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I don't believe he missed that at all.

He claims that disembarking ends when the models are first placed against the vehicle hull when in fact the part where you must end within 6" shows you that your not done disembarking until the end of your move.

ted1138 wrote:
What I'm asking is, can a unit that deep strikes in via drop pod move, or does it remain in contact with the access point it came out of.

Nothing in the Deep Strike or Drop Pod rules tells you to only follow half of the Disembarking process. You disembark as normal (which means placing the model in contact with the vehicle and then moving 6") and may then not move any further.

Can someone clarify where the disembark begins from? When I disembark from my drop pod, is it up to 6 inches from the tip of the lowered access point or 6 inches from the pentagon-shaped base of the model. Thanks.

If you play the doors as hull, you can start with your base in contact with them and move from there. Otherwise, it's the little hex shaped piece.

Very few people ever play with the doors as hull as it creates too many problems (and a massive footprint that might make the pod impossible to land depending on the board/units in the game).

Marty5 wrote:
Can someone clarify where the disembark begins from? When I disembark from my drop pod, is it up to 6 inches from the tip of the lowered access point or 6 inches from the pentagon-shaped base of the model. Thanks.

I play a Drop Pod army, and let my opponent decide whether or not the doors count as the hull. (If he counts them as hull, that's as far as he has to measure for shooting, but of course I get to disembark from the tip of them.) So far, once it has been explained, no one has chosen to count the doors as part of the hull.

Thanks, those are helpful responses. Interesting that you've bumped into the same issue. It seems to me that the footprint issue could be resolved by selectively not opening some doors. For example, if I drop with one side of the pod flush against a wall, then what is to stop two doors from staying closed and the other three opening for deployment? What is your take? Maybe that doesn't work if we are talking about an enemy unit and not impassable terrain. I like that fact that measuring from the lowered hatches gives the disembarking unit more range, but it does seem that beginning the disembark from the lowered edge is a little cheesy/ not in the spirit of the rules.

Marty5 wrote:
Thanks, those are helpful responses. Interesting that you've bumped into the same issue. It seems to me that the footprint issue could be resolved by selectively not opening some doors. For example, if I drop with one side of the pod flush against a wall, then what is to stop two doors from staying closed and the other three opening for deployment? What is your take? Maybe that doesn't work if we are talking about an enemy unit and not impassable terrain. I like that fact that measuring from the lowered hatches gives the disembarking unit more range, but it does seem that beginning the disembark from the lowered edge is a little cheesy/ not in the spirit of the rules.

Opening the doors selectively would be modeling for advantage to me.

The doors don't count, any more than they would if you drop the back door on a rhino or falcon.

What "move" does the Deep Strike rules refer to when they state that; " deep striking units may not move any further"?

Steelmage99 wrote:
What "move" does the Deep Strike rules refer to when they state that; " deep striking units may not move any further"?

Any other movement.

 insaniak wrote:

Steelmage99 wrote:
What "move" does the Deep Strike rules refer to when they state that; " deep striking units may not move any further"?

Any other movement.

Such as?

I mean, what other movement than the 6" normal move you make after placing the model in base-to-base with a Pod (with the slight limitation of ending wholly within 6"), can the text refer to?



....

Steelmage99 wrote:
what other movement than the 6" normal move you make after placing the model in base-to-base with a Pod (with the slight limitation of ending wholly within 6"), can the text refer to?

What you have described is "disembarking." The unit may not "Move" after "Disembarking." It is stated this way so that you cannot disembark 6" and then move 6", netting 12" from leaving a vehicle.

Steelmage99 wrote:

 insaniak wrote:

Steelmage99 wrote:
What "move" does the Deep Strike rules refer to when they state that; " deep striking units may not move any further"?

Any other movement.

Such as?

I mean, what other movement than the 6" normal move you make after placing the model in base-to-base with a Pod (with the slight limitation of ending wholly within 6"), can the text refer to?
....

Moving in the movement phase (aside from the *up to* 6 inches but staying fully within 6" of the pod)
Running in the shooting phase
Assaulting

You cannot do any of those after disembarking from a Drop Pod.

Rorschach9 wrote:

Steelmage99 wrote:

 insaniak wrote:

Steelmage99 wrote:
What "move" does the Deep Strike rules refer to when they state that; " deep striking units may not move any further"?

Any other movement.

Such as?

I mean, what other movement than the 6" normal move you make after placing the model in base-to-base with a Pod (with the slight limitation of ending wholly within 6"), can the text refer to?
....

Moving in the movement phase (aside from the *up to* 6 inches but staying fully within 6" of the pod)
Running in the shooting phase
Assaulting

You cannot do any of those after disembarking from a Drop Pod.

Seeing as how the original question is about the deep Strike rule, you might want to re-read what you can do in the Shooting phase after DSing.

Well, the ORIGINAL question was about Drop Pod Disembarking .. but in either case, fair enough. I was making that statement without the rules at hand (and trying to remember everything gets difficult at times).

Can a unit getting out of a rhino move 6" after it's been placed 6" from the access point it got out of?

No, because they aren't placed within 6". They are placed in contact with the access point and move 6".

rigeld2 wrote:
No, because they aren't placed within 6". They are placed in contact with the access point and move 6".

But everyone here seems to be arguing that's deployment, not movement?

Yeah...even though it is described as "a normal move"....

So how do you do mishaps then? I've seen tons of bat reps were the do will scatter and just barely stay on the table. They just open the doors that will land on the table. Is that against the rules then?

The physical opening and closing of the doors of the model are completely irrelevant when it comes to the rules of the game.

Apologies if this has been answered already - I'm on the last 2 minutes of my lunch so no time to read the whole thing...

Lets say DP lands, doors open. Do you measure the 6" radius from the centre of the pod, or from the tip of the doors?

ted1138 wrote:

rigeld2 wrote:
No, because they aren't placed within 6". They are placed in contact with the access point and move 6".

But everyone here seems to be arguing that's deployment, not movement?

No, it's movement that is a part of the disembarking process.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 kitch102 wrote:
Apologies if this has been answered already - I'm on the last 2 minutes of my lunch so no time to read the whole thing...

Lets say DP lands, doors open. Do you measure the 6" radius from the centre of the pod, or from the tip of the doors?

Neither. You place the model in contact with the hull, and move from there. Having the doors up or down makes no difference to this process.

"The model can then make a normal move , difficult and dangerous terrain tests should be taken as normal, but it must end it's move wholly within 6" of the access point it disembarked from"

Rules say "can" ..... you can take your less then 6 inch move.

It negates the Deep-strike no move rule. Drop Pods, Storm Speeders, and other deep-striking transports can't move, but there disembarking passengers can, but only to fulfill the disembark rule. IF you can't do the regular disembark then the emergency one goes into effect. Its on page 79.

 Adrian Fue Fue wrote:
It negates the Deep-strike no move rule

It doesn't negate anything. The movement that is a part of disembarking is specifically allowed by the Deep Strike 'no move' rule.

So you can make a normal move when deepstriking, and you can make a normal move after dissembarking 6"?

You do not disembark 6". You disembark in contact with the access point and make a normal move, ending entirely within 6".

I am very much on the fence regarding this issue.

I think a lot of the issues spring from GW inability to use consistent language.

Bear with me here....
Let's assume for a second that the "normal move" referred to in the Disembarking rules are indeed part of the disembarkation process, and NOT the normal move allowed to be performed in a units Movement Phase.

The Deep Strike rules prevent a given units movement in the Movement Phase by way of the following wording;
"May move no further"

The normal Disembarking rules also prevents a given units movement in the Movement Phase, but they do that by way of;
"Count as having moved"

While the end-effect of those two wordings are the same they also create the illusion that due to the difference in language there must be a difference in effect.
I do not believe that to be the case, but I can see where the differences in perception might arise.

The fact that both the normal Disembarking rules and the Deep Strike rules limit additional movement tells me that GW considers the movement referred to in the Disembarkation rules completely separate from other movement normally allowed in the Movement Phase.

This, of course, still leaves the question; why did they use a different wording in the first place, and why did they insist on calling it a "normal" move, only to point out that Difficult and Dangerous Terrain applies?
We already knew this, as those are the rules that apply to a normal move. Were they simply being helpful?

Can their incompetence in rules writing be extended that far?
We know they are wording things very badly at times, so did they intend the effect to be different but botched the wording....or did they simply botch the wording because they are bad and inconsistent rules writers?

Anyway....after this rather philosophical sidestep I reiterate;
I believe the Disembarkation process (and any movement performed therein) is a completely separate movement from the movement normally performed in the Movement Phase, as without the two limitations presented in the Disembarkation and Deep Strike rules respectively a unit would be allowed to disembark fully within 6" and then perform a normal 6" (12" depending on type) move. This seems counter to previous and current design philosophy and therefore i GUESS that isn't the intended effect.


....

You're making it far more complicated than it actually is.

In 6th edition, models disembark by being placed touching the vehicle and then moving.

The deep strike rules forbid movement other than disembarking from a transport vehicle.

That's as complicated as it actually gets. You can disembark, because the deep strike rules say so. Nothing says to only follow part of the disembark process.

rigeld2 wrote:
You do not disembark 6". You disembark in contact with the access point and make a normal move, ending entirely within 6".

Right. So if you aren't allowed to move, you just disembark and stay there...


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 insaniak wrote:
You're making it far more complicated than it actually is.

In 6th edition, models disembark by being placed touching the vehicle and then moving.

The deep strike rules forbid movement other than disembarking from a transport vehicle.

That's as complicated as it actually gets. You can disembark, because the deep strike rules say so. Nothing says to only follow part of the disembark process.

So the moving part of the disembarking rule isn't movement, it's just part of disembarking. That means a model getting out of a vehicle, where it is allowed to move as normal, can move another 6" after disembarking up 6" from the vehicle?