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Made in ca
Fixture of Dakka




bob82ca wrote:
Yes but dude I never claimed that my way is the right way! So cool your gak. My point was that they actually publish the rules in books that people buy! I understand the point you are trying to make ......I ...get ...it.

It's just an open discussion and that was my example. Do you think that the game is balanced the way it is? Serious question no troll. And if not, what restrictions would you make to balance the game?


Yeah I agree your rules can be better and modified after been tried a few times. In fact a lot better. Do I think 40K is balanced? No. One of the reasons why I quit playing. The other reason is nobody plays anymore. Why nobody plays anymore? Probably because 40K is not balanced and costs to much to keep playing with edition changes.

First thing I would do to make 40K more balanced is cost effectiveness. Have EVERYTHING costed properly, not just be buy guess work. For example there is no way back in 5th edition 2 Spore Mines should cost the same against a Space Marine. Even now there is no reason why a Genestealer should cost about the same as a Space Marine.

So if GW wants to have over powered units, fine. But first make sure they are costed appropriately first.

Second make clear concise rules. Let there be no chance for arguing, or debating and not use the "let's roll for it, so we can keep playing". Another reason the game is unbalanced is people interpret the rules differently.

Third. If you are going to have edition changes, then make sure every army is updated at the same time. This way we don't have the Eldar and Tyranids have to pay for fleet in 4th then GW lets everyone have it for free and rules changes yet the Eldar and Tyranids have to still pay for it.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2015/01/04 22:23:46


Agies Grimm:The "Learn to play, bro" mentality is mostly just a way for someone to try to shame you by implying that their metaphorical nerd-wiener is bigger than yours. Which, ironically, I think nerds do even more vehemently than jocks.

Everything is made up and the points don't matter. 40K or Who's Line is it Anyway?

Auticus wrote: Or in summation: its ok to exploit shoddy points because those are rules and gamers exist to find rules loopholes (they are still "legal"), but if the same force can be composed without structure, it emotionally feels "wrong".  
   
Made in us
Decrepit Dakkanaut





Hyperspace

 Happyjew wrote:
Verviedi, why no Unbound?

Yes a player can make a broken army list using Unbound, but is the following (completely legal for some tournaments) any less broken?
Spoiler:

Primary detachment (CAD)

Flyrant - 2x TL-Brainleech Devourers, Egrubs, Fighter Ace (Warlord)
Flyrant - 2x TL-Brainleech Devourers, Egrubs

Lictor
Lictor
Lictor

3x Rippers - Deepstrike
3x Rippers - Deepstrike

Mawloc

Void Shield Generator - 3x Void Shields

Hive Fleet Leviathan detachment:

Flyrant - 2x TL-Brainleech Devourers, Egrubs
Flyrant - 2x TL-Brainleech Devourers, Egrubs
Flyrant - 2x TL-Brainleech Devourers, Egrubs

Malanthrope

1x Mucolid
1x Mucolid
1x Mucolid

It's not that broken. All the points are concentrated in 5 fragile models, and the list has barely any objective secured.



Peregrine - If you like the army buy it, and don't worry about what one random person on the internet thinks.
 
   
Made in gb
Prophetic Blood Angel Librarian




Verviedi wrote:
Here are the only changes I would make.

-Maximum one Riptide/Dreadknight/Wraithknight per 600 points.

-All 2+ invulnerables, cover saves, or armor saves are rerolled as 4+s.

-Invisibility cannot target the unit of the Psyker who is casting it.

-No Unbound, ever.

-No more than 3 detachments.

-Transcendent C'Tan are now 650 points base.

-Serpent Shield range is now 24".

-Markerlights reduce Cover Save by 1 per markerlight expended.





I like these suggestions apart from the idea of making invisibility even stronger. Invisibility would be fixed by making it WC3. Also knock a further6" off the serpents range and I'd be happy. 24" may as well be 60" against assault based targets. 3 detachments is a lot better than the current 2 allowed atm in most tourneys too. If I want to take a hellbrute formation for my CSM, I limit myself to 1 CAD apart from that... which sucks!


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Spoiler:
Verviedi wrote:
 Happyjew wrote:
Verviedi, why no Unbound?

Yes a player can make a broken army list using Unbound, but is the following (completely legal for some tournaments) any less broken?
[spoiler]
Primary detachment (CAD)

Flyrant - 2x TL-Brainleech Devourers, Egrubs, Fighter Ace (Warlord)
Flyrant - 2x TL-Brainleech Devourers, Egrubs

Lictor
Lictor
Lictor

3x Rippers - Deepstrike
3x Rippers - Deepstrike

Mawloc

Void Shield Generator - 3x Void Shields

Hive Fleet Leviathan detachment:

Flyrant - 2x TL-Brainleech Devourers, Egrubs
Flyrant - 2x TL-Brainleech Devourers, Egrubs
Flyrant - 2x TL-Brainleech Devourers, Egrubs

Malanthrope

1x Mucolid
1x Mucolid
1x Mucolid

It's not that broken. All the points are concentrated in 5 fragile models, and the list has barely any objective secured.


I wouldn't call tyrants with T6, 3+, 4+ jink, requiring 6's to hit all that fragile.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Don't know what happened to the quote there...

This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2015/01/04 23:07:10


 
   
Made in gb
Longtime Dakkanaut




bob82ca wrote:
Overall however 3rd edition was pretty good for balance and game design.


Not really, or have you forgotten how broken eldar were? h3 starcannon mounted on everything. Crystal targeting matrices, and holo fields, spirit stones. Saim hann in General were extremely broken. Then there was alaitoc and the broken disruption table. Or ulthwe and their broken as hell seer council. No thanks.

And it wasn't just eldar. Remember blood angels. Death co. Were extremely ott and their general rule of 'on a 1 I go faster' was ott.

There was plenty more.

Point being, looking back finding on third ed is foolish.
   
Made in gb
Prophetic Blood Angel Librarian




Hey! My BA totally weren't broken! My 26" turn1 charge by a unit which was effectively free, hit like a brick sh*thouse and had a 4+ fnp against pretty much everything was totally fair!
   
 
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