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You know you want to play ultramarines. You aspire to be them. Their story is large and 'well written'.
And of course, absolutely nobody will hate on you to look cool

bloodaxegit wrote:BA FTW! AP3 boltguns! Deep striking landraiders! Enough said?

You do realise that deep striking a LR is not a smart thing to do? Also, if you mean Sternguard (regarding AP3 bolters), the standard SM codex can have them too. But yes, I would say BA too, especially if you favour assault over gunlines.

I love when posts start getting a life of their own!

I actually like SW better (in look and CC) but there are so many local SW armies and like playing underplayed armies.

Going BA right or wrong.

Space wolves or blood angels.

Since I've never played a SM army what do you all think of this starter 1500 point list? I'm also trying to save some money by using 2 SM BFs.

1 Astorath the Grim

1 Tactical Squad
1 Flamer
1 Missile Launcher
1 Rhino

1 Tactical Squad
1 Flamer
1 Missile Launcher
1 Rhino

1 Tactical Squad
1 Flamer
1 Missile Launcher

1 Death Company
2 Additional Death Company
1 Power Fist
5 Jump Packs

1 Death Company
2 Additional Death Company
1 Power Fist
5 Jump Packs

1 Predator
1 Lascannon Sponsons

1 Predator
1 Lascannon Sponsons

That's not very good. It's actually horrible. It doesn't use any of the BA strengths, but embraces some of their weaknesses. The death company are uncontrollable. Jump packs just make them more likely to kill themselves with dangerous terrain tests on their way to ignoble deaths at the hands of the enemy. BA Tactical squads are distinctly inferior to BA Assault squads in every way save their access to a heavy weapon. The assault marines can get 2 special weapons and get transports cheaper if you take away their jump packs.

The SM BF isn't a great start for BA since it's so heavy on tacticals. Make your tacticals into death company with bolters and stick em in the rhinos. They have relentless and can always shoot and move. Make the assault marines into regular assault marines with melta guns.

Thanks for the candor ;-)

OK, so if the BF is a bad place to start for BA army, what would your low cost entry point army look like? The BF is nice for keeping costs down but I'm open to other ways of getting there.

There's little way to keep the cost for BA down i think
you want gakload of Assault squad rather than tac marines

Strap melta/infernus into the Assault Sergeant
pick out some of the elite choice
and Chaplains (rerolls?=GOOD)

Unfortunately, there isn't really a cheap way to get into one of the good BA lists. Your straight battleforce idea is an option, but I think it'll be frustrating for you. I think you should design a list that appeals to you and then start collecting the models to make that list.

If 1500 points is your goal you could do something like this:

Jump pack Chaplain $15
Battleforce x2 $180
Baal Pred x2 $99
Sang Priest x2 $30
MG Pack $8
Jump packs $8
BP & CS Arms (warstore) x4 $35.96
Razorback x2 $70

Total: $445.96 retail

With which you could build something like this:

Reclusiarch w/jump pack
Sang priest w/ jump pack
Sang priest
5 man assault squad, PW, MG, Razorback
5 man assault squad, PW, MG, Razorback
10 man assault squad, PF, 2xMG Rhino
10 man assault squad, PF, 2xFL, Rhino

10-man assault squad, PF, 2xMG

Baal Predator w/HB sponsons
Ball Predator w/HB sponsons

That comes to 1405 points so you have room for upgrades on the razorbacks and things. You have 6 vehicles, all fast. You have 6 melta guns. The one squad got 2 flamers because those come in the battleforces and buying one pack of Meltas doesn't get them enough for 2. You have a hard-hitting jump assault unit with Fearless, FC and FNP re-rolling misses on the charge.

There is not a clear or correct answer to this one as it is completely subjective. I think anyone can make a strong enough argument for any Chapter just by saying they like the color scheme or the models, without ever getting into the fluff or codex arguments. This is not a quanitifiable type of decision that can be backed up with facts, it is purely based upon personal preferences.

If you don't want to use C:SM then it has to be C:SW imo. I think it is simply the best/strongest codex out right now. I would however encourage you to use C:SM and play Salamanders or Imperial Fists. Their fluff is cool and the paint schemes are awesome.

I know I might be accused of not knowing what I'm talking about, but I think Black Templars are the chapter I would personally pick. I like that slightly mad glint in their eye..or if you stretch the definition of Marine a little, Sisters of Battle..

That would definitely be stretching the definition...

BT
NO PITY! NO REMORSE! NO FEAR!

Monster Rain wrote:The correct answer is, of course, Iron Hands.

Indeed. Fight the Power.

BA and SW are very good choices, but C:SM also has options for a lot of fun builds. I would just go with whatever appeals to you more.

Ma55ter_fett wrote:BT
NO PITY! NO REMORSE! NO FEAR!

WORD, BROTHER!

I am making an SM/CSM army currently using The Fallen Dark Angels as my premise/fluff. It has been working out quite well and has allowed me to essentially have two different armies which I can change on the fly. If I am feeling aggressive, I rock the CSM. If I am more defensive I play them as SM.

Although I would also maybe wait to see what GW releases in respect to a BA BF. The rumors are that BA will get their own BF come February.

I think you have to decide what playstyle you're looking for first. Personally, I'm putting together a Raven Guard army, but I'm gonna use the Blood Angel codex because it's better for how I want to play.

OK. BA it is by my slow purchase of GW product.

Any feelings on best BA HQ options? I like the idea of Dante's precision with DS but would like to hear other ideas.

Ultrama...r.in...es......ahem


Automatically Appended Next Post:

mcyeatman wrote:OK. BA it is by my slow purchase of GW product.

Any feelings on best BA HQ options? I like the idea of Dante's precision with DS but would like to hear other ideas.

I like the Sanguinor, bit more durable than meph, and hes like a flying TH/SS but awesome. But he is expensive as funk

Since you’re looking for a specialised Loyalist Marine codex, there aren’t many options available aside from SW and BA. There is DA and BT but these are 4th edition codices and you’re probably looking for a 5th edition codex.

This being said, I reckon the SW codex is more flexible and enjoyable than the BA codex. There is a greater range of flexible and useable SCs than the BA dex (which consists of Dante, Astorath and Mephiston). Its 4 HQ system is a pretty cool feature and the range of customisation available to HQs is also cool. The wolf dex itself is pretty flexible and allows you to build anything from a shooty army, assault army or terminator army. The wolf dex is also more balanced than the BA dex with less “crazy units/abilities” such as Mephiston, Sanguinary Priests, Librarian dreads, deepstriking Land Raiders, DOA and Fast Vindicators.

Overall I reckon you should use the Wolf dex. If you’re not a fan of freaky orange hair then I suggest you model your own custom chapter and just use the wolf codex.

If you really must know, the clear choice is Angry Marines...although the Codex is a bit out of date......

.

Salamanders all the way, that would be my personal opinion if you didn't want to strive away from the basic SM codex, if you did want t strive away from it, i would say the SW

Radikus wrote:Im a fairly new player also. I like the vanilla marines, BA and SW! I didnt know what to do, so I started painting marines in my own color scheme with the intent of playing whatever marine faction I felt like that day. Most people dont care, and the ones that do are chodes anyways. Eventually I liked DA colors so much I just painted everything that color and still use whatever marine codex I feel like. I cant settle on any faction, ive had this issue forever in games. Picking a class in MMO's to what race I play in Starcraft. So basically what im saying is, do marines how ya want to and aslong as their marines you can use any of the books! :p

Sound advice. I was thinking the same thing. Paint them in a manner which would allow me to switch between SM & BA.

Go for salamanders, easy skin to paint. also go for em' is you like close combat and seeing your nemesis burn in a fiery ball of death.