GK vs GK: How do you deal with Pallies?

Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you:

No adverts like this in the forums anymore.
Times and dates in your local timezone.
Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance.
Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely.
Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net.

If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

**Draigo**

thakabalpuphorsefishguy wrote:
Draigo wrote:Few things
1. Librarian
2. Null Rod
3.brain mines+pysk out = int tes at 1 int or cant participate in cc lol
4. Mindstrike Missiles
5. Plasma Canon either on rb or sr
6. Warp quake vs ds
7. Santuary vs their assaults
8. countered with own paladins
9. Vindicare shield breaker on stave or draigo
10. Tank Shock
Theres other ways but these are the ones used on me or i used on others a few weekends ago.

Only thing here is that you always take stat tests on unmodified stats per the BRB

And? I still prefer the good old fashion charge with my purifiers or my pallys. Purifiers witha libby have hh, MoT and cleansing flame. Draigo with Libby and paladins have hhx2, MoT etc. Plus on the charge I have psyk out grenades redusing their I to 1. Easy to get a charge with so many walking draigo wings when I have a storm raven.

**rigeld2**

thakabalpuphorsefishguy wrote:Only thing here is that you always take stat tests on unmodified stats per the BRB

Thats... not true. Sweeping Advance (iirc) specifies unmodified, but it's not a stat test rule.

**Draigo**

rigeld2 wrote:
thakabalpuphorsefishguy wrote:Only thing here is that you always take stat tests on unmodified stats per the BRB

Thats... not true. Sweeping Advance (iirc) specifies unmodified, but it's not a stat test rule.

Fun fact mentioning sweeping advance is that termies or dudes in termie armor can't do sweeping advance.

**GreyChaos**

Poor termies and their clunky armour :( They need to get on the treadmill more.

**Dok**

dnanoodle wrote:The way I feel about killing Paladins is basically go big or go home. I really think it's best to smash them with ID that goes through their 2+. If youre only shooting 1 S8+ Ap2/1 at them, don't bother (unless there is literally nowhere else to shoot it) because Draigo will eat it. If your shots are S8+ but not AP2/1, again I think it's (mostly) a waste of time. Same goes for S7 AP2. I feel there are some exceptions to this like Mindstrike missiles, assuming you get perils on each model and not one model for brotherhood of psykers. Small arms is even more hilariously futile. I'd rather run to get better positioning for assault.

If you're playing GK vs GK I think the best option is assault with NFWs. I can't say for sure but it seems to me that DCAs wouldn't do enough after wound allocation and will be pricey with a delivery system. If they can't do it then you still need something more and if it's more DCAs you're spending a fortune and perhaps unbalancing the list.

Personally I would look to regular Termies or Purifiers, in either LRs or SRs. If playing foot I'd try rushing them with 3 units staggered enough to prevet being multi-assaulted. Id expect to lose about one to shooting and assault with two the next turn. I'd look to running options to ensure I get my charge. If running Interceptors I'd consider them for charge support too despite their unimpressive attack profile. I'm not saying this would work, but just thinking about it this is what I'd try. Id reevaluate the strategy after seeing how I goes.

For shooting I'd say Psyocculum Henchmen with 2Plasma Cannons, 1 Multi-melta, 2 monkeys and 3 Meltalytes. This makes them useful as a TAC unit and has enough ID to sweat the Pallies. Other options could be orbital lance strikes, warp rift and vortex of doom, but I dont expect great results from those

That's pretty sound advice. I had considered doing something along the lines of the henchmen with plasma cannons, but I think I may switch to stormravens in my list. I bought my first one last night so hopefully they won't be too hard to learn to play with.

**OverwatchCNC**

Dok wrote:
dnanoodle wrote:The way I feel about killing Paladins is basically go big or go home. I really think it's best to smash them with ID that goes through their 2+. If youre only shooting 1 S8+ Ap2/1 at them, don't bother (unless there is literally nowhere else to shoot it) because Draigo will eat it. If your shots are S8+ but not AP2/1, again I think it's (mostly) a waste of time. Same goes for S7 AP2. I feel there are some exceptions to this like Mindstrike missiles, assuming you get perils on each model and not one model for brotherhood of psykers. Small arms is even more hilariously futile. I'd rather run to get better positioning for assault.

If you're playing GK vs GK I think the best option is assault with NFWs. I can't say for sure but it seems to me that DCAs wouldn't do enough after wound allocation and will be pricey with a delivery system. If they can't do it then you still need something more and if it's more DCAs you're spending a fortune and perhaps unbalancing the list.

Personally I would look to regular Termies or Purifiers, in either LRs or SRs. If playing foot I'd try rushing them with 3 units staggered enough to prevet being multi-assaulted. Id expect to lose about one to shooting and assault with two the next turn. I'd look to running options to ensure I get my charge. If running Interceptors I'd consider them for charge support too despite their unimpressive attack profile. I'm not saying this would work, but just thinking about it this is what I'd try. Id reevaluate the strategy after seeing how I goes.

For shooting I'd say Psyocculum Henchmen with 2Plasma Cannons, 1 Multi-melta, 2 monkeys and 3 Meltalytes. This makes them useful as a TAC unit and has enough ID to sweat the Pallies. Other options could be orbital lance strikes, warp rift and vortex of doom, but I dont expect great results from those

That's pretty sound advice. I had considered doing something along the lines of the henchmen with plasma cannons, but I think I may switch to stormravens in my list. I bought my first one last night so hopefully they won't be too hard to learn to play with.

Are you thinking of running the SRs with TL PC over TL AC? Personally both my SR are TL AC and I sort of wish I had magnetized the weapons to take TL PC. PC are fantastic weapons and while Psybolt Ammo makes the AC good I just feel the PC would have given me better utility. I guess what I am saying Dok is magnetize your weapons, you never know what the new Melta will be in 6th ed. Could be TL LC will be the new business!

Either way let's get together when you're ready and test out your anti-paladin strategies.

**Draigo**

I like the plasma canon. It always does good work espeacially at the beginning when people are localized after the mm poppin them(from other sr)

**Dok**

@overwatch: ya, I was planning on taking the PC. I was considering taking the typhoon as well but that's only if points allow. That way I can fire them as defensive if need be.

**dnanoodle**

Stormravens ought not to be hard to use, though admittedly I haven't tried them. I play Eldar in addition to GK and Stormravens are a lot like Wave Serpents except with some very convenient extra features. Ill say that it takes a little time learn how to take best advantage of skimmer movement. They're so fast you can overdo it at times and coordinating more than one can take some planning and experience. Moreso than with standard vehicles, I find myself thinking in terms of where they all need to be at the end of my movement and in a couple turns--not just where they are at the moment. Developing this skill will help you use them to provide cover saves and take advantage of flat-out cover.

Are you his opponent, OverwatchCNC?

**OverwatchCNC**

Dok and I play at the same FLGS but I am not his only opponent who plays Paladins. We are both preparing for the Bay Area Open and he will be taking GK and I am on the fence about taking GK or SW.

**Flavius Infernus**

A couple of the early responses mentioned tank shock, which IMO is always the best way to defeat paladins. When I play against GK armies with paladin units, tank shock kills them more surely and completely than any other threat regardless of what (mechanized) army I'm playing.

Since then, this thread has wandered off into a lot of suggestions about plasma and krak missiles? I know most of the posters here understand wound allocation and why trying to shoot paladins to death with these kinds of guns is a losing proposition.

I'm starting to feel like the "tank shock paladins!" guy around here the last few weeks. But seriously. It works.

**Draigo**

The worst match up I have been seeing for draigo lists espeacially has been mech eldar for a few reasons.. spinner, bright lances,tank shock, 3d6 psy tests.. spinner makin them make terrain tests and possibly causing rends, bright lance insta kills, tank shock from wave serpents and those dang 3d6 tests are really effective to shut down draigo lists espeacially since theyre smaller in number..

**OverwatchCNC**

Draigo wrote:The worst match up I have been seeing for draigo lists espeacially has been mech eldar for a few reasons.. spinner, bright lances,tank shock, 3d6 psy tests.. spinner makin them make terrain tests and possibly causing rends, bright lance insta kills, tank shock from wave serpents and those dang 3d6 tests are really effective to shut down draigo lists espeacially since theyre smaller in number..

Don't spread the mechdar thing around! Didn't we have enough of mechdar in forth ed

?

**Draigo**

Eh I don't have to worry about em ept 1 or 2 guys maybe. Most the places I play have crons, tau, ba, ig, de, sw, csm and vanilla lists like vulkan.

So spread away!

**dnanoodle**

Flavius
Youre not the only one who feels that way

hehe just playin' man. I'm trying to help steer people away from things that don't utterly annihilate Paladins but I need you to advocate the tank shocking so I can focus on the Paladins' fiery deaths

Seriously though, theres no wounding Paladins to death. Funny as it is they're more like the Terminator than Necrons are even with their WBB style rules.

And yeah, nothing to see here! Eldar are outdated and will never get a new codex! Stay away from them!

I like mine a lot and I don't want them to be FoTM haha.

**Draigo**

Be a real shame if someone used those mindstrike missles off the storm raven too then.

**Dok**

Unfortunately, since paladins don't have a justicar equivalent, they would just take the perils on a random dude. unloading missiles on them is a good way to soften them up though. That's for sure.

Automatically Appended Next Post:
@dnanoodle: I play Eldar as well and while they are pretty good against GK in general, they are still pretty poor against SW. I can't beat a SW player with Eldar for the life of me.

**thakabalpuphorsefishguy**

rigeld2 wrote:
thakabalpuphorsefishguy wrote:Only thing here is that you always take stat tests on unmodified stats per the BRB

Thats... not true. Sweeping Advance (iirc) specifies unmodified, but it's not a stat test rule.

Yup! You are right and that is exactly where my confusion was based from. Thanks for clearing that up!