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I like the Pulse Carbine, Assault 1, range 18", can markerlight, and is pinning. Plus S5 AP5.

Pretty damn nice, althought the pulse rifle is nice too, just rapid fire.

I would say it would be the Ork Loota's Deffgun!

I had to go shoota for that, partially because of the guy holding it and how cheap he is and how many you could get for the cost at 6pts.

Fafnir wrote:The Grey Knight bursts in with a pumped up Stormbolter and kills the both of them?

You clearly don't know how deadlest warrior works.

Anyway I didn't consider the GK storm bolter the best basic troop gun because GK are not BASIC troops, same thing with the TS bolter. Now if we were talkig ELITE troop guns then that's a differnt story.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

Stormrider wrote:I like the Pulse Carbine, Assault 1, range 18", can markerlight, and is pinning. Plus S5 AP5.

Your thinking of the Pathfinder Pulse Carbine, this is only talking about the basic troops (Fire Warriors, Eldar Guardians, etc.).

The Pulse Carbine used by Fire Warriors doesn't have a markerlight on it . HOWEVER the Pulse Carbine's pinning effect does make it a pretty good gun, thanks for pointing that part out

Lyzin Locrian wrote:Anyway I didn't consider the GK storm bolter the best basic troop gun because GK are not BASIC troops, same thing with the TS bolter. Now if we were talkig ELITE troop guns then that's a differnt story.

PAGK are a troop choice. They get Storm Bolters standard. Therefore the Storm Bolter is a basic troop gun.

The SB is of course the best troop gun. It's a shoota with a bigger range and lower AP. Since its assault you get a 30'' threat range and you can assault after you shoot. That's before you get psybolts and make them S5.

Lyzin Locrian wrote:

Fafnir wrote:The Grey Knight bursts in with a pumped up Stormbolter and kills the both of them?

You clearly don't know how deadlest warrior works.

Anyway I didn't consider the GK storm bolter the best basic troop gun because GK are not BASIC troops, same thing with the TS bolter. Now if we were talkig ELITE troop guns then that's a differnt story.

What, pray tell, would I take in my GK army as my basic troops if that's the case then?

I'm surprised at how the Devourer isn't getting it'd due her. Not only is it 18" Move/Shoot/Assault, but it's also got the highest average wound output of any weapon included against T4 and T3.

Here are average wound inflictions for each of the above weapons in their optimal firing range.

BS3 versus T3 (before any applicable saves)

Winner: Devourer

Bolt Gun 0.66
Bolt Pistol 0.33
Shoota 0.66
Blasta 0.25
Shuriken Catapult 0.66
Splinter Rifle 0.5
Devourer 1.0
Storm Bolter 0.66
Pulse Carbine 0.4166
Pulse Rifle 0.833
Tsons Boltgun 0.66
Lasgun 0.5
Gauss Blaster 0.66
Pink Horror 0.66
Kroot Gun 0.66

BS4 versus T3 (before any applicable saves)

Winner: Devourer

Bolt Gun 0.88
Bolt Pistol 0.44
Shoota 0.88
Blasta 0.33
Shuriken Catapult 0.88
Splinter Rifle 0.66
Devourer 1.33
Storm Bolter 0.88
Pulse Carbine 0.55
Pulse Rifle 1.1
Tsons Boltgun 0.88
Lasgun 0.66
Gauss Blaster 0.88
Pink Horror 0.88
Kroot Gun 0.88


BS3 versus T4 (before any applicable saves)

Winner: Devourer

Bolt Gun 0.5
Bolt Pistol 0.25
Shoota 0.5
Blasta 0.166
Shuriken Catapult 0.5
Splinter Rifle 0.5
Devourer 0.75
Storm Bolter 0.5
Pulse Carbine 0.33
Pulse Rifle 0.66
Tsons Boltgun 0.5
Lasgun 0.33
Gauss Blaster 0.5
Pink Horror 0.5
Kroot Gun 0.5


BS4 versus T4 (before any applicable saves)

Winner: Devourer

Bolt Gun 0.66
Bolt Pistol 0.33
Shoota 0.22
Blasta 0.166
Shuriken Catapult 0.66
Splinter Rifle 0.66
Devourer 1.0
Storm Bolter 0.66
Pulse Carbine 0.44
Pulse Rifle 0.88
Tsons Boltgun 0.66
Lasgun 0.44
Gauss Blaster 0.66
Pink Horror 0.66
Kroot Gun 0.66



Now yes, there are some more additional factors here such as AP, Rapid Fire versus Assault, and Range, but the Devourer has the highest average wound output before applicable saves, and a 24" threat range on a model with a 6" move that isn't subject to Rapid Fire restrictions.

Save throws doesnt need to be factored in as the only weapon there that can reliably penetrate armor is the Tsons Infernobolts, and the unit itself has far too many problems outweighing that one perk. However the Devourer counts as an upgraded weapon, so it's debatable whether or not it should count as a Basic weapon, since you can make an equal argument for meltaguns (which special weapon squads can take en mass) or Sonic blasters (which every noise marine can take).

It's a default weapon on Warriors, which are Troop units.

Notice how Pulse Rifles came in second in every one of those calculations? And usually fairly closely.

And I agree with MechaEmperor, they are BARELY basic troop guns. Sure Warriors get them, but they are also 30 points each. Could we call nobz troops because they can be taken as such when you take a warboss? Jus' sayin'

As a single weapon in a vacuum, it's outstanding. However given what unit it's attached to, it's mediocre at best, since you cant pump out nearly enough shots to make it worth it.

@ Praetor Dave: I agree that Warriors are not "basic troops" but unlike Nobz, there isnt any pre-requisite HQ choice needed to unlock them. However since the same argument can be made for GK terminators, that's kinda out of the window.

PraetorDave wrote:Notice how Pulse Rifles came in second in every one of those calculations? And usually fairly closely.

And I agree with MechaEmperor, they are BARELY basic troop guns. Sure Warriors get them, but they are also 30 points each. Could we call nobz troops because they can be taken as such when you take a warboss? Jus' sayin'

Warriors don't require anything special to get as Troops. They are basic troops choices that don't require anything special to become troops and come with Devourers as basic weapons. They aren't units that need to be "made" troops and Devourer's aren't upgrade weapons for them.

Vaktathi wrote:

PraetorDave wrote:Notice how Pulse Rifles came in second in every one of those calculations? And usually fairly closely.

And I agree with MechaEmperor, they are BARELY basic troop guns. Sure Warriors get them, but they are also 30 points each. Could we call nobz troops because they can be taken as such when you take a warboss? Jus' sayin'

Warriors don't require anything special to get as Troops. They are basic troops choices that don't require anything special to become troops and come with Devourers as basic weapons. They aren't units that need to be "made" troops and Devourer's aren't upgrade weapons for them.

Yeah I know. Warriors are more of an elite choice. No other book has 3W troops. Besides they are also synapse and only get up to 9 in a brood (thats a lot less than all the other troop choices for 'nids). By definition, yes they are troops, and yes their wargear includes a devourer, so they do qualify, however they are probably the most heavy troop choice in the game.

Avenger Catapults, when you absolutely, positively have to kill every single Ork on the board, accept no substitute.

(Yes, a nod to Jackie Brown there)

What's all this "GK SBs don't count"? They're the base troop choice for GKs, just because they're significantly more expensive than any other, they're still the base troop.

you know? The fact that every GK gets stormbolter kinda makes the termies and paladins less elite... They should get asscannons as the default sidearm imho

Im gonna go with the Splinter Rifle here, since it can pretty much tear apart anything short of a vheicle, including MC's (Which really is bad news bears for Tyranid players like myself).