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Joey wrote:I would assume he stops demons from being summoned around terra...otherwise they would have just summoned there and finished him off. Instead, they have to get their using conventional means, which is pretty tricky. They can't even take Cadia...

It's hard to take Cadia when there's a company of all powerful beings that decides you haven't even if you have.

They almost took a single fortress world. That's a long, long, way from terra.

Durza wrote:

Joey wrote:I would assume he stops demons from being summoned around terra...otherwise they would have just summoned there and finished him off. Instead, they have to get their using conventional means, which is pretty tricky. They can't even take Cadia...

It's hard to take Cadia when there's a company of all powerful beings that decides you haven't even if you have.

I'm guessing those guys are the 'Lords of Creation' in GW.

Joey wrote:They almost took a single fortress world. That's a long, long, way from terra.

That is because 90% of all Cadian Regiments are not on Cadia at all but all over the galaxy.
Seriously, everywhere you see you will see Cadians here and there.

Joey wrote:I would assume he stops demons from being summoned around terra...otherwise they would have just summoned there

You'd have to get cultists there first to summon them. That is quite difficult, ask Horus about how hard it was when it was much less well defended.

The emperor couldn't take on a chaos god... be could barley defeat Horus.
I think his power is being exaggerated if he when into the warp he would get stomped by the chaos gods.

khaosspacemarines wrote:The emperor couldn't take on a chaos god... be could barley defeat Horus.
I think his power is being exaggerated if he when into the warp he would get stomped by the chaos gods.

The Emperor has had 10 thousand years and trillions of followers worshipping him since then. Gods, in 40k, are powered by worship.

This is the state of the Emperor the Chaos gods were actually afraid of, and the reason they started the Heresy to begin with. However, the Emperor ended up getting stuck in the throne instead of being free to deal with them. So they won anyway.

PS, there was no barely about it in the Horus fight. The Emperor refused to defend himself and let Horus do whatever he wanted. At the end, he attacked Horus one time and obliterated him. Horus, had free reign over a defenseless Emperor and couldn't finish him off.

khaosspacemarines wrote:The emperor couldn't take on a chaos god... be could barley defeat Horus.
I think his power is being exaggerated if he when into the warp he would get stomped by the chaos gods.

He didn't barely defeat Horus.

He was still convinced that Horus could be redeemed and such was holding back. It wasn't till he was mortally wounded that he snuffed Horus out like a candle.

And he didn't just kill horus, he erased his very soul.


Being in a physical body actually constricts your psychic abilities, so the Emperor's abilities are muted by his physical body. He has also been absorbing 1000 psykers a day for the last 10,000 years, each increasing his power.

So he has absorbed around 3,650,000,000 psykers(3.65 biillion) throughout the history of the imperium.

That is far more then he was originally made up of, so his power has increased several million times.

Grey Templar wrote:

khaosspacemarines wrote:The emperor couldn't take on a chaos god... be could barley defeat Horus.
I think his power is being exaggerated if he when into the warp he would get stomped by the chaos gods.

He didn't barely defeat Horus.

He was still convinced that Horus could be redeemed and such was holding back. It wasn't till he was mortally wounded that he snuffed Horus out like a candle.

And he didn't just kill horus, he erased his very soul.


Being in a physical body actually constricts your psychic abilities, so the Emperor's abilities are muted by his physical body. He has also been absorbing 1000 psykers a day for the last 10,000 years, each increasing his power.

So he has absorbed around 3,650,000,000 psykers(3.65 biillion) throughout the history of the imperium.

That is far more then he was originally made up of, so his power has increased several million times.

As I recall the psyker sacrifice is simply to keep the Astronomicon operating. Not to feed the emprah, so its not like hes all buff now because of it

thakabalpuphorsefishguy wrote:

Grey Templar wrote:

khaosspacemarines wrote:The emperor couldn't take on a chaos god... be could barley defeat Horus.
I think his power is being exaggerated if he when into the warp he would get stomped by the chaos gods.

He didn't barely defeat Horus.

He was still convinced that Horus could be redeemed and such was holding back. It wasn't till he was mortally wounded that he snuffed Horus out like a candle.

And he didn't just kill horus, he erased his very soul.


Being in a physical body actually constricts your psychic abilities, so the Emperor's abilities are muted by his physical body. He has also been absorbing 1000 psykers a day for the last 10,000 years, each increasing his power.

So he has absorbed around 3,650,000,000 psykers(3.65 biillion) throughout the history of the imperium.

That is far more then he was originally made up of, so his power has increased several million times.

As I recall the psyker sacrifice is simply to keep the Astronomicon operating. Not to feed the emprah, so its not like hes all buff now because of it

Yes, but it doesn't consume their souls. And he then absorbes them upon death, assimilating them into his conciousness.

Sanctioned Psykers and Navigators also get absorbed by him because of the Soul Binding procedure.

thakabalpuphorsefishguy wrote:
As I recall the psyker sacrifice is simply to keep the Astronomicon operating. Not to feed the emprah, so its not like hes all buff now because of it

You are correct. He's all buff because of his trillions of worshippers.

where did you guys read that about him becoming a god through worship ? It does not make sense.... if that is how you become a god then why did he punish lorgan and the word bearers for worshipping him ?

How does a mortal become a god ? I dont think you can

Even the fire dragon on mars which is commonly mistaken for the omissah was a c'tan or a daemon of tzeench - not a god....though the mechanicus were correct in the emperor being the omissah IMHO as he imprisoned the dragon on mars to make sure the dragon made the mechanicum

The emperor had it all planned out

sumi808 wrote:where did you guys read that about him becoming a god through worship ? It does not make sense.... if that is how you become a god then why did he punish lorgan and the word bearers for worshipping him ?

How does a mortal become a god ? I dont think you can

Even the fire dragon on mars which is commonly mistaken for the omissah was a c'tan or a daemon of tzeench - not a god....though the mechanicus were correct in the emperor being the omissah IMHO as he imprisoned the dragon on mars to make sure the dragon made the mechanicum

The emperor had it all planned out

First off, its the Void Dragon. and its a C'tan.


And the worship the Emperor does indeed make him a god.

The Emperor punished Lorgar because, for the time being, mankind needed to be secular so as to squash the worship of chaos. If the Emperor allowed himself to be worshipped it could inadvertantly strengthen the Chaos gods.

Once he had sealed them off completely and made mankind safe from them he may have allowed himself to be worshipped. Of course since things never got that far we can't say for certain.

The Emperor didn't handle Lorgar very well, or the other Primarchs for that matter. It would have been better if he had been completely honest.

The idea that the emperor could become a god is speculation. The idea that he could become a god that could hope to rival even one chaos god is next to impossible. Not with the way the IoM acts.

Then why are they scared of him?

Because the IOM has a great PR department

The Emperor may not be a literal god per se, just a very powerful analogue to a daemon (because of the sheer amount of worship, the perception of power, etc. he has) He might be seen as an avatar for the whatever racial soul (I loved that term from Path of the Renegade) which could lead to the actual creation of the human god (which is perhaps still 'sleeping' - it hasn't reached critical mass yet so to speak.)

Chaos might not fear the Emperor for being an actual god so much that he is the instrument through which the Emperor tries to birth a new, human god. Hell they might fear that if it goes wrong and becomes a fifth chaos god (as speculated) it might still be dangerous to them (Just having it be born does not mean it neccesarily means good things for the Imperium, after all.) I mean if the Eldar are trying to create a new more powerful Eldar god to topple Slaanesh, couldn't the Emperor be trying to do the same thing? (call it Plan B)

It's a really messy topic to deal with because a great deal of the 'logic' relies on older fluff which is still kind of true, but the ways in which it might or might still apply for 'modern' fluff is something people are bound to disagree on, and modern fluff really hasn't addressed it in any great detail.

Grey Templar wrote:Then why are they scared of him?

Are they? Maybe when he was alive and had a chance, but he is dead now and the IoM has devolved into a nation of war, decadence and a bunch of other things that feed chaos.

He's not dead. His physical body is just chained to the Golden Throne.

He is still the "Anathema" to the Warp. They are very frightened of him.

I've said it before and i'll say it again (as Ctan are also Anathema to the warp and people keep claiming that hitting one with a pyschic power ought to make them implode, cos it's Warp, right...? ).

Anathema =/= Antimatter.

It just means they really don't like each other, not that they will explode if they touch each other.


Anathema (from Koine Greek ἀνάθεμα[1] "something dedicated, especially dedicated to evil” from ἀνατίθημι anatithēmi, "I set upon, offer as a votive gift") originally meant something lifted up as an offering to the gods; it later evolved to mean:
1.to be formally set apart;
2.banished, exiled, excommunicated;
3.denounced, sometimes accursed


In one meaning of the word he would be a sacrifice to them

Grey Templar, thanks for the reply you addressed my points directly and your answers make alot of sense given the fluff and hh books. The more i think about it the more it makes sense because horus himself in the second official hh book told his remembrancer on his death bed that each of the primarchs was made to represent some aspect of the emperor himself.

20 primarchs fused together = 1 emperor hehe ;p

That being said, one legion and primarch had religious tendencies... maybe that gives us a hint at part of the emperors desires to become a god to defend humanity - as mentioned in mechanicum by the guardians of the dragon

Yes, I have formulated a theory as to the Emperors original plan.


He had no objections to being mankinds god, however his primary wish was for mankind to be safe. And as long as Chaos existed this wouldn't be possable.

So, knowing that Chaos thrives on the worship of itself and negative emotions, he devised a plan to kill Chaos.

The first part of this plan was to make mankind completely secular. This was accomplished by him uniting humanity with the Imperial Creed and purging all dissentors(who would obviously be empowering Chaos)

With Mankind no longer feeding Chaos he would now have to eliminate their other sources of power, which meant he would have to destroy every other race in the universe.

Finally, he would need to make mankind no longer reliant on the Warp. You can't exactly travel in the same realm as ravenous gods if you are trying to destroy them(or at least cut them off)

To do this he planned to shift mankind's intersteller travel over to the Webway, obviously at the same time as killing off the Eldar.


Once all this was accomplished, Chaos would be completely cut off from its power source(the Chaos Gods were formed by the emotions of mortals, presumably they remain in existance by the same power) and slowely the Chaos Gods would dissolve away.

At this point the Emperor could be openly worshipped. And he would, with his supreme power, be able to swat down any new entities forming within the Warp before they had a chance to fully materialize. It took thousands of years for each of the Gods to form, plenty of time for the Emperor to destroy them as they formed again.

And because mankind isn't as psychic as the Eldar there wouldn't be a risk of something like the birth of Slannesh happening again, this time to humans, too fast for the Emperor to stop it.


Quite a clever plan actually. And he would have succeeded if he had let his sons in on his plan. he could have explained it all to them, and maybe allowed Lorgar's worship on the side lines, and the Heresy probably wouldn't have happened.

Grey Templar wrote:

khaosspacemarines wrote:The emperor couldn't take on a chaos god... be could barley defeat Horus.
I think his power is being exaggerated if he when into the warp he would get stomped by the chaos gods.

He didn't barely defeat Horus.

He was still convinced that Horus could be redeemed and such was holding back. It wasn't till he was mortally wounded that he snuffed Horus out like a candle.

And he didn't just kill horus, he erased his very soul.


Being in a physical body actually constricts your psychic abilities, so the Emperor's abilities are muted by his physical body. He has also been absorbing 1000 psykers a day for the last 10,000 years, each increasing his power.

So he has absorbed around 3,650,000,000 psykers(3.65 biillion) throughout the history of the imperium.

That is far more then he was originally made up of, so his power has increased several million times.

If you'd care to read the actual fluff, he was unable to bring his full psychic power to bear against Horus. He didn't hold back physically at all, and he got curb stomped. Then he struck from behind when Horus' attention was elsewhere. And he's been using the power of those psykers to stay alive, so he doesn't have their full power to call upon, even if he stores any power at all.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

Grey Templar wrote:Then why are they scared of him?

Because they're not.

Grey Templar wrote:He's not dead. His physical body is just chained to the Golden Throne.

He is still the "Anathema" to the Warp. They are very frightened of him.

This is what anathema means sir http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anathema . Their GODs I really dont think they are scared of him more like cautious around him

nomotog wrote:The idea that the emperor could become a god is speculation. The idea that he could become a god that could hope to rival even one chaos god is next to impossible. Not with the way the IoM acts.

No, it is fact written into the game material.

DarknessEternal wrote:

nomotog wrote:The idea that the emperor could become a god is speculation. The idea that he could become a god that could hope to rival even one chaos god is next to impossible. Not with the way the IoM acts.

No, it is fact written into the game material.

Source?

Tadashi wrote:

Joey wrote:I would assume he stops demons from being summoned around terra...otherwise they would have just summoned there and finished him off. Instead, they have to get their using conventional means, which is pretty tricky. They can't even take Cadia...[/quote
They almost did, last time I looked...

13 tries over 10,000 years and they almost capture it. Within 10,000 they might actually capture Cadia as a whole. Assuming there are 50 billion planets in the galaxy it will only take 1 Quadrillion years to take over the galaxy. 130,000th Black Crusade here we come.

Buttons wrote:

Tadashi wrote:

Joey wrote:I would assume he stops demons from being summoned around terra...otherwise they would have just summoned there and finished him off. Instead, they have to get their using conventional means, which is pretty tricky. They can't even take Cadia...

They almost did, last time I looked...

13 tries over 10,000 years and they almost capture it. Within 10,000 they might actually capture Cadia as a whole. Assuming there are 50 billion planets in the galaxy it will only take 1 Quadrillion years to take over the galaxy. 130,000th Black Crusade here we come.

Well, first of all, Cadia is on of the most heavily defended planets in the Imperium. Comparing any planet not in the Segmentum Sol to it in regards difficulty to capture is just silly.

Secondly, most of the Black Crusades haven't been aimed at Cadia at all.

Thirdly, they did capture it. GW then changed it when they realised that they'd have to come up with a reason to keep producing Cadian troops and that it would be story progression.