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When you blow up a transport, they can deploy anywhere within 2" of the hull, which means they can spread out quite a bit. Then, if they keep 5 of their models in or touching the footprint of the model, they get cover. Executioners only work well against mech lists if your opponent is really silly about how he puts down his infantry whenever he gets out of vehicles.

That or when they assault a vehicle (no consolidation) or if they deepstrike and choose not to run the turn they came in.

Not to say this never happens, but it's not like it's giving you dozens of choice opportunities to do massive damage every game.

This is one of those things where you have to stop looking only at the absolute maximum possible damage in perfect circumstances, and take a more realistic look at the kinds of targets it will be engaging.

As for mr. nova cannon. a russ with ap4 makes me weep bitter tears. HOW many points are you spending for a heavy flamer?

Ailaros wrote:As for mr. nova cannon. a russ with ap4 makes me weep bitter tears. HOW many points are you spending for a heavy flamer?

Hmm i actually agree with him for that last statement.

Especially IG has nice and cheap access to scout sentinels that can probably do just as well.

Yuber wrote:

DarthDiggler wrote:I don't understand how a mobile plasma cannon template is getting one hit per shot? Is everyone playing against all foot MEQ lists? Does anyone mount up anymore? Are these foot MEQ lists just sitting back and outshooting the IG gunline? I thought MEQ lists would need to mount up and charge the gunline to defeat it. Blow up the Rhino/Razorback/Land Raider with another unit and watch the bodies squirm as the plasma cannon template is dropped 3 times on their heads.

You can do the same with LRBT, for less.

True, if your ONE scatter dice rolls a hit (and the unit you shoot at isn't plague marines), but take 3-5 plasmacannon shots and you have a much better chance of rolling at least one hit for maximum damage.

with a smaller template

Exactly.

I mean, an infantry squad is going to put down about 5 hits per round of shooting, where as that ONE battlecannon shot only MIGHT hit, wasting the firepower for that turn. Would you argue then that it would be better to drop tanks entirely for lasgunners?

Of course, this argument is silly because you have to look at weapons comprehensively, not just at one single part of their statline, as so many people seem so tragically inclined to do.

I'm entering into this topic quite late, and haven't read the whole thread so I'm merely stating my opinion.

I like the Demolisher better. This is simply because the way I play my Guard is that I have an armoured spearhead trundling down a flank of the enemy with Demolishers leading the charge. The short range is mitigated due to the fact that I'll be moving pretty much constantly the entire game and, to be honest, 24" is a longer threat range than you may think.

Demolishers are also damn scary. No-one wants to get hit by S10 AP2 no matter who you are. This can lead to board denial, where you restict how and where your enemy can move. They're a big target, and can absorb a ton of firepower, and every shot aimed at them is a shot not aimed at my Plasma CCS/Melta Vets/Vendettas who can, more than likely, deal out more damage over the course of the game.

Oh, and there was that one time where the Demolisher blew up a Tyranid Prime and his entire Warrior Brood in Turn 1 and caused the rest of his army to have Instinctive Behaviour for the rest of the game...that was fun too.

In my opinion a Demolisher > Executioner.

L. Wrex

Ailaros wrote:When you blow up a transport, they can deploy anywhere within 2" of the hull, which means they can spread out quite a bit. Then, if they keep 5 of their models in or touching the footprint of the model, they get cover. Executioners only work well against mech lists if your opponent is really silly about how he puts down his infantry whenever he gets out of vehicles.

You have to use the access points to disembark if possible. Of course that's not as big a problem with Marine transports since they have access points everywhere with overlapping coverage.

As for mr. nova cannon. a russ with ap4 makes me weep bitter tears. HOW many points are you spending for a heavy flamer?

Full agreement there.