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 Happyjew wrote:

 necronspurs2012 wrote:
they are spawned at the end of the movement phase, witchfire is generated in the shooting phase so yes they get to shoot just like disembarking from a vehicle

Where are they getting a Warp Charge from to fuel the power? They spawn at the end of the movement phase. At the start of the movement phase psykers generate Warp Charges. where were they at the start of the Movement phase?

well i play it as they get to shoot in my gw

 necronspurs2012 wrote:

 Happyjew wrote:

 necronspurs2012 wrote:
they are spawned at the end of the movement phase, witchfire is generated in the shooting phase so yes they get to shoot just like disembarking from a vehicle

Where are they getting a Warp Charge from to fuel the power? They spawn at the end of the movement phase. At the start of the movement phase psykers generate Warp Charges. where were they at the start of the Movement phase?

well i play it as they get to shoot in my gw

You should let everyone know that letting them shoot is not RAW, but a House rule of your own creation.

Just so you guys are on the same page.

 DeathReaper wrote:

 necronspurs2012 wrote:

 Happyjew wrote:

 necronspurs2012 wrote:
they are spawned at the end of the movement phase, witchfire is generated in the shooting phase so yes they get to shoot just like disembarking from a vehicle

Where are they getting a Warp Charge from to fuel the power? They spawn at the end of the movement phase. At the start of the movement phase psykers generate Warp Charges. where were they at the start of the Movement phase?

well i play it as they get to shoot in my gw

You should let everyone know that letting them shoot is not RAW, but a House rule of your own creation.

Just so you guys are on the same page.

not that im starting an arguement but a rule by a gw manager he was told someone at gw hq just saying as im following off what someone hig=ish in the compny is saying

Unless theyre from the studio, then your appeal to authority is meaningless. It isnt verifiable.

While it is a sensible compromise, it doesnt follow the actual rules that are written.

 punchdub wrote:
The GW psychic powers app generates warp charges for Pink Horrors that are added to the game mid-game. Certainly not a definitive answer, but since it has been updated multiple times and the Daemon Codex is still sans FAQ, I have taken that to be the best available evidence from GW on how they intend this to work. If nothing else, it is the most recent evidence and supports the general mindset of every TO I've talked to.

you all seem to be ignoring this chap so I'll re-quote to try to get some attention for it as this seems the most offical method of working out how things are intended to work without a FAQ

Hmm, yes, I now agree the spawned Horrors do not get to fire in the Shooting phase after they Portaglyph generates the Horrors. I do however think, because of the psyker rules (and the unit via Brotherhood counts as a psyker) that they do in fact generate a Change power upon arrival.

As far as other psykers arriving from Reserves (which I know is not what's happening with the Portaglyph), the psyker arrives and generates Warp Charges both at the beginning of the turn right? So the owning player is permitted to generate Warp Charges for a deepstriking Terminator Sorcerer, for example?

Yes, however these do not exist when Warp Charges are generated.

nosferatu1001 wrote:
Yes, however these do not exist when Warp Charges are generated.

Playing devil's advocate, since this thread is filled with all sorts of conjecture and very little actual evidence, the models do exist when warp charges are generated. You must have the models to spawn them. So, they're sitting on my side board waiting to be spawned, I could even put them in 7 groups of 6 PH each and roll for psychic powers for each group at the beginning of the game, labeling them Turn 1-7 and then when I roll d6 on a given turn bring that group in...

Just saying...

While the physical models do exist, there is no unit of Horrors with the BoS rule at that point in time. So they can't generate powers.

i play daemons myself, i always ran it if they come out they shoot, no opponent or TO of a tourney ever disputed it.

But now that i read this thread, i gotta say... The unit is not even existing until the movement phase, after the "start of the turn" has happened.. so they cant shoot the turn they come out i guess.
As for when powers are generated... /shrug.. i dont know. I would assume they generate when they are created.. but heck thats a tough one/call/argument. for either side.

 punchdub wrote:

nosferatu1001 wrote:
Yes, however these do not exist when Warp Charges are generated.

Playing devil's advocate, since this thread is filled with all sorts of conjecture and very little actual evidence, the models do exist when warp charges are generated. You must have the models to spawn them. So, they're sitting on my side board waiting to be spawned, I could even put them in 7 groups of 6 PH each and roll for psychic powers for each group at the beginning of the game, labeling them Turn 1-7 and then when I roll d6 on a given turn bring that group in...

Just saying...

The models in your collection exist, however the unit as part of the game absolutely does NOT exist.

Lord Krungharr,

Keep in mind that you do not need to be on the table to evoke a special rule, as there is no outright limitation requiring a unit be in play that I have been able to find. This is a good thing as a handful of special rules actually require you to be in reserves, off the table, before they can be evoked. Instead what limits the special rule is the fact each one has it's own criteria for when it can and can not be evoked. This criteria ranges from 'target an enemy model within range' to 'when a model with this special rule moves over an enemy model' and even right through to limitations as broad as 'while this model is alive.' It is the fact that the vast majority of special rules require an action that can only be taken by a model in play which prevents them from being used.

In relation to generation of a warp charge, this means you need to review the limitations on the special rule itself. I am not at my library, posting more and more from work then home sadly, so I can not review the exact wording of the warp charge generation process. I am highly doubtful that it has any sort of limitation that would prevent it from being evoked in reserve though, as that would make limitations such as 'can not use blessings when you come from reserve' completely pointless as no psychic power can be used without warp charges. If this is the case then it doesn't matter that the psyker is in reserves at that time, he or she still generates the warp charge.

This is, of course, very different from 'not existing' at the point which warp charges are generated, which is the problem the Portalglyph has.

In 3 years when we finally get a Daemon FAQ we'll know the intent...

The pink horrors start the turn on the other side of the portal, and the portal is part of a model in play. Would it not be safe to assume the daemons would be prepared to enter a battle, especially considering they are part of the god that thirsts and thrives upon knowledge and manipulates the universe? Besides, are they not just physical embodiment of warp energy any how?

General Duf wrote:
The pink horrors start the turn on the other side of the portal, and the portal is part of a model in play. Would it not be safe to assume the daemons would be prepared to enter a battle, especially considering they are part of the god that thirsts and thrives upon knowledge and manipulates the universe? Besides, are they not just physical embodiment of warp energy any how?

Do you have any rules to back up your fluffy explanations?

General Duf wrote:
The pink horrors start the turn on the other side of the portal, and the portal is part of a model in play. Would it not be safe to assume the daemons would be prepared to enter a battle, especially considering they are part of the god that thirsts and thrives upon knowledge and manipulates the universe? Besides, are they not just physical embodiment of warp energy any how?

Sadly no, the rule for portalglyph states. After it is placed on the roll of a 4+ "A NEW UNIT,( under your control) of d6 daemons enters play"

The key words is "A new unit".. meaning that unit was not in play or even existing until the 4+ roll is made... We Daemon players lose on this argument.