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 Seaward wrote:
I do love all the, "He was waiting until after the election, because that's what you do when you want out," posts, though. I know every time I willingly resign from a position, I make sure to confess a sin or two I engaged in at some point in my life.

Well, it does give him a nice easy way out. No need to make political enemies, no need to answer awkward questions, just admit you cheated and as long as you aren't planning on running for office nobody will care (and Gingrich pretty well demonstrated that even if you do run for office it probably won't matter) by the time you're looking for your next job.


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 whembly wrote:
e) "you didn't build that" gaffe...

See, this is exactly the kind of thing we're talking about. It's only a "gaffe" if your only source of information and opinions is right-wing tinfoil hat sites, for everyone else it's a perfectly sensible thing to say. It's indisputable fact that even if you built your business you didn't build the roads you depend on to sell your product, the schools where you got your education, the internet that lets you easily find good employees, etc. Nobody builds in complete isolation, and it's entirely fair to point out the stupidity of people who act like they're entitled to take all of society's benefits but never contribute anything or even acknowledge the foundation other people provided for them to build on. The only "controversy" over this was that the raving nutcases on the right decided to take the quote out of context and exploit it to attack Obama and score points with people who are too lazy to bother looking at the context.

 Peregrine wrote:
Well, it does give him a nice easy way out. No need to make political enemies, no need to answer awkward questions, just admit you cheated and as long as you aren't planning on running for office nobody will care (and Gingrich pretty well demonstrated that even if you do run for office it probably won't matter) by the time you're looking for your next job.

"I'd like to spend more time with my family," also gives him a nice, easy way out, and doesn't involve confessing an affair to his spouse.

He's admitting it now because the chick's been under FBI investigation for over a year, and we're going to hear more on this. Politico's reporting that several sources have strongly hinted he was flat-out told to get out ahead of the news before it broke.

Indeed.

The line " Therefore — unless he concealed that information from his vetters, which is highly unlikely given everything we know about the man" is laughable.

Of course he would have concealed the affair from his vetters, I very much doubt they'd have given him the job if he'd admited to an ongoing adulterous affair.

If he didn't step down now and admit what he'd done then it would have all come out when he was forced to testify which would have buried any chance of anything of substance coming out of the hearings.

 reds8n wrote:
Of course he would have concealed the affair from his vetters, I very much doubt they'd have given him the job if he'd admited to an ongoing adulterous affair.

Maybe, maybe not. Screwing around isn't what it used to be.

The real issue is if this chick actually managed to regularly read the Director of Central Intelligence's e-mails. I think the scandal implications speak for themselves.

For what it's worth, I've always thought of - and still think of - Petreaus as a good dude. A bit self-involved, from what I've read about him, but the one time I (briefly) met him he seemed a genial sort.

Indeed. He does seem like quite a talented guy, and I could care less about who he sleeps with - that's between him and his wife - but letting national security get compromised is sort of a deal breaker.

We'll see if he did or not. Some of the reporting I've seen quotes anonymous sources suggesting that the FBI's unlikely to file charges, suggesting that it probably wasn't compromised, but the story was going to break sooner or later regardless.

Seaward wrote:He resigned 'cause the broad he was banging is being investigated by the FBI for accessing his email accounts. His girlfriend compromised national intelligence, essentially.

I do love all the, "He was waiting until after the election, because that's what you do when you want out," posts, though. I know every time I willingly resign from a position, I make sure to confess a sin or two I engaged in at some point in my life.

How often do you do this, exactly...?

 azazel the cat wrote:
Hey, Whembly, I found some more links that you might like:

http://www.infowars.com/

http://www.illuminati-news.com/index.html

http://www.davidicke.com/

psst: Canada ration their healthcare!


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 Ouze wrote:
Indeed. He does seem like quite a talented guy, and I could care less about who he sleeps with - that's between him and his wife - but letting national security get compromised is sort of a deal breaker.

Yup... agreed.

But, from I'm reading the FBI didn't find anything compromised. Still... he's flat-out done with the CIA.

So... I'm dailing back my paranoia on this.

Clinton pretty well proved that point about having affairs with the added knowledge that you can also lie to congress and the senate about the situation and get away with it

Makes you wonder about the cultural differences between Canada and the US. Prior to his untimely death, the previous leader of the opposition was known for his love of the working ladies, and had at least once been caught in an erotic massage parlour.

Was still one of the most beloved political figure up here, if not the most.

 Kovnik Obama wrote:
Makes you wonder about the cultural differences between Canada and the US. Prior to his untimely death, the previous leader of the opposition was known for his love of the working ladies, and had at least once been caught in an erotic massage parlour.

Was still one of the most beloved political figure up here, if not the most.

It is interesting even more since a step one way or the other can put a person in either country.

 Ouze wrote:

 whembly wrote:
The timing seems... weird...

I wonder if this is an attempt to discredit Patreaus before he testifies in Congress regarding Bengahzi?]

Someday, all the conspiracy theorists of the world will come together, and build a statue of you.

No no no. One day all the conspiracy theorists of the world will come together forming a very tiny black hole, which draws the attention of both Big Foot, and the Aliens...




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Looks like generals are a much more partyiung bunch then I had been led to believe. ANOTHER general ensnaired. YES!
http://www.cnn.com/2012/11/13/us/petraeus-allen-investigation/index.html?hpt=hp_t1

I'm disappointed that he is resigning for having an affair.

Since Clinton, its been considered grounds for firing if a man cheats on his wife. Who Petraeus has sex with is between Petraeus and his wife -- and is noone else's business.

The second reason is that it does not matter in regards to his job. Petraeus could cuddle with goats at night for all I care, so long as he does the job of running the CIA well. Especially when the CIA is the first line of defence against terrorist attacks, I want the best guy for the job.

Imagine that your going into a rough area where you might be mugged, do you want a sweet and kindly bodyguard to protect you or do you want the biggest, scariest most competent guy to do the job? Of course you want the best, and screw the fact that hes got warts on his nose-- so long as he does his job well of keeping your tail out of trouble.

Saying that Petraeus cheating on his wife makes him invalid for a government job is a logical fallacy. It's a specific type of argumentum ad hominem.
1) Unfavorable information (be it true or false, relevant or irrelevant) about person A (the target) is presented by another. (e.g., "Before you listen to my opponent, may I remind you that he has been in jail.")
2) Implicit conclusion: "Therefore, any claims made by person A cannot be relied upon".
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Poisoning_the_well

He's not resigning due to having an affair.

He's resigning due to having an affair with a woman who had at least partial access to his email accounts, who sent threatening emails to other women close to him that prompted the FBI to get involved, and who knows what else.

He banged a bunny boiler and a federal law enforcement agency was investigating her, and by extension, him. You can't run the CIA under those circumstances.

 Seaward wrote:
He's not resigning due to having an affair.

He's resigning due to having an affair with a woman who had at least partial access to his email accounts, who sent threatening emails to other women close to him that prompted the FBI to get involved, and who knows what else.

He banged a bunny boiler and a federal law enforcement agency was investigating her, and by extension, him. You can't run the CIA under those circumstances.

My conspiracy theory is that the entire Bengasi affair is being blown out of proportion by the rightwing media in an attempt to distract their viewership from the fact that the rightwing media failed to predict a darn thing correctly about the recent election and has been presenting a warped reality to its viewers.

Oh what a crazy nut I am.

 Seaward wrote:
He's resigning due to having an affair with a woman who had at least partial access to his email accounts, who sent threatening emails to other women close to him that prompted the FBI to get involved, and who knows what else.

The FBI found only a personal issue and no security issue involved, ergo no charges are going to be made. If that 'bunny boilers' was a Russian spy, it would be a different story.
http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/chi-petraeus-allen-sex-scandal-20121113,0,29930.story

 Seaward wrote:
He banged a bunny boiler and a federal law enforcement agency was investigating her, and by extension, him. You can't run the CIA under those circumstances.

Please explain how someone investigating you makes you unable to complete your job. Edit : Do you turn into a herald of Tzeentch, riding around on a disk causing chaos? No, of course not.

Whats done is done. The guy resigned. I just wish that 'banging bunny boilers' was not something people resigned over today.

This is all getting far more involved - every thread of this scandal seems to create another scandal.

Now, Petraeus has resigned, Broadwell is having her home searched, the lady (Jill Kelly) who Broadwell threatened was apparently sent inappropriate shirtless pictures by the FBI guy she originally contacted about the threats, and who is apparently obsessed with the investigation of the threats, so he's being investigated, and now another General is being investigated now for sending thousands of pages of 'potentially inappropriate' material to Jill Kelly, so he's being investigated.

Seriously, this movie should be written by the Coen Brothers, as a companion piece to Burn After Reading.

 labmouse42 wrote:
Please explain how someone investigating you makes you unable to complete your job. Edit : Do you turn into a herald of Tzeentch, riding around on a disk causing chaos? No, of course not.

Whats done is done. The guy resigned. I just wish that 'banging bunny boilers' was not something people resigned over today.

Someone investigating you doesn't make you incapable of doing your job.

Having to admit, in public, to an affair with a woman who threatened others, had access to your e-mail account, and attracted FBI investigative interest, though, does not sound like a recipe for a DCI who has the full faith and confidence of the American public. Or a partisan Congress.

 Seaward wrote:
Having to admit, in public, to an affair with a woman who threatened others, had access to your e-mail account, and attracted FBI investigative interest, though, does not sound like a recipe for a DCI who has the full faith and confidence of the American public. Or a partisan Congress.

You are correct in this statement.

Hence, my point. Its a shame that, as a society, we consider these "ad hominem" reasons as valid. Most of Congress, and the American public, do not understand the locical fallacy shown.
Seaward, were on the same team here. We both want the US to be as safe as possible and to preserve American lives.

 Seaward wrote:

 labmouse42 wrote:
Please explain how someone investigating you makes you unable to complete your job. Edit : Do you turn into a herald of Tzeentch, riding around on a disk causing chaos? No, of course not.

Whats done is done. The guy resigned. I just wish that 'banging bunny boilers' was not something people resigned over today.

Someone investigating you doesn't make you incapable of doing your job.

Having to admit, in public, to an affair with a woman who threatened others, had access to your e-mail account, and attracted FBI investigative interest, though, does not sound like a recipe for a DCI who has the full faith and confidence of the American public. Or a partisan Congress.

Exalted.

 Maddermax wrote:
This is all getting far more involved - every thread of this scandal seems to create another scandal.

Now, Petraeus has resigned, Broadwell is having her home searched, the lady (Jill Kelly) who Broadwell threatened was apparently sent inappropriate shirtless pictures by the FBI guy she originally contacted about the threats, and who is apparently obsessed with the investigation of the threats, so he's being investigated, and now another General is being investigated now for sending thousands of pages of 'potentially inappropriate' material to Jill Kelly, so he's being investigated.

Seriously, this movie should be written by the Coen Brothers, as a companion piece to Burn After Reading.

Its awesome. Its the gift that keeps on giving.
More! More!*

*No not really. Explore it fully. I'll see the headlines but not open them.

Oh hey guess what, it may involve Libya after all:

Fox News, take it for what you will.

 Seaward wrote:
Oh hey guess what, it may involve Libya after all:

Fox News, take it for what you will.

Petraeus falling on his sword for this Libya mess seems much more rational than because of appearing in a real life version of "Jersey Shore"

We will see if this is just a tin-foil hat issue or something more substantive.

Conspiracy theories ahead. Warning!

1. The whole thing is obviously political gamesmanship between the FBI and the CIA to get more funding from Congress.

FBI: "You can;t give the CIA mor emoeny, they can't even keep their bayonets in their pants!"

2. This was all orchestrated by someone in the CIA to discredit the DCI and force him to resign. The CIA is notroious at being uncooperative with DCI's they do not approve of. Having some army guy put in charge of the spooks wrankled them.

/Conspiracy Theories

While Patreaus made one of the oldest mistakes in man kind...

Let's not forget the work he has done, here's a snippet:
http://www.michaelyon-online.com/second-chances.htm#comments

Waiiiiiiit a minute, does anyone know if Petreaus did Zumba?

What Burn After Reading can teach us about the Patreus affair.

Of course someone in such a sensitive role should resign if they're found to be having an affair, particularly if they concealed it from vetting. How is this even a conversation? Having an affair makes you vulnerable to blackmail, at the very least.

 Albatross wrote:
Of course someone in such a sensitive role should resign if they're found to be having an affair, particularly if they concealed it from vetting. How is this even a conversation? Having an affair makes you vulnerable to blackmail, at the very least.

Put your "/tinfoil" on...

It's the timing that's awkward (right after the election).

So... did someone in the Administration (not necessarily Obama or Clinton) knew about this and decided to put a lid on it for fear of impacting the election?

Remember, by all accounts the FBI started the investigation in March... maybe earlier than that.

*shrugs* guess we'll find out in the next couple of weeks.