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2014/01/22 00:43:39
Subject: Re:What would the Imperium be like if the Horus Heresy never happened? ( speculatory discussion)
The Thousand Sons would be a writhing heap of tentacles (things werent going to work out for them if they stayed in the IoM or left)
Big E would still be strong and leading the IoM, leading humanity to levels of strength that would actually give the IoM a fighting chance against factions like necrons and nids.
Humanity in 40K is the story of untold trillions standing on the shoulders of a hundred heros. The HH killed or brought about the fall of many of these heros. The IoM now hardly stands a chance of survival
"We are the Red Sorcerers of Prospero, damned in the eyes of our fellows, and this is to be how our story ends, in betrayal and bloodshed. No...you may find it nobler to suffer your fate, but I will take arms against it." -Ahzek Ahriman
1250 Points of The Prodigal Sons
2014/01/22 04:59:35
Subject: Re:What would the Imperium be like if the Horus Heresy never happened? ( speculatory discussion)
You'd get 50k, it would take longer but the great crusade and the IOM was stagnating already at 31k. Arbitrary laws about technology made it so that they could only copy old designs, notice they never event anything, they just want to find relics from the dark age of technology.
I'm assuming this means an Imperium where Lorgar never takes the pilgrimage because even if Horus didn't turn Erebus makes it clear that their are other candidates.
The Thousand Sons, Blood Angels, and Space Wolves would be purged because of their gene seed defects, the World Eater and Emperor Children would at least have their primarchs killed but those who weren't too far gone do to the butchers nails or fabius's experiments might be allowed to live. Konrads situation would depend on how long it took to find these defects in the other Legions, he might well take the role as headsman of the Emperor, a loyal Lorgar might fit that role pretty well if the Emperor had just been honest with him about chaos why he distrusted religion. Horus and Guilliman would vie to control of the Legions.
So the Imperium would go through a less disastrous conflict, not even a civil war but more of an uprising, Chaos wouldn't have half the warriors that Horus gave them and would be much less of a threat. The Emperor would be confined to the golden throne, that he had built it shows that he saw his own death and if Horus didn't do it some alien would have.
Now on the other hand if Horus had one things would have been REALLY crappy for a while, but mankind would be born a new with a fresh start and would hunt down the least aliens and then become something more by joining with their own emotions in the warp, sorta like oprah but with spikes and dead people.
If you want a picture of the future, imagine a boot stamping on a human face - forever
2014/01/22 05:16:46
Subject: What would the Imperium be like if the Horus Heresy never happened? ( speculatory discussion)
I think a heresy would happen, as some of the primarchs were pretty batcraps to begin with. It would be weird to think of no second founding chapters.
Eldar may or may not still be alive, but they'd be pretty much gone: the imperium of old was far more likely to make parley with alien forms then the current one, so maybe there would be some sort of truce.
Tau dead, orks a pest, but not gone. Even if there wasn't a mass turn to heresy, there would still be chaos, especially in the eye of terror. Maybe crusades into it, instead of black crusades out?
Necrons would be an issue, but i imagine some form of finding their dormant worlds would be discovered, and most would be wiped out before awakening.
Only really leaves tyranids....and humanity might actually have a chance.
Armies
(2000pts) (2500pts) (5000pts) (6000pts) Adeptus Titanicus (1500pts)
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2014/01/22 12:01:57
Subject: What would the Imperium be like if the Horus Heresy never happened? ( speculatory discussion)
The Great Crusade would have succeeded, which would have led to a golden age of prosperity for mankind. However, wealth and comfort lead to excess and hedonism and Humanity would be going the same way as the Eldar.
Say hello to Slaanesh's brothersisterthing.
Error 404: Interesting signature not found
2014/01/22 12:17:42
Subject: Re:What would the Imperium be like if the Horus Heresy never happened? ( speculatory discussion)
The xenos would be eliminated one way or another and the emperor would try to use whatever tech he could steal from them.
The remnants of the Eldar go to commoragh or join corsair fleets and spend most of there time destroying the human webway.
Orcs are used as a terraforming tool, seeded on death worlds to destroy native predators then eradicated when the worlds are "safe" for humans to settle.
the primarchs would start to fall to the flaws in there geneseeds giving an excuse to get rid of them and there legions.
Angron is sent out to kill the blood angels and the space wolves.
The TS fight exclusevly in the webway
nightlords and alpha legion are used instead of the inqusition
the necrons are discovered and studied/eradicated with the iron hands turning into true cyborgs and vanish into the warp.
horus is regent as the emperor spends more time dabbling with "science"
lorgar continues his work out on the fringes forms the eccialasry and is horus chief advisor
a new improved space marine using techniques gained from eldar and necron tech and a bit of orc gene start to come off of the production line.
after seeing the destruction of the other legions and with supermarines turning up the Ultramarines break away from the empire, whats left of the legions join them. The supermarines totally eradicate all trace of Ultramar,the survivors flee into the warp and are turned to the various chaos gods.
horus kills the emperor while he is on the gt and covers it up with lorgars help.
emperor turns into a true god as lorgars cults rise from hiding.
nids appear and are in a stalemate in with the supermarines
lorgar orders a mass suicide to ensure the empereors place a god. Earth is consumed as a new eye opens up on the mass death of 75% of humanity.
2014/01/22 17:16:39
Subject: What would the Imperium be like if the Horus Heresy never happened? ( speculatory discussion)
People keep talking about the Imperium figuring out how to find all/most of the dormant tombworlds but if they couldn't do it during the Dark Age of Technology, what the hell makes it likely that the Imperium would be able to figure out how even in this setting?
Gods? There are no gods. Merely existences, obstacles to overcome.
"And what if I told you the Wolves tried to bring a Legion to heel once before? What if that Legion sent Russ and his dogs running, too ashamed to write down their defeat in Imperial archives?" - ADB
2014/01/22 19:34:26
Subject: Re:What would the Imperium be like if the Horus Heresy never happened? ( speculatory discussion)
I will ponder a Imperium 300 years later, under the following timeline.
The Building of an Empire
Spoiler:
1. The initial few corrupted marines are discovered and executed for corruption and disloyalty to the Imperium.
2.The great crusade continues on, however, several cracks begin to appear. The Night Lords, suffering from a breakdown in command, lose coherency. Gaining a small territory to claim for the legion centered around their home, they are effectively banished to protecting that sector. The Night Lords are reformed into a stable legion and Conrad Curze reverts to his original state of mind, sometimes leaving his territories when the visions reveal danger to the Imperium.
3. Lorgar, crushed at the loss of religion, begins to unwind with no sense of purpose. However, with the discovery of chaos exposed and how close he was to being used, he takes on new mission in the form of a legion completely devoted to routing out any who worship the ruinous powers and other heresies and executing them. The Inquisition is born. The Silver Blade of Laer is destroyed in this time by Lorgar. Fabius Bile is executed for extreme heresies at this time.
4. Already wary of the Emperor and seeing him as another tyrant, Mortarion is brought to task. Along with Perturabo, they are brought to the Emperor to be put back into line. Revealing a finished Human Webway Project, Mortarion is shown the Emperor's dream and his legion becomes an Imperial Arbites legion, roving the empire and ensuring that no system falls into tyranny. Perturabo is queried on his skills of construction, and is given the chance to create and build the Imperium in a manor suiting the Emperor. His legion is divided, with most following him into construction while his best and brightest are instead sent to serve to advise and educate the Imperial military.
5. Fulgrim's constant striving for success finally reaches its pinnacle with the solidifying of the Imperium. Fulgrim is given powers to effect efficient services in the Imperium and improving overall quality. The Administratum is reformed with him at its head while his legion act as enforcers and dignitaries.
Multiple Alternatives: Angron
Spoiler:
6a. Angron and his legion are made a first reaction force and is made on permanent crusade, to eventually be wiped out in battle.
6b. Angron and his legion, starved for war at the end of the Great Crusade, march on the Emperor. The Emperor uses his powers to obliterate Angron, and the rest of the legion is put to death.
6c. Angron is brought to task by the Emperor. He is subdued and the Butcher's Nails removed. The remaining legion also has the procedure performed on them. They are now reliable and are sent out to join forces with the Space Wolves to form the backbone of the Astartes military forces.
6d.Angron is brought to task by the Emperor. He is subdued and the Butcher's Nails removed. The remaining legion is isolated and all new recruits do not receive the butcher's nails. They are sent out to join forces with the Space Wolves to form the backbone of the Astartes military forces. Those with the nails still in place are used as shock troops.
Multiple Alternatives: Lion
Spoiler:
7a. Lion returns home and the Dark Angels are made hole again. Luther remains as second in command but eventually passes like those who also are not full space marines. Lion settles down to maintain a sector of the Imperium while keeping an eye for the emergence of new chaos forces.
7b. Lion returns home to discover that Luther has rejected the Imperium. Caliban is subsequently destroyed and Luther and all his marines are killed for being traitors. The Lion regrets the loss of his dearest friend but keeps watch in his sector for emerging chaos threats.
Multiple Alternatives: Magnus
Spoiler:
8a. Seeing the threat of chaos, the Emperor creates a force designed to combat the creatures of the warp. Using psychic powers, this force would repel the demons and keep them from emerging into the materium. This force would also be in charge of containment and ensuring that all granted with psychic powers are located, monitored, and trained for use in the Imperium. Magnus and his legion become the primary unit of this force, creating the Librarium, which also serves as the educational center and monitoring center for all space marine librariums.
8b. Magnus is discovered and chastised for sorcery. His legion is closely monitored and trained for use as Astropaths. They also are extensively trained to use the Human Webway and become an exploratory force for future human expansions.
Final Settlements
Spoiler:
9. Leman Russ is assigned as a leader of the the Astartes military against threats. Those who become Wulfen are used as shock troops.
10. Rogal Dorn and his legion are tasked with the creation of defenses and forward observation with the final settlement of the Imperium in the Great Crusade. Travelling from system to system, they build defenses to protect the Imperium while also setting up long range outposts designed to detect anything coming towards the Imperium. It would be these outposts that eventually detect the Tyranid invasion fleets.
11. Sanguinius and the Blood Angels become benevolent guardians of the Imperium. Those however, who feel the Red Thirst too strongly, are sent to fight with the Astartes Military under Leman Russ.
12. Ferrus Manus and the Iron Hands are sent to Mars. With their appreciation for humanity, the Iron Hands work with the techpriests to improve overall human life.
13. Vulkan and the Salamanders return to the Imperium at large, with the vast majority centered on Mars. Thought of as the greatest artisans in the Imperium, they work with Mars to usher in a new era of inventions and creativity under the Emperor's encouragement.
14. Corvus and the Raven Guard serve as elite troops under the Astartes Military, with Corvus serving alongside Russ as a leading tactician. Special units are assigned to the Imperial Army.
15. Roboute and the Ultramarines settle down in the expanded Ultima sector and proceed to govern it as they had before. The legion as a whole splits down into multiple divisions and dedicates itself to specific sections of the sector.
16. Horus remains one of the best tacticians in the Imperium, and remains the Warmaster of the Astartes Military.
17. Alpharius and the Alpha Legion disappear. They become secret police under the direct order of the Emperor, used to keep an eye on all threats to the Imperium.
And...that's about all I got, sorry.
"There is a cancer eating at the Imperium. With each decade it advances deeper, leaving drained, dead worlds in its wake. This horror, this abomination, has thought and purpose that functions on an unimaginable, galactic scale and all we can do is try to stop the swarms of bioengineered monsters it unleashes upon us by instinct. We have given the horror a name to salve our fears; we call it the Tyranid race, but if is aware of us at all it must know us only as Prey."
Hive Fleet Grootslang 15000+
Servants of the Void 2000+
2014/01/23 09:35:57
Subject: What would the Imperium be like if the Horus Heresy never happened? ( speculatory discussion)
Well, if the bad day never happened to cross the mind of the fluffs author, there wouldn't be a bunch of curious minds toiling away in an internet forum thread today asking what would have happened if it hadn't happened...
This has been the most trollish thing I've ever done and I feel bad, but it hit me so hard I had to throw it out there. I apologize...but not really...but GAAAH I feel bad...but it was so perfect...all paradox like and stuff...I don't know...this has been...I don't know, pointless I guess...so like...LOL?
2014/01/29 02:35:31
Subject: Re:What would the Imperium be like if the Horus Heresy never happened? ( speculatory discussion)
Wouldn't the emperor have completed the web way project? Also the emperor would probably havev the power to cripple the hive mind or the other way around. Tau wouldn't exist. Orks will always be a threat Ann's neuron threats would be dealt with much more easily
2014/02/02 21:06:08
Subject: What would the Imperium be like if the Horus Heresy never happened? ( speculatory discussion)
The God-Emperor would smite the foes of mankind!!!
or maybe theyd smite him...
I am obviously a genius. Wether good or evil, well, that all depends on what I had for breakfast.
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Arcsquad12: a Burrito is not an orgy.