first glance looks a little heavy for 1000 pts.

Yea this was an expanded version of my list. I ran about 1500 points and so did he. He wanted to practice for the upcoming tourney that the GW store that I work at is holding.

eldartau1987 wrote:
Yea i found the extra markerlight worth it. i liked the ui upgrade for the knife so it was worth it as well. Someone sees the markerlights and they are going to gun for the pathfinders and mess your day up.

hmm the reason I asked is because for 8 more points you could have another team of 4 Pathfinders. Just switch a Warfish around to give it to the second team and now your opponent has more then one group of Pathfinders to worry about.