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Swarmlord and guard don't have any shooting power though. This unit can still shoot upto 4 units with 9 st6 ap3 shots at each with 3 of those (or all 9 with the right canticle) being tl. So they aren't really comparable in that regard.

I must concede that with only a 72" threat bubble, this particular unit is just waiting to be rendered useless by the movement phase alone.

 Voidwraith wrote:
I must concede that with only a 72" threat bubble, this particular unit is just waiting to be rendered useless by the movement phase alone.

Where are you getting 72? guns are 36 and if you are spreading out that much then you are not going to be able to focus anything down, cant do wound shenanigans, and are still slow and only one unit.

 Leth wrote:

 Voidwraith wrote:
I must concede that with only a 72" threat bubble, this particular unit is just waiting to be rendered useless by the movement phase alone.

Where are you getting 72? guns are 36 and if you are spreading out that much then you are not going to be able to focus anything down, cant do wound shenanigans, and are still slow and only one unit.

Take a 36" yard-stick, fix one end in place, and spin it around in a circle. Boom...the 72" threat bubble I'm speaking of. That's only taking account of 1 unmoving singular model, btw. Factor in the 6" move, the large footprint of the formation, and the split-firing nature of it's special rules, and there's a lot of targets to be had for the Cohort Cybernetica.

Unless, of course, your games take place in a train tunnel, then yeah....36" range. Now that I re-read your posts, that's gotta be it. You only play in train tunnels.

Hah, I'll let you know when I figure it out. I've been playing mainly Nova missions which like most deathstar builds struggle against MSU. Gladius has been rough in nova format so far. I've played several different versions of the list and I really struggle against it. (although I have with other lists as well). The best bet seems to try to stay in the general vicinity of multiple objectives and try to eliminate all the five man squads through a mixture of split-fire shooting and multi assaulting. It does help to have some other things in your list to help pop the transports.

While I agree with most of Leth's criticisms however I think it's worth mentioning that I've found some positives to the Robostar. It's a single source, does decently against fmcs(with the BS2 snapshots), and it doesn't rely on psychic powers to work. Also with Issodon I have absolutely no pre-game rolls, which is nice as the less dice you roll the less chance you have to screw up.

O i like the robo star and was considering running one(and still am) however I was just pointing out some of its glaring shortcomings in the current mission format.

 Orock wrote:
Its not run for the same reason I don't stick two men's and a buncha lootas in a stompa anymore. Its fun but very all your eggs in one basket. A group of necrons wraiths could tie that up all game. Hell with 3+ and 4+ reanimation you might eventually win for far far less. All a necron player would have to do is kill the vanguard to stop them dropping them to toughness 4.

The robots have have I2 power fists that are str 10. So no 4+ RP and wraiths become marines at that point.


The formation has 7 models. You are T7 with 3 2+ armor saves and a 19 wounds with a 5++ and 5+++ and IWND. I would not treat it as a killing death star but a center board control. You can shoot at 3 different targets if you want and if you take data spikes and are in base to base in CC you have 3 I10 haywire attacks from the chars.

It has flexibility a ton of wounds, and everyone has IWND with the purchase of a relic. It is a great place to put your warlord. I would hope for the EW warlord because then you can have a 2+ eat all of the hits and just LOS them away.

Dont forget the mandatory cognis relic for that sweet sweet snapfire at bs 2

I'm looking at running this too, and Leth brought up relics. So is it better with or without IWND, do you guys think?

 Tiger9gamer wrote:
I'm looking at running this too, and Leth brought up relics. So is it better with or without IWND, do you guys think?

Depends on there battlefield role. I want mine to secure center board and just hold the line. Killing something is secondary in the shooting phase. I want resiliency = IWND.

The cognis relic can be taken by the techpriest in the robot squad. Take that and IWND and have fun

A good safe place to put the Scryerskull Perspicatus. So you can give your entire Mechanicus and Skitarii force Tank Hunter against a vehicle of your choice every turn. That is insanely good if the opponent has a strong vehicle such as a LoW or Raider that needs disappearing. The only time I can see Torsion Cannons actually being more useful than the Arc Weaponary.

How is this even the slightest bit scary? Grav it, msu it, wraithstar it, fly over it, psychic shriek spam it, d-scythe serpent/wwp drop.


AP3 without ignore cover isn't sufficient with Decurions, battle company in cover, msu ravenwing with rerollable jink.

Deshkar wrote:
How is this even the slightest bit scary? Grav it, msu it, wraithstar it, fly over it, psychic shriek spam it, d-scythe serpent/wwp drop.


AP3 without ignore cover isn't sufficient with Decurions, battle company in cover, msu ravenwing with rerollable jink.

Why does everything have to be scary to be effective? Everyone knows that MSU is the hard counter to any insert your death star here. In cover it becomes even more resilient. It doesn't have to be killy to be effective. Center board control is still important.

TAC lists are difficult at best to create and almost everything will become a RPS type of list. It is about your meta and if it is effective there. Can it be effective at large events? Maybe yes, maybe no but there are other aspects to the army besides one unit.

Personally, I like robots and I wanted to add Kastallex to my 30k list as well. Now I can use it in 40k too.

Well considering it has the ability to split fire, MSU isnt that good of a counter

Yeah, this formation is actually designed to be a counter to MSU, it is a single unit(and thus efficient on per unit buffs) with the shooting ability to target many units.

I think if you keep it close to the minimum size it might be alright, but the problem is that the other part of your army has to be VERY good at filling in any holes in your list.

Breachers cover AT nicely and Destroyers cover MCs and ap2 efficiently. A few Skitarii Vanguard for horde and most bases are covered. Whether you can get ENOUGH of this into the remaining 1000 or so points is a different matter.

 NightWrench wrote:

 Orock wrote:
Its not run for the same reason I don't stick two men's and a buncha lootas in a stompa anymore. Its fun but very all your eggs in one basket. A group of necrons wraiths could tie that up all game. Hell with 3+ and 4+ reanimation you might eventually win for far far less. All a necron player would have to do is kill the vanguard to stop them dropping them to toughness 4.

The robots have have I2 power fists that are str 10. So no 4+ RP and wraiths become marines at that point.


The formation has 7 models. You are T7 with 3 2+ armor saves and a 19 wounds with a 5++ and 5+++ and IWND. I would not treat it as a killing death star but a center board control. You can shoot at 3 different targets if you want and if you take data spikes and are in base to base in CC you have 3 I10 haywire attacks from the chars.

It has flexibility a ton of wounds, and everyone has IWND with the purchase of a relic. It is a great place to put your warlord. I would hope for the EW warlord because then you can have a 2+ eat all of the hits and just LOS them away.

First, it does not have iwnd without a relic which isn't even the best for the dominus. So that brings the units already inflated point cost even higher. Second, you get either the guns or the fists not both. So if you want you could have them all do smash, but that's at I1 and one single attack now. And th e other powerfist attacks are at str 8 so no reduced reanimation on those. And if we wanna brag about how Milly something is TWO units of wraiths are cheaper and would all but wipe em in one turn.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Also wraith saves are invuln, significantly better than marine saves.

 Orock wrote:

 NightWrench wrote:

 Orock wrote:
Its not run for the same reason I don't stick two men's and a buncha lootas in a stompa anymore. Its fun but very all your eggs in one basket. A group of necrons wraiths could tie that up all game. Hell with 3+ and 4+ reanimation you might eventually win for far far less. All a necron player would have to do is kill the vanguard to stop them dropping them to toughness 4.

The robots have have I2 power fists that are str 10. So no 4+ RP and wraiths become marines at that point.


The formation has 7 models. You are T7 with 3 2+ armor saves and a 19 wounds with a 5++ and 5+++ and IWND. I would not treat it as a killing death star but a center board control. You can shoot at 3 different targets if you want and if you take data spikes and are in base to base in CC you have 3 I10 haywire attacks from the chars.

It has flexibility a ton of wounds, and everyone has IWND with the purchase of a relic. It is a great place to put your warlord. I would hope for the EW warlord because then you can have a 2+ eat all of the hits and just LOS them away.

First, it does not have iwnd without a relic which isn't even the best for the dominus. So that brings the units already inflated point cost even higher. Second, you get either the guns or the fists not both. So if you want you could have them all do smash, but that's at I1 and one single attack now. And th e other powerfist attacks are at str 8 so no reduced reanimation on those. And if we wanna brag about how Milly something is TWO units of wraiths are cheaper and would all but wipe em in one turn.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Also wraith saves are invuln, significantly better than marine saves.

Are we really supposed to complain about spending 30pts for IWND on 7 models, 4 of which have 3 T7 wounds, 3+ 5++ and FNP? Tyranids spend 30pts for 4+ regen on ONE model that almost never has an invul save....the cult mechanicus relic is a steal.

As for the rest...I just don't understand where people's blinders are coming from. The Cohort Cybernetica is a super hard to shift unit with decent long ranged shooting (that has special buffing properties) and decent hand to hand capability against most everything but CC oriented death-stars. It can kind of be whatever you need it to be (as long as you don't need it to be fast moving in any way) and WILL stick around for most of the game. If it's committed any crime, it's that it doesn't feel like it's bargain priced points-wise, but it's not really overcosted, so I guess it's greatest sin is that it's somewhat appropriately priced instead of being laughably underpriced like some of the other BS in the game (looking at you Wraithknight).

As for the wraiths (another insanely undercosted unit), please do the math and tell me how many it'd take to wipe out the Cohort Formation in one turn. Keep in mind I'd rather make my 2+ armor save handler buddies tank the wounds first (complete with their 5++ and FnP to help with the rends) so i don't lose majority T7. I'll even give you the benefit of the charge (I guess I didn't feel like giving myself any bubble-wrap against your moving tar-pit).

er they don't have to wipe you, every turn you are in combat with a wraith unit, is a win for the necrons. 800 points tied them in combat.

Wraiths keep you useless forever. For 500 points less. That is a crippling disadvantage. Equal points of wraiths would eventually chew thru that unit too. The question was why don't you hear about this death Star. The answer is because its innefecient, purely for casual fun. You won't hear about it in the way you are thinking because bottom line its too overcosted to win major events. Dark eldar can also run a monstrous creature star, the corpse thief claw. Its shooty and killey in meelee too. But it doesn't win events. Hell it doesn't even outperform equal points in vanguard. Its fun, but not the game breaking type that people are going to talk about.

12 Wraiths on the charge do 2.45 unsaved wounds after FNP. I am assuming the spider is alive for the wraiths.

48 attacks = 32.16 hits. You only wound on a 5 or 6 and on a 6 your rend.

5.46 wounds on a 5 and 5.46 wounds on a 6. After armor/inv and FNP you end up with 3.67 wounds or a dead robot. I am assuming no 2+ saves in here or LOS.

The robots have 9 str 10 ap2 hits. 6 hits, 5 wounds. This could be better based on a canticle chosen. That is only .86 wounds after a 5+ RP role. But every failed wound is a dead wraith as it is ID.

That doesn't include the 3 I10 hits from the data spikes or the the other 9ish power axe hits. That will get about another .5 wounds.

So yes a third to half of each army is engaged in a combat that will most likely go on for the remainder of the game.

 Orock wrote:
Wraiths keep you useless forever. For 500 points less. That is a crippling disadvantage. Equal points of wraiths would eventually chew thru that unit too. The question was why don't you hear about this death Star. The answer is because its innefecient, purely for casual fun. You won't hear about it in the way you are thinking because bottom line its too overcosted to win major events. Dark eldar can also run a monstrous creature star, the corpse thief claw. Its shooty and killey in meelee too. But it doesn't win events. Hell it doesn't even outperform equal points in vanguard. Its fun, but not the game breaking type that people are going to talk about.

No they really wouldnt, even with phosphors added on all the hands of the robots, the Cohort should win in melee, everyone is at least str 5 in assault, with canticles rerolling hits or increasing strength along with 3+ and 2+ armor saves and invulns.

Having actually played against Cohorts in real life, they're freaking tough and scary.

Though all of the scenarios i've read from you are silly in themselves, we can "What if" forever, nor are 100% of the Cohort's opponents Necrons.

In an actual real game, the cohort has to sit back and just with shooting, should chew through a decent amount of the Wraiths before they get into melee

The robots do not have 9 str 10 attacks for the second time. The first round they would have four, because smash would drop them to one attack each. Nobody is arming them with fists because they are too useful with the guns. And even IF you change to double your attacks, you are then giving up fnp. Are you choosing your canticle on one unit? Because odds are your using shroudplasm for the first or second time, or the reroll ones and twos for shooting? In all my games I have used reroll hits once, and the str boost once. If you are using army wife buffs that only really benefit your 800+ point unit, that just up's their cost more. But you already know this because the proof is out there. Its not a super competative death Star because it doesn't have what all the best ones have. A seriously undercoated base to work with. They are coated fairly in a world of wraithknights and wolfstars and grav cents.

Why would you smash with them? They're str 6 without it. Unless you're fishing for instant death

Again still a dumb argument, its assuming the wraiths arent going to get shot on their way into assault, are you assuming they're just going to start out in assault with the cohort and sucks for them?

Yes it has a counter, so does everything? Why bother playing if you're just going to bitch about hypothetical counters since everything has stupid hypothetical counters

The Kastelan Battle Protocol is what gives FNP ir double attacks in shooting or melee. Canticles are the army wide bonus that give a different bonus. The formation allows yhe protocol to start at the end of the turn you choose it as well.


I am not planning to arm mine with the second phosphor blaster. That is why they get 3 attacks per bot. I plan to play test both options but I don't need mine to be uber shooting in the list I am going for. I need them to hold center board and be annoying.

I expect someone will tell me that I am wrong for not equipping them with the second gun.

Punchy is fine, they're just a little stronger shooty is all

also no reason you cant mix and match within the unit. Some people have all shooty, others just have the upper gun, so on and so forth

If you want to use the fists its fine. You will find though with their incredible lack of speed the extra shots are the way to go. And you have smash if you really need to hit hard. 800 points for essentially 4 carnifex with less shooting than one unit of cents, especially considering their natural bs of three, that may never get into meaningful combat all game is a big handicap to overce though.

And yes, wraiths would get the charge being beasts and ignoring terrain. The necrons player would have to be horrible for it to go the other way, and in that case you are already winning.