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 Capamaru wrote:

 jeffersonian000 wrote:

 Capamaru wrote:

 jeffersonian000 wrote:
GK are all about mobility, with easy access to Deep Strike, Jump, Shunt, and Gate. If you are finding your GK to lack mobility, you are playing them wrong.

SJ

Well only DK and interceptors can reliably move fast around the board. All the others rely on Deep Strike or Gate which is also Deep Strike and Deep Strike always carries a danger of mishap.

Seriously I have tried all the things you have said but I find GK to straggle against all but the weakest lists. They are Ork tier army and they really could use a buff. Last time they were reigning supreme on 5th edition there wheren't Grav and D weaponry through out the other armies.

Now DK and termies die much faster and much easier.

Sorry to hear that they aren't performing for you. I tend to play on tables with tall line sight blocking terrain, and I tend to favor Maelstrom. With jump/Shunt incinerators and deep striking Psycannons, there is huge mobility that gets the right unit to the right spot. Gate lets you reposition. Sanctic lets you fish for force multipliers like Vortix, Cleansing Flame, and Sanctuary. Everything has a power weapon and can either boost Strength and/or ID. Its like always having the right tool for the job.

SJ

Seriously don't you struggle against horde or top tier armies (like Eldar or Tau)? What do you do against vehicle heavy lists? There isn't enough anti tank in GK codex right now since psybolt dreads are gone.

I play the mission. The mission is all that matters for a win. Wasting time trying to table an opponent is probably where your trouble starts.

SJ

Yer dodging the question...

And the answer is simple. You can't handle vehicle heavy armies, they will generally bully you by acting as screens for their shooting units.

Also aginst Eldar and Tau you have to hope they simply aren't taking a competitive list. GK is an army that was supposed to be able to win battles through superior quality tactical options. We no longer have any of those tactical options, we have Dreadknights, take four.

And no, we do not have enough bodies to play the mission.

 Quickjager wrote:
Yer dodging the question...

And the answer is simple. You can't handle vehicle heavy armies, they will generally bully you by acting as screens for their shooting units.

Also aginst Eldar and Tau you have to hope they simply aren't taking a competitive list. GK is an army that was supposed to be able to win battles through superior quality tactical options. We no longer have any of those tactical options, we have Dreadknights, take four.

And no, we do not have enough bodies to play the mission.

My thoughts exactly. I have two dreadknights so I need another two.

 Quickjager wrote:
Yer dodging the question...

And the answer is simple. You can't handle vehicle heavy armies, they will generally bully you by acting as screens for their shooting units.

Also aginst Eldar and Tau you have to hope they simply aren't taking a competitive list. GK is an army that was supposed to be able to win battles through superior quality tactical options. We no longer have any of those tactical options, we have Dreadknights, take four.

And no, we do not have enough bodies to play the mission.

No dodging at all, I don't fixate on tabling my opponent to win. I kill off soft targets first, those with saves of 4+ or worse. Incinerators and Psycannons are awesome for this. Harder targets get kited until they are soft enough to kill in melee. Psilencers are great versus armies like the Tau or Tyranids. Dark Eldar are weak to Incinerators. Eldar are easy to pin given the 24" range on GK assault weapons. Hidden Hammers are for finishing off vehicles or other tough targets on their last wound. Focus down enemy units when you can, bleed them when you can't. Hug line of sight blocking terrain. Drop a Vortex every turn if you can. Reserve mobility for grabbing objectives in Maelstrom, or for cornering a fast opponent such as jet bikes. I don't get hung up on winning, my focus is on playing smart. Its rarely more than a single model or point that changes a loss to draw, or a draw to a win.

SJ

I agree with you on most of that; if it has a 4+ armor save kill it. The less models they have tossing firepower at our mid-range army the better.

I mostly disagree with you on psychic powers. Santic is old and busted compared to the new powers. Especially the one discipline that lets you reduce ANY enemy invul save or reroll saves. Then if you're looking for speed the electromancy is the best bet for enabling assault and shooting maneuvering.

It's just once you're past T2 you generally already know how the game is going to go. Most of you're units have DS hopefully, DK may have popped their shunt to kill or threaten key units, and Interceptors have hopefully flamed supporting elements. At that point it comes down to psychic powers pulling us through the rest of the game and santic just can't do it. Since DK remain literally our most mobile and threatening unit they are the make or break point for us in those later turns.

The difference between focusing on Sanctic and going for the new powers is that I can plan on having 5-6 out 7 of the Sanctic powers, versus 3-4 out of 7 of any one of the new disciplines. Being able to rely on what I will have each game is huge, even if the new powers appear to be better. Vortex is still a D-weapon, Cleansing Flame still hits flyers and through walls, Gate is still super mobile, Sancturay still improves my invuls, and Purge Soul is still a precision attack. Sure, surfing terrain can be fun, and swapping units is a hoot, but Sanctic is designed for GK to be their specific force multiplier ... and it works!

SJ