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Brothererekose wrote:How does he by-pass 2+ ? The only two things in the Tau FAQ about him are that he is now a Jet-packer and he meets the HQ 1+. Since he has a power toy, sword, I guess, then his toy is AP3.”

It’s not a power weapon it’s more a MC hybrid weapon that bypass 2+ and armor on 2D6. That’s why I thank he is better. His squad can take power weapon hits due to 2+ but he can hurt 2+ enemy modules. Put a Farsight squad against a squad with 1 or 2 power weapons and Farsight should win.
My plan is to use a 2nd Shas’o with him with 2+armor and if needed the Shas’o can challenge the enemy power weapon IC leaving Farsight safe. That way you can give the Farsight squad hit and run so you are not stuck in CC have a 4wound model with 2+save and FNP to absorb hits. I think we are having a misunderstanding I did not mean Farsight standing alone is one of the best. I mean him in a squad is now one of the best due to all the new fun stuff you can do. Stick him in a Stealth squad and gain 2+ cover saves and still have jetpack moving. As before give the squad hit and run so you can rapid fire plasma and flame every turn before charging into CC again to finished squads and if you misjudge just hit and run on I5 to get out of combat. Farsight also runs down on I5 making him better then before.

Brothererekose wrote: “MathHammering, with out charges, Pain Tokens or Combat Drugs:
Round 1
4 Girls swing 3 times each, get 6 hits. 3 wound. FS makes 1.5 Invulns; Let's be favorable and say he makes two, taking just one wound.
He swings. Hits > twice. Wounds < Twice. One girl dies (if she has a Pain Token for FNP, this improves her chances, but let's leave that out).
Round 2
Remaining 3 chicks swing again; 5 hits (balancing the odds from round 1). > 2.5 wounds. FS will likely take two wounds, balancing Round 1.
He lost combat, but passes Morale.
He'll bag another girl, while the two of them will deal his final wound.”

The Way I see that battle going is the girls bounce of the 2+ armor with FNP Farsight squads does the most wounds running them down if possible (I do not know dark elder well not played new codex) if CC still goes on round 2 Farsight does hit and run on I5 then users rapid fire plasma and flamers from squad before charging in CC again if needed. The key is each battlesuits gets 2 plasma and 1 flamer hit before CC and if anyone chargers Farsight. focues on shooting but finish of with CC thats my plan. Done is so far on Ork and Necrons well.Farsight can even charge in and baet up a dreadnought without to much problem.

Pottsey wrote:
What if you factor in the 2+ saves and flamers we have?
You are overestimating the price more like 500points not 800 and if you go for the cheap option of twin link flamers with blacksun much cheaper.
I don’t know Elder that well but so far it’s worked on Necrons, Orks and Blood Angels. You soften everything up on the way in with shooting and choose what to assault due to your high mobility. You also didn’t seem to take into account flamers which will kill a ton of Elder. If you think the target can out assault you don’t assault, keep shooting and using cover. You don’t charge a fully kitted out seer council you wait till a few have been killed by shooting and you odds are in your side.

Now you just seem to not be discussing in good Faith.

You have described a squad that has around 4- 5 crisis suits outside of Farsight.

Then you have the bodyguard taking Twin-link Plas AND Twin-Link Flamer??

You also have them taking all of the expensive Special Issue Wargear

Then Your adding in a 150-185 point Shas'o.

A single basic Shas'vre bodyguard with TL plas, flamer and shield drones = 99 pts

4X Shas'vre = 396

Add 180 point Shas'o = 576

Add 170 pt Farsight= 746

This doesn't cover the cost of a couple of the wargear items you've mentioned because you have mentioned everything except the ejection system and Blacksun filters.

You could make it less expensive by using a standard crisis team and then add the two HQ's but even then it is more expensive than you are saying and can't take all of the gear you've mentioned.


As to the armies you have been up against?? Can't comment because I don't know the builds they have been using nor the opponent skill level.

Also, you again mentioned high mobility. With the Iridium armour you don't have that much mobility. Until faq'ed by GW you are limited to a D6" assault move, which slows down the entire unit.

As to the flamers and eldar seers, lol. The farseer and his council have a 4+ invulnerable save that is re-rollable when using Fortune.

There are many things that take apart your build here, A full squad of GK using their NFW which makes you roll and if failed suffer insta death. Wraithlords will insta death your 2+ tank.

Lets see, Mind war can take out your 2+ tank that you pin everything on. Remember the 2+ shield drones are pretty easy to take out and after they are gone, one Melta takes your 4 wound tank out of the game. A squad of 160 point squad of Fire dragons with a 160 point squad of banshees will destroy this unit in a single turn.

The Farsight bombs cost and the Tau's lack of CC ability, precludes these lists from having adequate support to prevent it from being double teamed by less expensive yet more efficient units.

Sorry for any confusion I might be cross posting a little and getting confused about what I said in each thread, talking about the same thing in two threads. But I am pretty sure my first post said ideas for a CC squad. Farsight with twin linked plasma and flamers battlesuits with hit and run. I thought that what we are talking about not Farsight standing alone in CC. He is only great with backup and all the new combos we can do. Solo I would not CC him.

“As to the flamers and eldar seers, lol. The farseer and his council have a 4+ invulnerable save that is re-rollable when using Fortune.”
So you are going to get about 5+ dead farseer (1 wound each? Do not know that squad well) assuming 20odd wounds from flamers and rapid fire plasma is that a fair estimate at point blank? around 25% fail to get saved with 4+ rerolls = a large amount farseer’s dead before CC. Then CC to finish off rest. So far the shear amount of wounds has meant all my targets get thinned out massively before CC.

I do not see a Farsight squad as costly; I see it as two squads in one as instead of two squads of 3 suits I now go down to of 1 squad of 5 ish suits.

EDIT
"Add 170 pt Farsight= 746 "
I miss read part of you post, pretty sure my army list had it at under 500points without 2nd HQ which put it just over but at work now have to talk about this later and check when I get home.

Pottsey wrote:So you are going to get about 5+ dead farseer (1 wound each? Do not know that squad well) assuming 20odd wounds from flamers and rapid fire plasma is that a fair estimate at point blank? around 25% fail to get saved with 4+ rerolls = a large amount farseer’s dead before CC. Then CC to finish off rest. So far the shear amount of wounds has meant all my targets get thinned out massively before CC.
.

More like 4 dead warlocks and that is if you have not lost any suits, Most likely, the Eldar would "soften" your Farsight squad up before Assaulting. With all of the AP2 that the Eldar army has and with 7 flamers working on your unit before the charge.?

I've played the Farsight list many times, both sides. Farsight loses to the BT Emperors Champion. The Champion has a challenge ability, were you cannot refuse and the BT player picks which character.

I know this because I've been on the bad end of that challenge.

With how plasma just became king in 6th ed(Pedulum swing) you are going to see lots of the old 4th ed IG/SM Plasma lists return. Thing is, those same armies still field a lot of low AP S8+ weapons on top of the Plasma.


If you running Farsight, he needs to be kept relatively cheap. Stick him and a 121 pt Shas'o in with a 120 point Steath Team that has gun drones. The Whole unit gets a 4+ cover save in the open that acts as 3+ to cover in terrain.

Thats 410 pts and you then spend the rest of the points on units that take advantage of a bullet soak unit that is dancing out in the open.

Btw, I'd love to have you prove this out to me, because then, you know, I'd actually field FS.

Pottsey wrote:

Brothererekose wrote:How does he by-pass 2+ ? The only two things in the Tau FAQ about him are that he is now a Jet-packer and he meets the HQ 1+. Since he has a power toy, sword, I guess, then his toy is AP3.”

It’s not a power weapon it’s more a MC hybrid weapon that bypass 2+.

Could you please cite why the part in orange is valid? Page #, FAQ? All the old codex says is that it "ignores armor". So, okay, it could go as bypassing 2+, but that's not definite. And the 2d6 Pen on vehicles is *not* how 6e MCs hurt vehicles; that changed, but isn't relevant to our discussion of Farsight being 'one of, if not the best' h2h IC.

Pottsey wrote:His squad can take power weapon hits due to 2+ but he can hurt 2+ enemy modules. Put a Farsight squad against a squad with 1 or 2 power weapons and Farsight should win.

I'm not talking about "his squad" -- in this thread, you claimed Farsight was "one of, if not the best" IC in h2h.

And how are they "tak(ing) power weapon hits due to 2+" ?

I ask, nicely.

Brothererekose wrote: “MathHammering, with out charges, Pain Tokens or Combat Drugs:
Round 1
4 Girls swing 3 times each, get 6 hits. 3 wound. FS makes 1.5 Invulns; Let's be favorable and say he makes two, taking just one wound.
He swings. Hits > twice. Wounds < Twice. One girl dies (if she has a Pain Token for FNP, this improves her chances, but let's leave that out).
Round 2
Remaining 3 chicks swing again; 5 hits (balancing the odds from round 1). > 2.5 wounds. FS will likely take two wounds, balancing Round 1.
He lost combat, but passes Morale.
He'll bag another girl, while the two of them will deal his final wound.”

Pottsey wrote:The Way I see that battle going is the girls bounce of the 2+ armor with FNP Farsight squads

Sorry, man. I've looked and can't find out how Farsight (and/or his whole squad) gets FNP and 2+ (armor save?) ? So, the girls won't "bounce off of 2+" because they have power toys and have a 4++ Invuln/Dodge in h2h, same as his Invuln Save.

Just so you know, the Hekatrixes I used for the MathHamer have an Agonizer, a 'power weapon' that ignores armor, so 2+ per our discussion? And agonizers wound on 4+ regardless of Toughness. You might "see it" one way, but the MathHammer odds come out with 4 girls, for about 12 points less (without haywire grenades), beating Farsight in 3 rounds.

Squad-wise? I'll not contest anything there, as I hadn't thought it through.

I think he's giving someone in farsight's entourage stimulant injectors and iridium armor and then making that guy pull "Look out sir!" Either way there is plenty that'll cream farsight and his entourage. Farsight is okay but definitely not one of the best h2h IC's out there.

Brothererekose I really shouldn’t have rushed my posts before work. 2+ was meant to be referring to bypassing 2+ armour not hitting on 2+. You cannot give the whole squad FNP or 2+armor but you can have a member of the squad at the front and perhaps challenge the power weapon guy meaning you are more likely to win combat via most wounds. Hit and run needs a 2nd HQ suit to join which I normally do and reduce the bodyguards by 1.

There are many combat squads that Farsight couldn’t take on before that he can now along with many types of units. A squad with a single or few power weapon in now much less of a threat. He can also take on targets that some other IC cannot hurt like 13armor dreadnoughts. Also I didn’t mean he was the best at CC. I meant he was a CC character who is one of the best characters due to this flexible and all the new stuff he can do which is what I have been trying to explain. As I said before I would never solo him CC and always focus on shooting first and CC to finish off. I think he is one of the best due to the new flexibility and most of the arguments have come from my badly written posts.

Every time he has done well with me it’s because I did 20+wounds in shooting with a Farsight squad before charging into CC to clean up what remains. Now if charged you can do that shooting still.

“You might "see it" one way, but the MathHammer odds come out with 4 girls, for about 12 points less (without haywire grenades), beating Farsight in 3 rounds.”
Until you add in shooting where the girls lose a lot from plasma and flamers doing a ton of wounds and in game if you judge Farsight cannot win in CC you use the high mobility 2D6 move to stay out of CC range and keep shooting ntil you can win in CC. For example I don’t charge that squad of 20+ Orks. You thin the numbers down and then charge. He is just so much more flexible now and the other bonues he gives to the army can be great. EDIT and if you do get stuck in CC and cannot win on round 2 you hit and run at I5. then rapid fire plasma again.

Anyway I apologise for my badly written posts.


EDIT: Does iridium armor still slow suits down? It says the additional 6” move becomes 1D6 but there is no longer an additional 6” move so the negative has nothing to apply to. The FAQ does not say put the negative onto the 2D6 move. Going to remove this item from my army list for now.

As mentioned, tau close combat didn't get better (well, it did a little, what with suits gaining heroic intervention), but tau as a whole got better with assault getting much worse.

If you played tau in 5th, look for a nice bump in 6th. 6th ed will likely play out a lot more like 4th ed, and tau were brutal in 4th. This will be doubly-true as tau have a pretty old codex, and so are rather likely to get a new one vaguely soon.

tau do not really need or want a melee boost, it is not the tau way to kill in h2h.

We have had a massive boost to range combat with overwatch and the like, so a lack of melee capability is not really a big issue.

Farsight is pretty decent at melee, but it would be cheaper and much more effective to kit out your army for ranged combat. Farsight just butchers your foc, so he is not worth the trouble

Pottsey wrote:[Brothererekose I really shouldn’t have rushed my posts before work. 2+ was meant to be referring to bypassing 2+ armour not hitting on 2+. You cannot give the whole squad FNP or 2+armor

Okay, thank you for acknowledging your invalid claims on FS's CC status. (it sounds kinda patronizing, but it wasn't meant to be)

Pottsey wrote: As I said before I would never solo him CC and always focus on shooting first and CC to finish off. I think he is one of the best due to the new flexibility and most of the arguments have come from my badly written posts.

Now, *this* claim I can get behind.

Pottsey wrote:Until you add in shooting where the ... He is just so much more flexible now and the other bonues he gives to the army can be great.

Well, of course. Add tau shooting in and you're back to talking about great units. And now that 6e has brought shooting to be a far deadlier mechanic with Focus Fire, weaker Cover Save (FireStorm just stepped back behind the FK!), OW, etc, yes, Farsight *and a full crew* are going to be a pretty good threat.

I'm going to have to explore (think through) the Challenge aspect though. Yesterday's game had a prolonged Challenge keep 2 bikers, 7 Plague Marines and my Chaos Dread on Cheering "GO get 'im sir!" duty for 3 or 4 rounds of h2h. Enemy Chaos Sorcerer and my sorcerer kept making Invuln Saves. Oy. Finally nailed him with a Force Wep Instant Death, though!

Pottsey wrote: EDIT and if you do get stuck in CC and cannot win on round 2 you hit and run at I5. then rapid fire plasma again.

If we're gonna throw in that stuff, there's a whole plethora of extra odds calculations with the other 8 wyches, the Pain Token for FNP, and then a few options of Combat Drugs to be considered, but I think we, you and I, are now nicely resolved on the discussion.

Pottsey wrote:Anyway I apologise for my badly written posts.

Cheers.

Pottsey wrote:EDIT: Does iridium armor still slow suits down? It says the additional 6” move becomes 1D6 but there is no longer an additional 6” move so the negative has nothing to apply to. The FAQ does not say put the negative onto the 2D6 move. Going to remove this item from my army list for now.

The add'l move *is* there, though just in different language (at least, so it reads to me). So, I'd advise, yes, toss Irid for now on any guy in Farsight's DeathStar.

Thanks for hanging in there, Pottsey and clarifying your point(s).

Cheers.

Pottsey wrote:

Greenskinchris wrote:I played tau in 5th edition and they were great, until they got to close combat, in which, if you didn't know, they sucked. I haven't got the 6th edition rulebook yet, it should be delivered now, and I was wondering if they have had an upgrade?

A fair few improvements as Tau now have arguable the best or one of the best CC special characters in the game. On top of with overwatch it means if someone charges a battlesuit then the battlesuits get free shots at the chargers. Take a battlesuit with flamers and twin plasma and that’s D3 auto flamer hits and plasma twin linked rapid fire at BS 1 against anything that trys to CC us. We can now give 1 single unit hit and run and you use the highest initiative in a squad for fall back/rundown so drones double us to initiative 4.

I have a few ideas for a CC battlesuit squad.

are you trolling? the best special character in close combat? i assume you mean farsight. have you looked at a blood angels, ork, eldar, dark eldar, space marine, or literally ANY other codex?


Automatically Appended Next Post:

n0t_u wrote:It's a valid discussion, the codex does have a few that fight better in combat than a wet newspaper; Crisis suits being one of them. While not a dedicated melee unit per se, they weren't automatically destroyed if they happened to get into combat with something like a squad of Necron Warriors; in fact they probably would have won that fight . I doubt they get the bonus attacks though and besides Farsight they'd still much prefer just shooting instead. It's not like we're talking about Firewarriors...

I guess it's just impossible to avoid threads we don't like for some reason.

they have low leadership, low WS and low initiative. i had a 250 pt unit of crisis suits get eaten by an 85 point unit of genestealers. using suits for CC is moronic.

phoenixrisin wrote:are you trolling? the best special character in close combat? i assume you mean farsight. have you looked at a blood angels, ork, eldar, dark eldar, space marine, or literally ANY other codex?

Dude, didja finish the whole thread? I already took Pottsey to task on this and he altered his claim. You all been ninja'd!

phoenixrisin wrote:

Pottsey wrote:

Greenskinchris wrote:I played tau in 5th edition and they were great, until they got to close combat, in which, if you didn't know, they sucked. I haven't got the 6th edition rulebook yet, it should be delivered now, and I was wondering if they have had an upgrade?

A fair few improvements as Tau now have arguable the best or one of the best CC special characters in the game. On top of with overwatch it means if someone charges a battlesuit then the battlesuits get free shots at the chargers. Take a battlesuit with flamers and twin plasma and that’s D3 auto flamer hits and plasma twin linked rapid fire at BS 1 against anything that trys to CC us. We can now give 1 single unit hit and run and you use the highest initiative in a squad for fall back/rundown so drones double us to initiative 4.

I have a few ideas for a CC battlesuit squad.

are you trolling? the best special character in close combat? i assume you mean farsight. have you looked at a blood angels, ork, eldar, dark eldar, space marine, or literally ANY other codex?


Automatically Appended Next Post:

n0t_u wrote:It's a valid discussion, the codex does have a few that fight better in combat than a wet newspaper; Crisis suits being one of them. While not a dedicated melee unit per se, they weren't automatically destroyed if they happened to get into combat with something like a squad of Necron Warriors; in fact they probably would have won that fight . I doubt they get the bonus attacks though and besides Farsight they'd still much prefer just shooting instead. It's not like we're talking about Firewarriors...

I guess it's just impossible to avoid threads we don't like for some reason.

they have low leadership, low WS and low initiative. i had a 250 pt unit of crisis suits get eaten by an 85 point unit of genestealers. using suits for CC is moronic.

Surly genestealers charging the CC build suits I mentioned would end up with a lot of the genestealers dead and most likely causing the genestealers to fail to even get into combat. I do not see genestealers as much of a threat anymore as its very unlikely they will even get into CC and if they do not have the numbers to do much harm.

Pottesy, would you please post a list of Farsight's crew as you would field them? I'll crunch some MathHammer numbers versus wyches and GS. Maybe some light can be shed?

Something like:
FS
XV8s:
1. A FK+
2. A helios
3 & 4. Deathrains
5 & 6. Firestorms with TA
7. Burning Blade

or whichever. Drones too, if ya like.

Brothererekose wrote:Pottesy, would you please post a list of Farsight's crew as you would field them? I'll crunch some MathHammer numbers versus wyches and GS. Maybe some light can be shed?

Something like:
FS
XV8s:
1. A FK+
2. A helios
3 & 4. Deathrains
5 & 6. Firestorms with TA
7. Burning Blade

or whichever. Drones too, if ya like.

Wyches might do it like I said before I have never faced a Dark Elder army. As for genestealers I figured the Tau army will get 1 or 2 turns of shooting at them then overwatch shots for what remains of the genestealers that charge.
I was thinking of something like

x1 Farsight
x1 battlesuits with detonator so you can fall back without being wiped out and do damage.
x3 battlesuits with either twin flamer and plasma or twin plasma and flamer not sure which is best. Multitrackers.

Possibly another HQ Shaso joining Farsight with the having 2+armor and shield drones or no 2+ armor and no drones but FNP and hit and run, but I bet you are better off with 2 or 3 more bodyguards over this. I am also playing with the idea of Farsight in a Stealth Suit squad.

A way cheaper option is to use Elite suits with just twin flamers that’s only 272points. But I think the plasma makes the squad more flexible as you can try to move inside 24” fire then jump out repeat until squad is weak enough to CC.

In 5th Edition I used a 564 point squad

x1 Farsight
x5 suits bodyguards with twin linked missiles and target array. 1 suit had detonator pack. 1 suit had Iridium armor with x2 shield drones. I equip them all with Blacksun filters as I face Necrons a lot.

The rest of the army was 9 more suits split over 3 Elite squads all missile pods twin linked with target arrays and x2 gun drones per squad, 1 rail hammerhead and 3 squads of fire warriors. 1500points army.

Not sure MathHammer can fully do it as there is no easy way to factor in mobility and long range fire power before CC. MathHammer says I should have lost last game with the army above against Orks and Necrons. But mobility and long range fire power thinned down the squads as I moved forward until I charged into CC.

Farsight would get smacked by TH/SS termies. Ignore his armor and instant death, plus 3++.


Or any dedicated CC unit

Saw "Tau" and "melee" together, came for the lolz.

I should start a thread, "Nid Vehicle Dilemma"

Ok, heres my 2 cents.

Overwatch is brilliant. I take Plasma+missile+MT and Plasma+burst cannon+MT on my two crisis teams at 1.5k and a commander with an ion blaster and plasma, and for me, overwatch is great. Stuff charging your crisis teams from 8-12" away has a pretty small chance of getting into combat, and I get to fire at it, even at BS1, when those loadouts hit, they hit hard. Against units like thunderwolves and such that absolutely wreck face, killing the front man means that their charge range is reduced, and suddenly theyre not in, yay! Also remember that before you say that the 2d6 charge means its more likely to get a charge, fleet is different, so those units that before were only charging 6" were also gaining another 1-6 from fleet, but not anymore, yay!

Fire warriors on overwatch are surprisingly good, 24 shots from a 12 man team can knock a wound or two off lone characters or a few orks or nids

Also the frontmen dying is a dream come true, despite lookout sir shenanigans

Also just read about the farsight thing. No.

Farsight is rubbish in my opinion. Hes an expensive model with less firepower than a regular commander who still gets battered in CC by anyone who isnt another tau or a guardian

Im trying to figure out how I can use TL Plasma with Flamer and MT

Pottsey wrote:x1 Farsight
x5 suits bodyguards with twin linked missiles and target array. 1 suit had detonator pack. 1 suit had Iridium armor with x2 shield drones. I equip them all with Blacksun filters as I face Necrons a lot.

So, FS and 6 Deathrains?

Pottsey wrote:Not sure MathHammer can fully do it as there is no easy way to factor in mobility and long range fire power before CC. MathHammer says I should have lost last game with the army above against Orks and Necrons. But mobility and long range fire power thinned down the squads as I moved forward until I charged into CC.

"MathHammer" is using dice odds, given the models' stats and calculating outcomes. You can't MathHammer whole armies ... not unless you're Sheldon Cooper or RainMan.

Now, there *is* way to factor in long range shooting before CC.

1. Raider gets shot down, but a unit that is *not* FS and crew; 9 wyches bail out and hide behind it, praying for Cover Saves and FNP to save their butts. They will have FNP, because almost no one runs a wyche unit without a Haem supporting with Pain Token. When FS and crew shoot them up they'll get wiped out. No contest, Pottsey.

But that isn't what I've been on all along. I know *you* have, but you gotta consider that second raider that didn't get shot down.

2. Raider moves up, girls get out and assault FS and his *6* deathrains. Let's say the girls don't bother shooting their pistols (which would yield 9 shots, 6 hit, 3 wound, 1 failed save).
a. OW: 12 TL- MP shots, and FS's 2 PRs. Needing s for OverWatch, 2 out of those 12 will come up , but then you re-roll the other 10 for Twin-Linked MPs, getting two more, thus 4 MPs will hit. Let's Say FS gets one. All wound. ~3 to 4 girls die because FNP saves < 2.
b. Girls swing at Init 6. At least 3 each, at say 5 girls out of the original 9. 4 Agonizers, 12 other swings, all hitting on 3s. That'll be more than 2 agonizer hits and 8 other hits. One Ag wound and <3 others, as the girls need 5s to wound. Another failed wound (odds).
c. Suits swing back. 12 from the Crisis Suits and FS swings 4 times. 6 hits from them and 2 from him given the WS. He'll wound 2, they'll wound 4 or 5 times given their STR and wychs' Toughness. Girls will make 3 Dodges, fail 3 or 4. And 2 or 3 will die as FNP might save one or two.

Girls have lost. One Crisis Suit might have died if girls shot their pistols (one wound from shooting and the other from Combat, page 25, allocating wounds to the wounded models). Morale check at minus 2 or 3. Leadership check at 6 or 7.

Things not factored in:
1. FS and his 6 Deathrain crew weigh in at 258 plus Farsight's points. Over 400.
2. Nine girls, with their Hekazgonizer cost 138 (haywires, too). If we balance out the points, that is, make it *3* units of wyches assaulting, with the same points weight ... you'll now get an idea of just how fragile FS is in h2h. That's a lot more power wep hits from girls, and we've no Shield Drones in this sample, so a lot more wounds taken on tau. The Crisis team will lose combat by around 3 to 4 wounds. They might not make FS leadership, and they aren't likely to get swept given his high Init. But next round they'll lose again, and having 400+ points tied up in h2h royally hurts tau.
3. What if a hekatrix challenges FS?

Throw in Combat Drugs - either more attacks, 1 higher STR, or re-roll to wound, and wyches will finish *anything* tau can throw at 'em.

Pottsey, I'm not discounting tau shooting. If tau can shoot 'em first, the DE are dead. If the tau get in h2h first, the opposite (point for point).

I'd love to hear off and on, via PM, how your Farsight cadre fairs with the other guys you play.

20 months since the new DE book, and you *still* haven't played against them? How small is the pond you play in?



Automatically Appended Next Post:

Talamare wrote:Im trying to figure out how I can use TL Plasma with Flamer and MT

Team Leader for access to a hard-wired MT? Or is that not what you meant?

Brothererekose wrote:

Talamare wrote:Im trying to figure out how I can use TL Plasma with Flamer and MT

Team Leader for access to a hard-wired MT? Or is that not what you meant?

Its pretty much what I meant but at most that would only cover 1 suit

Bodyguard Squad would work as well but increases the point cost by 10-15 points and you can only bring 2 (not 3)


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Never Math Hammer in game

Dice God smack the Math Hammer

Okay lets see, I have a rerollable +2 save on this T6 FNP model, and youre shooting me with a single conscript lasgun (99.9% of surviving)

... Double 6 followed by Triple 1...

*flips table*

Why are we even talking abou Tau in close combat? Why would you waste so many points on a close combat unit for an army that has devastating amounts of shooting firepower? Your 594 point farsight squad coul be spend on things like broadsides and more crisis suits, which is going to be more effective overall.

The thing about farsight is he lacks synergy with the rest of the Tau codex. Sure, he may be pretty good in close combat with a squad backing him, but taking out 594 points where they can be spent on more guns is an awful waste. You have to look at things from a force multiplying perspective. All those points that are spent making sure farsight can handle things like genestealers and wyches could have been spent in other places that would have been able to kill two of those squads at the same time as it took farsight to kill the one.

Perhaps the worst part about farsight is that he limits your force organization! Losing out on those broadside squads is just on more deterent.

Now, with all that being said, I would personally play with him if I played tau. We imperial guard players have straken, which is like farsight (actually not bad in CC but in an army that mostly is bad at it) but even he can at least synergize with the rest of the army by giving furious charge to units around him. Coupled with the fact that those units around him weren't (blobs got a little worse in this edition) that bad at CC either.

I just don't see a reason to take him.

Talamare wrote:Never Math Hammer in game

Dice God smack the Math Hammer

I totally agree. Sometimes you can almost see the dice with its one-eyed middle finger up at you.

Ignatius wrote:
Now, with all that being said, I would personally play with him if I played tau. We imperial guard players have straken, which is like farsight (actually not bad in CC but in an army that mostly is bad at it) but even he can at least synergize with the rest of the army by giving furious charge to units around him. Coupled with the fact that those units around him weren't (blobs got a little worse in this edition) that bad at CC either.

I just don't see a reason to take him.

You want a reason???.....

Join Farsight to a 8 strong Gundrone squadron. Maybe add another Crisis Commander just to boost the squads shooting ability.

From there build as normal of a list as you can.

Just an idea

focusedfire wrote:

Ignatius wrote:I just don't see a reason to take him.

You want a reason???.....

Join Farsight to a 8 strong Gundrone squadron. Maybe add another Crisis Commander just to boost the squads shooting ability.

From there build as normal of a list as you can.

Just an idea

A bad one, FF?

One: can FS dump his retinue? And what's the point of taking FS, if not for the 7 suit bodyguard?
Two: joining 8 GDs means T3 for all?

Maybe there's sarcasm I'm not picking up from the text.

I play tau and i have yet to get the new rulebook as well. And even if we don't get an upgrade, I have something to say:
Tau. Yeah, we suck at melee. To bad you'll never get there (unless you can deep strike or have a jump pack).

LoganWolfborn wrote:I play tau and i have yet to get the new rulebook as well. And even if we don't get an upgrade, I have something to say:
Tau. Yeah, we suck at melee. To bad you'll never get there (unless you can deep strike or have a jump pack).

Or have flyers