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I'm gonna punch him telling "LEAVE ELDRAD ALONE"

I agree on the Eldrad front. If you are taking only one Eldrad instead of 2 farseers... maybe he won't see that as too overpowering? To be fair to your friend, he might not know what he's asking. Does he realize you are playing a very old codex? Does he realize he's asking you to spend 50-80 points more for the same abilities? How would he feel if you asked him not to play lootas because they are too powerful, and because you don't have ANY strength 7 shooting in your book?

At the end of the day... you sort of need access to Eldrad in order to even out the points costs. Taking two farseers and spending 50 points too much for the same stuff is lame. You should ask if he'll play with 50 points less because your codex is two editions older than his. See if he will go for that. If not, don't feel bad about playing Eldrad.

One thing I'd like to get cleared up. Is your opponent running battlewagons or trukks? They sort of look the same, especially if they've been converted, but which they are makes a big difference. Trukks are super-flimsy, and only carry tiny squads. Battlewagons are very not-flimsy, and can hold smallish sized hordes. The way that you handle these two units is very different.

As for the nobz, I agree on the seer council all of those invul saves become magically rerollable, and it's going to be a pain in the butt for anyone who relies on a small number of powerful attacks (including nob bikers) to be able to handle. And mind war. Seriously. I know that farseers have lots of great powers, but mind war is possibly the best one in the game. Pick model. Kill model. It's been diluted somewhat by precision shots and strikes and new wound allocation and deny the witch. But still... mind war.

On an unrealated note, warp spiders still have haywire grenades, right? Seems like that unit would be useful against both the trukks and the boyz inside.

letoasterfou wrote:
Well... Maybe he screwed me, but I don't remember him putting 12 orks in the trukk... :(

I haven't even thought of the mindwar. It might be great. But if I take mindwar, then I won't have doom. If I don't have doom, are the DA still useful ?
Haven't thought about the challenge either...

I wanted to buy bikes, but since new ones are coming soon, I'll save money for now. Plus, the conversion of seer bikes seems hard for me.

I want to thank you for your answers.

I'm in the middle of building a JetCouncil for my Iyanden army. I am using a couple of boxes of the High Elf Dragon Prince Cavalry from Warhammer Fantasy for the bodies/heads. Cut off the sleeves on the torsos (the have chainmail coming out under the plate around the left arm socket. You need to cut it away back to the plate shoulders), use the GJB left arm to hold the handlebars and use a right arm that you like. Currently, my JetCouncil is mostly equipped with spears, so I am using the cavalry's lances as SS, however the kit comes with 2 swords. It's not a cheap solution, but you can get 5 JetSeer riders out of 1 box if you dont mind 1-2 Swords / 3-5 Spears. Otherwise, there are other WHF cavalry models that work quite well; I just preferred the more embellished dragon features of the High Elves.

Well, and it's not like you need a giant jetlock council in order for them to be effective. There was a guy at my FLGS who used to play bikedar, and for how much he loved his seer council, he never took more than like 5 or 6 with a farseer. My guess is that they start suffering from diminishing return at larger sizes.

 Ailaros wrote:
One thing I'd like to get cleared up. Is your opponent running battlewagons or trukks? They sort of look the same, especially if they've been converted, but which they are makes a big difference. Trukks are super-flimsy, and only carry tiny squads. Battlewagons are very not-flimsy, and can hold smallish sized hordes. The way that you handle these two units is very different.

As for the nobz, I agree on the seer council all of those invul saves become magically rerollable, and it's going to be a pain in the butt for anyone who relies on a small number of powerful attacks (including nob bikers) to be able to handle. And mind war. Seriously. I know that farseers have lots of great powers, but mind war is possibly the best one in the game. Pick model. Kill model. It's been diluted somewhat by precision shots and strikes and new wound allocation and deny the witch. But still... mind war.

On an unrealated note, warp spiders still have haywire grenades, right? Seems like that unit would be useful against both the trukks and the boyz inside.

He's playing 3 trukks and 1 battlewagon. I talked to him yesterday and he told me he had 11 boys + 1 nob in each trukk...
It looked like he had more


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Ailaros wrote:
Well, and it's not like you need a giant jetlock council in order for them to be effective. There was a guy at my FLGS who used to play bikedar, and for how much he loved his seer council, he never took more than like 5 or 6 with a farseer. My guess is that they start suffering from diminishing return at larger sizes.

Well a council at 5 warlocks + 1 seer looks fragile. But at least, they can hide, no ?
WXhat do you think the unit size should be in 1000 and 1500 games ?

I'd drop the lance on the wraith lord. It's expensive, and not really necessary against Orks. Take an EML and scatter laser instead. Remember, Battlewagons have a HUGE side arc, so with some cunning deployment, you should be able to but it open pretty easy.

Another thing, are you remembering to overwatch? You may only kill 2 or 3 boys, but when you're taking down a couple boys before he gets to you, then you have higher initiative, so you get to kill a few more, he'll have way less boys attacking you back, and thus, less dead Eldar.

I'd also ditch the fire dragons. Meltaguns are all but pointless against Orks. If you have the models, maybe go with warp spiders, harlequins, or striking scorpions. All of these units specialize in putting the hurt on hordes of low save infantry, just make sure that you're engaging the boys and not the nobs with them. Harlequins can deal with nobs if you outfit them with harlequin's kisses, but it gets pricy for a whole squad.

He's playing 3 trukks and 1 battlewagon. I talked to him yesterday and he told me he had 11 boys + 1 nob in each trukk...

Well, you need to slow him down ASAP. Three Trukks can be dealt with in turn 1 although night fight could provide some trouble. Scatterlasers take Trukks down with ease.
Battlewagons are a different story. Here you would need lances if you cannot target side armor. It depends on your list if you have the speed to cause side shots. Otherwise, you could take a squad of Fire Dragons is a sacrificial move to melt down the tank in one volley.

I have one more question and then I let you go !

Those biker nobs are insensitive to pain (I don't know how it is in english), but I read everywhere that energy weapons suppress insensitive to pain. How can it be ?

I thought only instant death would suppress insensitive to pain...


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Oh. I meant "feel no pain".

:(

FnP is supressed only by weapons of double strength. In terms of Nob Bikers which are now T5 and no longer T5(4), one needs weapons of strength 10 for instant kill and negation of FnP.

Thank you !