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Didn't there used to be the 25% or 50% thumbrule. I could have sworn I saw that in the 5th edition BRB.

I've never heard anyone state that conversions need to be all GW products. That seems kinda silly that it matters who makes the spear tip. If that's so important then you better test whatever adhesives they use to make sure they match the GW glue and greenstuff compositions.

But really the only things I've ever tried to go by have been WYSIWYG and the model is treated as the standard version. So if there is a slight height difference or the conversion is a bit slimmer, we play as what we could draw LOS to if the correct model was used.

50% rule was for GW events, iirc.

Like it's been said before, I say go for it - as long as you aren't just swapping out models.

You want the rules from Grey Knights, but the "look" of Chaos. Everything should be fine, as long as you do things like model your Abaddon with a suitably Chaos-styled Storm Shield, and a Storm Bolter. The Terminator squads should have the appropriate wargear to satisfy WYSIWYG. Luckily, plastic Grey Knight terminator parts should mate up perfectly with plastic Chaos Terminator bodies.

"Chaos" up your dreadnoughts, with chains and spikes.

I would gladly play against it with my Deathwing counts-as that are going to be painted as Blood Angels Terminators to represent Sergeant Lorenzo and his fellow Terminators, fresh from the Sin of Damnation campaign in Space Hulk 3e.

to the OP, doing a counts as army allows for a lot of cool creativity.

I used a terminator librarian, shaved off all the blood angel icons, attached horns to the chest, and used a fantasy banner as a cape. Then I spent several days painting him.
He is one of my favorite models, and in tournaments no one has ever said, "I dont get how thats kaldor draigo" to most people it is blatantly obvious.

I didnt give him a shield cause I didnt like how it looked. I told people his cape represents the storn shield in the same way that Vulkan's cape gives him a 3++ save. again, no one cared.

Maybe I'm lucky and never ran into an annoying opponent, but It's still one of my best models.

BTW, I also used some ushabti with wings from pegasus knights as deamon princes. again some of my best work. (now sitting on a shelf...)

Exactly. I'd like to see any written rule that specifically says that GW models must be used completely as they come out of the package, for no other use than what they were intended to be for, and in their original form.

Even the 40K rulebooks are filled with images of conversions of all types.

Models should be WYSIWYG for the entry they are being used as, and should not be able to be confused with another model in the army. That's it. An Abaddon modeled with a Storm Bolter on the forearm of the hand holding his Daemon Sword, and a Storm Shield in the other should satisfy any rule in-game once you have told your opponent and clearly indicated "This is the model I am using as Draigo".

Too far down the road the other way and you have people claiming that a Space Marine army can't be painted anything other than "Red, with codex-correct iconography" if it's going to use the Blood Angels rules, or that you can't use normal-looking Space Marine models painted as Death Company because "that's not the model kit to represent that unit".

Using imagination following the rules to get a unique army is the best part of this hobby.

washout77 wrote:There USED to be a policy that encouraged Counts As and conversions, but that was back before GW became a money hungry company. Back then, there was actually a GW published paper instructing you on how to make a Killa Kan out of an old empty soda can. Now a day's, that wouldn't go. Kinda sad really.

I have always found that GW is approving of conversion work, just as long as all the conversion parts are GW bits so they still get the money

Pretty much.
I think the rule of thumb is what 80% of the model must be original GW pieces to satisfy most tourny rules?

If we couldnt convert our models at all i think orks would disappear lol thats the sole reason they exist is because we can build the most hilarious, ridiculous, and stupid things ever and it looks awesome cuz its orky.

 Veteran Sergeant wrote:
But let's be realistic. People bitching about "Flavor of the Month Marines" are usually using arguments steeped in jealousy and the arrogant assumption that their way of playing is the right way.

Sorry, but no. There's a legitimate objection to FOTM marines. For every person who has done a ton of work converting an awesome army that happens to be useable under multiple codices there are several people with bare plastic or horribly painted marines that always count as whatever codex is best at winning at the moment. There's no effort at all to make a consistent army, as soon as something else is better for winning all of those bare plastic marines suddenly turn into the latest power list (and you're probably expected to allow them to "count as" melta into plasma, etc). If you're someone who cares about having a coherent force, especially if you don't play marines and therefore can't just move to the next power list every time a new codex is released, it gets annoying really fast.

Since when is the quality of the paintjob conferring it to what it is?

I am one of TWO people in my wargroup (about 15 people) that actually paint my guys well. The few other paints are 3paints slapped on so its "painted" - incidentally that drives me nuts when i see that lol

 labmouse42 wrote:

 Backspacehacker wrote:
Some one mentioned that you can do conversion, thats not entirely true, you can do conversions but only with other GW products, like i can convert vulkan to hold his spear a diffident way, as long as he has the spear and its a GW part its fine

Uh.....maybe if you play in GW stores in England.

Even in the UK in GW run event you don't have to use 100% parts, you just have to use mostly GW parts.

Lets take Vulcan for example (from the rules in the codex what i am about to say is game legal) you take the company champion torso and shoulder pads, a power fist with flamers bits green stuffed on in one hand, in the other have a brass rod with a plastic power sword attached and tnen have a cloak green stuffed onthe back. With this you have a model that is perfectly legal inthe game and is not the premade model.

I say lets stay away from the Flavor of the Month marines discussions, please, before it bogs this thread down with dumb arguments, too.

The point of this thread is completely different- it's about using different models than what would usually be used with a given codex (always considering that they are suitably converted to WYSIWYG) to add a unique flavor to an army that you like the rules of. NOT flavor of the month, but as a dedicated project.

For instance, in my case. I got a huge 3e Dark Eldar force given to me (as in, 3000+ points- it came with 75 warriors, and at least 7 raiders). But I decided I wanted to play Craftworld Eldar, but I will use what I can of those free models to give it a really feral, corsair feel (this was pre FW corsairs, I was going with the Rogue Trader-era style of Corsair).

So I am using the old DE warriors as Guardians (with official weapon platforms). They are completely bereft of any of the optional spiky bits. All the helms have the plumes, instead, and the rifles have had their bayonets removed. I tell my opponents that I wanted the old splinter rifles to "count as" the Eldar lasguns that Guardians used to be armed with.

I use the old 3e Reaver Jetbikes I got as counts-as Guardian Jetbikes, including two that are equipped with converted underslung 3e Splinter Cannons to represent their Shuriken Cannons.

My Shining Spears are made from the new Reaver Jetbikes, with their spears made from Dark Elf Cold One lance arms, with the lance tip replaced with a Kroot Rifle barrel tip and a bayonet to be the laser lance.

Warlocks and my Autarch on jetbikes are made from the normal Eldar jetbikes, to stand out, though even those got blades on the lower wings, and the Autarch's catapults got blades attached like bayonets.

My Swooping hawks are made entirely from the new Scourge plastics as I love their feathered look, armed with the basic Scourge carbine (Shard Carbine?) weapon to count as their lasblasters, as the look is nearly identical. I will probably convert a new model with one of the Scourge heavy weapons to be either a Hawks Talon or a Sunrifle, if I decide to add that to the unit.

Sounds awesome! I'd love to see pics!

Also reminded me that I have an entire Dark Eldar army which is using the DE rules to represent a Harlequin army, using a big pile of old RT/2nd ed-era metal Harlies.

Great Harlequin model = Archon or Succubus.
Harlequins with funky fan-nozzle flamer things = Haemonculi w/Liquifiers
Death Jesters = Trueborn
Death Jesters mounted on wires floating above the ground = Scourges
Harlequins painted in full Harlie colors w/kisses modeled = Elite Harlequins
Harlequins painted in simple two-color scheme w/regular pistols and ccw to be Mimes = Wyches
Harlequin models w/old fusion pistol & power fist = Hekatrix w/fusion pistol & agonizer
Old metal Eldar Wraithlord converted with double torso, 4 arms, and Man o War dragonskull for head = Talos or Chronos
Vyper converted with cannons and platform on the back = Venom (which was actually originally a Harlequin vehicle in the 3rd ed Citadel Journal Harlequin list)

I've also got an old Armorcast Skimmer Hawk transport resin model that will probably have Dark Lances or Disintegrators added to become a Raider at some point.

One of these days I will have to get some pics up as a thread in the P&M section. Maybe it'll even motivate me to get my butt in gear, as I've been lacking the urge to paint lately.