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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2011/08/27 17:52:21
Subject: Coteaz - Smoke Launchers + I've Been Expecting You
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Ork Admiral Kroozin Da Kosmos on Da Hulk
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Q: Can any embarked troops shoot out of a vehicle on
the turn it has used its smoke launchers? (p66)
A: No.
Coteaz embarked in a vehicle may shoot out of it, unless stated otherwise. Smoke launchers only prevent him from shooting during your turn, not during your opponents turn.
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7 Ork facts people always get wrong:
Ragnar did not win against Thrakka, but suffered two crushing defeats within a few days of each other.
A lasgun is powerful enough to sever an ork's appendage or head in a single, well aimed shot.
Orks meks have a better understanding of electrics and mechanics than most Tech Priests.
Orks actually do not think that purple makes them harder to see. The joke was made canon by Alex Stewart's Caphias Cain books.
Gharkull Blackfang did not even come close to killing the emperor.
Orks can be corrupted by chaos, but few of them have any interest in what chaos offers.
Orks do not have the power of believe. |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2011/08/27 19:18:16
Subject: Coteaz - Smoke Launchers + I've Been Expecting You
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Fresh-Faced New User
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Where does the rules say this. The only rule I can find on smoke launchers that say how long the smoke stays says until the end of the opponents shooting phase.
We are dealing with something that is outside the normal rules. So we must consider all the rules that may apply. If the I've Been Expecting you occurred after the smoke disappeared, Cortez would be able to shoot. Since the smoke is still there, his unit can't see.
The rules on smoke launchers make no distinction on the 2 byproducts of the smoke. (unit may not shoot and recieves "obscurement"). So the smoke does both by RAW. This lasts until the end opponents shooting phase. To treat this any other way would be making assumptions that are not stated in the rules.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2011/08/27 20:00:19
Subject: Coteaz - Smoke Launchers + I've Been Expecting You
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Ferocious Black Templar Castellan
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Garrick wrote:Where does the rules say this. The only rule I can find on smoke launchers that say how long the smoke stays says until the end of the opponents shooting phase.
We are dealing with something that is outside the normal rules. So we must consider all the rules that may apply. If the I've Been Expecting you occurred after the smoke disappeared, Cortez would be able to shoot. Since the smoke is still there, his unit can't see.
The rules on smoke launchers make no distinction on the 2 byproducts of the smoke. (unit may not shoot and recieves "obscurement"). So the smoke does both by RAW. This lasts until the end opponents shooting phase. To treat this any other way would be making assumptions that are not stated in the rules.
We know that the vehicle can't fire the turn it uses smoke launchers. Thanks to the FAQ we also know that passengers can't fire from the vehicle the turn it pops smoke either. The thing is, Coteaz doesn't fire during the turn his transport popped smoke, he's firing during the following player's turn.
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For thirteen years I had a dog with fur the darkest black. For thirteen years he was my friend, oh how I want him back. |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2011/08/27 21:02:39
Subject: Coteaz - Smoke Launchers + I've Been Expecting You
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Fresh-Faced New User
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The smoke that kept his unit from firing is still present until the end of the opponents shoot phase. This is why he can't shoot.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2011/08/27 21:12:03
Subject: Re:Coteaz - Smoke Launchers + I've Been Expecting You
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Aspirant Tech-Adept
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The only limitation that popping smoke has to shooting, is that the unit may not shoot that turn (player turn as discussed already). Coteaz gives the ability to shoot in your opponent's turn. The fact that the smoke is there is not relevant. Popping smoke has very specific effects.
Rules =/= logic.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2011/08/27 22:38:00
Subject: Coteaz - Smoke Launchers + I've Been Expecting You
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Decrepit Dakkanaut
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Garrick wrote:The smoke that kept his unit from firing is still present until the end of the opponents shoot phase. This is why he can't shoot.
Except youre making that up, as there are no rules covering that at all.
RAW, youre wrong. RAI? Probably right. But the rules as written you are wrong
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2011/08/28 01:06:40
Subject: Coteaz - Smoke Launchers + I've Been Expecting You
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Tail-spinning Tomb Blade Pilot
All kinds of places at once
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If there is a more general description for a situation, then you have to follow the general description when there is no other offered. As there is not anything offered about the ability to shoot from a transport in the opponent's turn, we must default to the general description rather than make one up, even if we might see a reasonable, different option based on rules that applied to a similar situation in the previous turn (such as not being able to fire from inside the transport).
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Lordhat wrote:Just because the codexes are the exactly the same, does not mean that that they're the same codex. |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2011/08/28 06:29:50
Subject: Coteaz - Smoke Launchers + I've Been Expecting You
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Martial Arts Fiday
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Garrick wrote:The smoke that kept his unit from firing is still present until the end of the opponents shoot phase. This is why he can't shoot.
There is no smoke. Only rules.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2011/08/28 09:42:01
Subject: Coteaz - Smoke Launchers + I've Been Expecting You
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Dakka Veteran
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Basically this is a case of RAW vs RAI.
Is 40k a game governed by common sense, or a set of rules? A set of rules I think, so whether or not it seems logical or it makes or doesn't make sense is irrelevant.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2011/08/28 12:31:53
Subject: Coteaz - Smoke Launchers + I've Been Expecting You
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Lord of the Fleet
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Garrick wrote:The smoke that kept his unit from firing is still present until the end of the opponents shoot phase. This is why he can't shoot.
That's a fluff reasoning, not a rules reasoning.
The rules are clear that you can shoot from a smoked transport in your opponent's turn (given some ability that allows this).
However, forbidding this would be an extremely sensible houserule.
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