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*Accidently burns down house*

"THIS IS WHY WE CAN"T HAVE NICE THINGS!"

Always make me laugh with the lack of teeth they have.

And sometimes proper shoes. Of course there is also the epic derp face on the one state troop on the far left of the GW pic.

TheAngrySquig wrote:So one 30 man cb unit with a flaming banner, 3 ten mans, and one forty man state troops block? Does any particular state troop work well better with a shooty list?

If you're expecting regenerating enemies, then I'd go with the the 30 man unit with flaming banner, otherwise just take 3 units of ten.

I don't know if 60 ranged troops are needed though, I'd probably prefer two big units of infantry. YMMV, but keep in mind my ratio will be closer to what you'll get out of your batallion boxes.

So about 2:1 ST to CB?

sebster wrote:

Turalon wrote:Well you only get 20 attacks with the crossbow unit, not 30 as crossbows don't have the Volley fire special rule. I only suggest 30 because they will be attacked and it satisfies core better. Once you drop below 20 models you lose out on your ability to do damage. Ultimately though, you just gotta wound a big nasty once so you can cannon it without it's regeneration.

I don't get what you mean there. If you have 30 crossbowmen you can just deploy them 15 wide to keep everyone shooting every turn.

I would deploy them in a 10x3 formation, so it doesn't take up so much of your deployment zone.

I think that may become an issue when you start running 3-4 blocks of at least 10 wide infantry plus cannons, as this thread seems to be progressing.

Volley Guns, pistoliers and Outriders could also be put in the list. So if everything wants to shoot, not taking into account terrain, the deployment zone could become quite crowded.

Do you think I should use a BFG like the volley gun or the rocket battery?

TheAngrySquig wrote:Do you think I should use a BFG like the volley gun or the rocket battery?

Yes, both are very good for their points (rocket battery more so) and in a shooty themed army why not?

SO MUCH *BLAM*

TheAngrySquig wrote:Do you think I should use a BFG like the volley gun or the rocket battery?

They serve pretty different roles, so the answer really is why not both?

That said, the volley gun is pretty mediocre right now, it really doesn't generate enough hits to justify the high cost.

The rocket battery can be really effective though. While mortars are great, their damage drops off pretty quickly when your core targets are tough, or well armoured, and are downright underwhelming when the target has high toughness and a lot of armour. An army with a load of Chaos Warriors can march across the field, pretty happy that any lucky mortar hit won't leave too big a hole in the unit. On the other hand, while the rocket battery is a little less reliable and lot more pricey, when it lands it'll rip a hole in the toughest of enemy units. A pie plate with a -2 save can mess up any large infantry unit.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

Turalon wrote:I would deploy them in a 10x3 formation, so it doesn't take up so much of your deployment zone.

But then why bother paying 80 points for the guys at the back at all? Why not just two ranks, ten wide?

I think that may become an issue when you start running 3-4 blocks of at least 10 wide infantry plus cannons, as this thread seems to be progressing.

It's common for infantry to reform into a wide formation as the enemy approaches.

Volley Guns, pistoliers and Outriders could also be put in the list. So if everything wants to shoot, not taking into account terrain, the deployment zone could become quite crowded.

Pistoliers should move up the line, in amongst the enemy, and shouldn't be a problem at all. The primary advantage of outriders is that each of the packs the same punch as three handgunners, but takes up a lot less real estate. If space is an issue, swapping out handgunners or crossbowmen for outriders is a decent option.

But how likely is it that I actually hit anything with a base BS 4 and negative bonus' for things like multiple shots or moving?

*great thread BTW. Learning alot here

TheAngrySquig wrote:But how likely is it that I actually hit anything with a base BS 4 and negative bonus' for things like multiple shots or moving?

How likely is it that you'll hit with what? The pistoliers?

Pistols are quick to fire, and that means they suffer no penalty for moving and shooting, it means they can even march and fire. You still suffer -1 for multiple shots, and if you're at long range, which isn't far with pistols, you'll suffer another -1, which means you're hitting on 6s. Even with two shots per guy, that only leaves you with one hit for every three pistoliers, which is a pretty poor return.

However, you are incredibly fast, and so you're capable of getting right up amongst the enemy, standing an inch away. This means the only penalty is for multiple shots, leaving pistoliers at -1, hitting on 5s and average tow hits for every three pistoliers. Which isn't great, but it's pretty handy for a unit that's there mostly to annoy the enemy.

What about Outriders? I want them because their entry mentions them having "eccentrically waxed mustaches"

TheAngrySquig wrote:What about Outriders? I want them because their entry mentions them having "eccentrically waxed mustaches"

They're basically giving you the same thing as handgunners - 24", Str 4 with armour penetration for about 8 points a shot, hitting half the time at short range. The advantage of handgunners is that they bring 3 wounds for every one of those shots, while the outriders only bring 1 (the slightly better save of the outriders doesn't really make up for that). On the other hand, outriders give you that firepower in a much more concentrated dose - ten outriders take up a lot less table space than 30 handgunners; and the outriders also get that free move before play starts. I struggled to get any value out of outriders for a long time, because I tried to get too much out of that extra move, trying to push them quickly up a flank like I would pistoliers, but people on this forum showed me the best use of the move is just to advance them an inch forward, so they can be guaranteed a shot in the first turn.

So basically, if you think you're likely to face the kind of tough, heavily armoured target that handguns are ideal against, and you want to fit the unit into a smaller area, then outriders work very nicely.

Solid, I think i'll probably end up with a Nulnish Empire army.

I'd say Wood Elves but they are hard to play.

I also don't much like the hippie effect much

TheAngrySquig wrote:I also don't much like the hippie effect much

They are not hippies. Hippies want peace, Wood Elves would kill you for touching a tree.

Yeah they are more like the militant arm of Greenpeace than actual hippies.

I also think most of the models look kind of derpy/silly