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You mean you do not take out a tomb lord in single combat as a rite of manhood? How odd your people are.

I understand what you're all saying and I'm not implying that the old fluff was better on this particular point (though I personally still like it better) but my point of argument is specifically all about numbers and the use of the term "exhausted" and equivalents. I'll try and put some numbers down:

Let's say that, at the end of the revolt against the C'Tan there were a thousand Necrons remaining (too bored of writing trillions and gazillions again ). Let's say these guys were threatened by the new guys in town, the Eldar, so decided to take a nap, since Eldar were 10 thousand.

A few years later, they wake up, refreshed but a little worn down on numbers. Some Tomb Worlds have been destroyed, some have malfunctioned etc. So there are, say, 800 remaining. These guys, they look around and see the Eldar down to 100 guys. They say cool, but then they see 100 thousand humans, another 10 thousand Tau, countless Orks (nothing changed here ) and a new race, the Nids threatening to eat up everyone. Plus the Warp having a much stronger grip on the universe than it did back then.

So how are the Necrons considered to be in a better shape now than before? At least the old fluff gave a reason (as crappy as it may have sounded back then or even today) for the decision to go into stasis.

Thanks for bearing with me guys, you can tell I am still rooting for the C'Tan!

Hunterindarkness wrote:You mean you do not take out a tomb lord in single combat as a rite of manhood? How odd your people are.

Yes, some races are totally alien to me too.

angelshade00 wrote:So how are the Necrons considered to be in a better shape now than before? At least the old fluff gave a reason (as crappy as it may have sounded back then or even today) for the decision to go into stasis.

Firstly, we have no idea how technologically advanced the Eldar back then. Considering they threatend the Necrons, presumably they were capable of matching the technology of the C'tan to at least some extent. Secondly, their Psychic powers were not restricted as they were then. Thirdly, the Necrons would likely have faced a united Eldar species. In the 41st millenium, the Eldar are far weaker and they are fractured. Same with the Imperium, Orks and Chaos. The Eldar Empire at its height was much more powerful than any faction is in the 41st millenium. Lastly, it's entirely possible that Necron forces that were greatly damaged and needed considerable repair were repaired during by automated systems during their stasis (especially the bigger things like spaceships).

The new background also gives a reason for the decision to go into stasis. You just don't like it.

I agree, they had to deal with a united and much, much more numerous Eldar race, who had if not as good a tech as th4e Necrons damned close. And Orls, do not forget orks, which if I recall where more and likely created by the Old ones and if so much better organized back then.

Going to sleep was a win, win. They lost few numbers over a long proteactecd war, kept the edge and allowed their enemies to fractor or die out. The current setting has few or any races that can match them and no one has enough of a united front to pose a real threat.

The codex just says they were 'weakened'. That certainly can't be meaning their numbers were too low or that would just mean fewer now. Perhaps they had to recharge their batteries.

SomeRandomEvilGuy wrote:
The new background also gives a reason for the decision to go into stasis. You just don't like it.

That's true, I admit.
Also I find the old one a bit more believable, but that's just me I guess.

Hunterindarkness wrote:The current setting has few or any races that can match them and no one has enough of a united front to pose a real threat.

Not even the Necrons

Nemesor Dave wrote:The codex just says they were 'weakened'. That certainly can't be meaning their numbers were too low or that would just mean fewer now. Perhaps they had to recharge their batteries.

I can picture the Overlord watching a small screen where it says:
Warriors battery: 14%
Immortals battery: 21%
Lychguard battery: 28%
Praetorian battery: 6% (damned teleporters take up too much power...)

Time to plug them up...

Well, maybe they got a BSOD at the time of their hibernation...

And the Overlord opened his Task Manager and put an end to the process...

thakabalpuphorsefishguy wrote:

Harriticus wrote:It doesn't make any sense, correct. But Ward needed a way for the Necrons to go to sleep for millions of years while effectively removing the C'tan from the story.

Because it completely drained the necrons, killing all the ctan. The necrons where wisps after that fight and the eldar took the high ground and started stomping the necrons iirc. The necrons had to hide and go into stasis to survive.

'

And in 60 million years the pre fall Eldar could not eradicate the "untold millions" of tomb worlds, instead they got lazy and made the god of porn. Apparently only Alaitoc is the only craftworld that remembers how to fight necrons.... you know besides the fact that craftworlds only came to be before the fall but whatever, its matt ward fluff right? Oh and what the hell were the Eldar doing while they made these tombs?

The Necrons motivation went from "harvest souls for our ever hungry gods" to "get off my lawn while I find new skin bags", which is a shame, because now that leaves only Tyranids with an actual motivation to do anything important in 40k.

Ravenous D wrote:
The Necrons motivation went from "harvest souls for our ever hungry gods" to "get off my lawn while I find new skin bags", which is a shame, because now that leaves only Tyranids with an actual motivation to do anything important in 40k.

Thank you so much.

Well the Daemon codex screwed Chaos because their motivation went from "taking over the material realm and get more followers" to the eternal game bullcrap. The chaos gods went from scary to stupid in an instant.

Dark Eldar just want slaves so they are just kind of there, like the common cold.

Necrons are pretty much neutral now, ancient evil and soulless hunger is replaced with angst.

The imperium just defends itself in unending war, they dont really do anything.

The Eldar float around waiting to die, in the meanwhile they are the universal trolls.

Tau are... well Tau, they have a tiny system that can get blinked out with any effort, they exist only because no one cares.

Tyranids want to kill and eat everyone, NOW that is motivation.

Orks are like Russel Crowe Fightin' around the world! Ever present but more of a nusance.

Ultimately in the end there is no evil threat in 40k, Dark Eldar are the only truely evil race but they have no goals other then to quench their thrist. So everyone just kind of muddys about until the Tyranids eat them.... and the Nid codex sucks so *shurg*.

Ravenous D wrote:Well the Daemon codex screwed Chaos because their motivation went from "taking over the material realm and get more followers" to the eternal game bullcrap. The chaos gods went from scary to stupid in an instant.

Dark Eldar just want slaves so they are just kind of there, like the common cold.

Necrons are pretty much neutral now, ancient evil and soulless hunger is replaced with angst.

The imperium just defends itself in unending war, they dont really do anything.

The Eldar float around waiting to die, in the meanwhile they are the universal trolls.

Tau are... well Tau, they have a tiny system that can get blinked out with any effort, they exist only because no one cares.

Tyranids want to kill and eat everyone, NOW that is motivation.

Orks are like Russel Crowe Fightin' around the world! Ever present but more of a nusance.

Ultimately in the end there is no evil threat in 40k, Dark Eldar are the only truely evil race but they have no goals other then to quench their thrist. So everyone just kind of muddys about until the Tyranids eat them.... and the Nid codex sucks so *shurg*.

for the Eldar!

I see it now!!!

Netsurfer733 wrote:I finished reading the Necron codex a little while ago, and one change to their lore rubs me the wrong way, in particular.

Instead of the Enslavers specifically being the ones pointed out to have sent them into their tombs, they specifically point out that it was the *Eldar* for seemingly entirely no reason at all. I mean...if they have the numbers they do today, AND they were able to get around the Eldar and kill their creators (Old Ones) all those millenia ago, how the heck was this change in the war warranted? I know the old version might have implied the Enslavers had wiped out the rest of the Eldar to, but one could say with great ease that the Eldar would have largely escaped into the Webway and stayed there for many ages to survive.

So the question is, how does it make sense the Eldar could have driven them ALL back after the Necrons defeated the old ones AND what purpose does it serve for the sake of the game or lore to have written out the Enslavers?

Even if they killed the old ones, trapped their C'tan gods. They would be weak for a period of time. Whilst the eldar was strong. I remember reading about how given time flesh will die and the plan was to just let the eldar die out over time. As necrons do not get affected by time as badly as those of flesh races.

Just makes me sad that this page is now so, so wrong.... http://wh40k.lexicanum.com/wiki/Enslaver#.T6CI1etSTRU

angelshade00 wrote:I understand what you're all saying and I'm not implying that the old fluff was better on this particular point (though I personally still like it better) but my point of argument is specifically all about numbers and the use of the term "exhausted" and equivalents. I'll try and put some numbers down:

Let's say that, at the end of the revolt against the C'Tan there were a thousand Necrons remaining (too bored of writing trillions and gazillions again ). Let's say these guys were threatened by the new guys in town, the Eldar, so decided to take a nap, since Eldar were 10 thousand.

A few years later, they wake up, refreshed but a little worn down on numbers. Some Tomb Worlds have been destroyed, some have malfunctioned etc. So there are, say, 800 remaining. These guys, they look around and see the Eldar down to 100 guys. They say cool, but then they see 100 thousand humans, another 10 thousand Tau, countless Orks (nothing changed here ) and a new race, the Nids threatening to eat up everyone. Plus the Warp having a much stronger grip on the universe than it did back then.

So how are the Necrons considered to be in a better shape now than before? At least the old fluff gave a reason (as crappy as it may have sounded back then or even today) for the decision to go into stasis.

Thanks for bearing with me guys, you can tell I am still rooting for the C'Tan!

Hunterindarkness wrote:You mean you do not take out a tomb lord in single combat as a rite of manhood? How odd your people are.

Yes, some races are totally alien to me too.

The Necrons have millions of worlds in stasis per the codex. If anything they have the largest army in the galaxy rivaling even the orkz. So your analogy would be more like 800 waking up with 5 million asleep and slowly waking up.

Except they don't know how many sub combed to natural or unnatural disasters, or suffer from ( memory wipes, Destroyer afflictions, the Flayed Disease, etc.). Any united Necron Phaeron, now has to deal with a fractured civilization to lead and/or an army of unknown size and resources.

because they are (TOMB KINGS IN SPACE!!!!!!!!!!!!)

The Necrons possess the ability to transfer the consciousness of a Necron soldier from one destroyed necrodermis shell to another. The sentient ones (Lords, Overlords, Deathmarks, etc) that phase out might get a brand-new body, rather than fix the old one. The old body will just be broken down into energy by scarabs and used to create more necrodermis or whatever else the Tomb needs.

Since the Warriors are all but mindless, this effectively means that they can probably replicate the same Necron Warrior a few thousand, to million, times. This isn't quite the same thing as reproduction, but it's pretty close. This may even be happening on certain, as-yet-unactivated Tomb Worlds.

Lucre wrote:Can someone write a letter to mister ward about if there are still enslavers or not?

Trazyn has the ossified husk of an enslaver in his collection so Mr Ward clearly knows about them as he put them in one of his new characters info page.

I really don't get the problem with the new necron fluff. Yes there are changes but most of the old history was written long before several of the current races had been created and the whole thing was a lot more silly. Ice planet Hoth for example, and a dark hellish planet called Birmingham. Now the necrons have a much bigger, better, more diverse culture as well as background and we don't have the problem of C'tan in the game when they should be so powerful that they can eat stars!!!


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Also according to the old enslaver fluff shouldn't the eldar, orks and all the other creations of the old ones (including those primitive ape like creatures) have been wiped out whilst the necrons slept? The new fluff makes the 40k universe much better imo.

However you can't please everyone all the time. Some people would complain if you gave them lots of money with no catch!

Eh, irt the Lexicanum page, delete the first paragraph, and they remain as much of a threat as they've ever been.