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rigeld2 wrote:

 BlackTalos wrote:
My argument is that you use only a sub-set of the DS rules, as is required by all 3 of those rules (using the word "arrive"). Correct.

That's your assumption, not what the rules actually say. None of them say "using the Arrive by Deep Strike rules". Thank you for admitting that you assume a subset because if fits your argument.

- You are required to use ALL the DS rules, which as shown, you cannot do.
. . . You counter this by saying you need to use the DS rules, and therefore you can ignore the DS requirements by using the DS rule.
So you are saying the Deep Strike Rule allow you to bypass the Deep Strike rules because you are using Deep Strike rules. Can you see the issue yet?

Yes, I see that you can't read, or are being deliberately obtuse.

It's turn 3 and I want to activate my VoD. Am I allowed to?

I have previously explained why only a subset applies. The rules would not work otherwise.
It is what the rules say:

They then immediately arrive anywhere on the board using the rules for deepstrike.

Explain "Arrive using the rules for DS". Clearly, it is "Arriving by Deep Strike"

Turn 3, you can indeed activate VoD. It uses the rules "Arriving by Deep Strike". They never enter Reserves (or any form thereof).

Of course you can use a rule. You cannot however assume thing from other rules. (Such as randomly visiting Reserves every time a rule says you move by DS)

Nevermind. I'm done - you continue to frame your responses as if your argument is inviolate.

rigeld2 wrote:
No, I'm not.
"Roll for the arrival of all Deep Striking units as specified in the rules for Reserves and then deploy them as follows:"
You don't have to roll, but the Deep Striking units are still arriving. Agreed? If they're not arriving, why are you even referencing the "Arriving by Deep Strike" section?
Where are they arriving from?

It's simple: They arrive from the board.
Deep Strike might require them to be in the reserves, but the VoD gives them permission to Deep Strike without being in Deep Strike Reserve.

That might contradict with the rule, but as you said: Basic versus Advanced.
You can just ignore the part about Deep Strike Reserve.

Now if you want to argue that they first go into Deep Strike Reserve than please cite permission to do so.

rigeld2 wrote:
Nevermind. I'm done - you continue to frame your responses as if your argument is inviolate.

Sorry if i frustrated you with this. Of course i frame responses as if the argument is inviolate as it is exactly what i read from the RaW.

It would be like arguing that the following:

"They then immediately arrive anywhere on the board using the rules for deepstrike."

Arrives immediately, and not 2 Turns later... I cannot see how else i can read "arrive using the rules for DS" mean anything but just exactly what it says: "Arriving by Deep Strike".

I would compare it to a rule stating:
"This Unit moves using the rules for Walkers" But it is Type: Heavy Tank

I am arguing that you follow the rules found in:

MOVING WALKERS
Walkers move using the movement rules for Infantry.

While you would be arguing how they must follow all the rules found in "Walkers".

In the above, the rule clearly only refers to movement and the movement phase but nothing else. I cannot see how the VoD, GoI and Skies rules can refer to anything else (reserves, starting the game - deployment) but "Arriving by deep strike."

I would go further with this and say that Skies of Fury actually only refers to "deploy them as follows" and the 3 bullet points. The rest of the rules do not apply, as SoF: "disembark using the Skies of Fury special rule" - The Unit is disembarking, which adds pretty much all the restrictions DS would have given them: cannot move + fire as having moved. It then specifies that they may not charge (as this is not in the Rules for DS that are being used). (RaW: deploy the squad as if it were deep striking onto that point.)
The above specification for SoF makes so much sense that i wonder if it was not RaI. I play Sisters of Battle so there is no conflict of interest here.

Something can't be in Deep Strike Reserves, if it's not held in reserves. a VoD unit is in play at all time, at no point is it held in reserves.